Adopting a Sav

[TrpnBils]

Update

welllll, I just got off the phone with my aunt, and here's the rundown:

I'm going to meet her tomorrow night after I'm done with class to pick the lizard up. I should be getting back here around 10:30 or 11:00 so I'll have a more thorough update for you then on the health, etc.

And I realize I'm probably the last person here that should be making any kind of judgment on the matter, but it sure sounds like a Sav to me. I've been looking at pictures of savs and ackies and the one big difference that would be easy to describe over the phone was the head of the animal. I asked her if it had a dark "mask" stripe running through its eye (like a lot of the pictures of ackies I've seen) and she said no. She also said it didn't have a dark tail. So I guess we'll see.

And it looks like dehydration is going to be an issue like I figured it would be. When she was looking at the head, the lizard was asleep so she tapped on the glass and woke it up. Then she made some kind of comment about "oh wow, he doesn't even have any water in the bowl for it" and got some. She said that he (she? damn I wish I could tell the difference..lol) went right over to the dish after she filled it up.

Anyway, I'll get pictures, etc, up here tomorrow night as soon as I get back. Thanks!

Jeff

 

[TrpnBils]

Well I got the little guy tonight, and he's definately little. Maybe 14" with his tail straightened out, and I was able to confirm today that he's close to 2 years old. There's also no doubt in my mind now that he is a savannah, I'll get pictures up tomorrow sometime.

My aunt said that he ate regularly up until a month or so ago (don't know how often he was fed though). The reason he stopped eating was because my cousin stopped feeding him, so it's not like he's refusing food as far as I know. There were no thermometers in the tank when I got it, so my cousin was apparently guessing. He had a 100 watt heat lamp (white) as the heat source, but I was told that he left it on 24/7, so this guy hasn't been getting any kind of day/night cycle except for the darkness he could get in his hide, which wasn't much.

Basically he seems alert, and he's in the middle of a shed right now. I have a few questions:

1) Since he's this small, assuming everything else is normal, do you think his growth will be stunted permanently?

2) Since he was supposedly eating fine up until a month ago, could there be some kind of genetic reason or other birth defect that causes him to be this small?


Thanks

 

[TrpnBils]

I should probably also mention that I found out he went through more than the 5 uromastyx I knew about. In the past two years he's bought this savannah, the 5 uromastyx, 2 other savannahs, 1 leopard gecko, a brown basilisk, a bearded dragon, and some kind of tegu.

All of them have died except for the leo and this savannah, so I can only assume that most, if not all of the problems with this one's growth are related to poor husbandry.

 

[Karen Hulvey]

I'm aware of the size requirements and possible damage (to me and my belongings) by the claws and all that.

The only thing I can add to the excellent advice that you've already been given is this; You can minimize the scratches, etc. from the claws simply by taking nail clippers and trimming his nails. I've done it with tons of savannah monitors and iguanas of all sizes.

 

[TrpnBils]

oh and one iguana (it died from a mite infestation, I don't know about the others though). This all coincided with his big "I'm going to open a pet store when I get out of high school" kick.

That didn't happen.

 

[TrpnBils]

The only thing I can add to the excellent advice that you've already been given is this; You can minimize the scratches, etc. from the claws simply by taking nail clippers and trimming his nails. I've done it with tons of savannah monitors and iguanas of all sizes.

That will only be about half the problem as it would normally be as I've noticed he's missing about half of his claws. They're all healed over though and look fine otherwise so scratches are the least of my worries at this point.

 

[Jim O]

Since he's this small, assuming everything else is normal, do you think his growth will be stunted permanently?

Maybe. I doubt that you will know for a year or so. I think most reptiles in the wild probably grow quite a bit more slowly that captive ones because food availability may be sporadic.

Since he was supposedly eating fine up until a month ago, could there be some kind of genetic reason or other birth defect that causes him to be this small?

Possibly but more likely it is the result of the husbandry as you said. Monitors need heat to metabolize their food. I use a 150 watt red bulb about 8-10 inches from the highest available perch (with a screen guard on it!) and that gives me about 110°-115° by my temp gun. I notice that they do tend to bask there after eating, especially when they get mice. If s/he wasn't getting enough heat it is likely that what little food was given was not optimally digested.

Make certain that you dust the insects at least every other day with calcium and weekly with vitamins.

 

[hhmoore]

The 100w bulb on a 20 long, sounds about right, depending on the ambient room temperature. As I previously mentioned, I used 100w ceramic heaters on 20 longs (in a 75 degree room) and the temps were right where I wanted them. If you can substitute the light for a red or ceramic, it will allow for day/night cycling without affecting the temps. Monitors can certainly tolerate a nighttime drop, but when acclimating new animals I prefer to keep them as consistent as possible.
As for the possibility of its growth being stunted - like Jim said, it's possible but you won't know for awhile. Frequently, they will rebound and just resume normal growth once the necessary conditions are met.
Good luck with it. I'll be looking forward to updates on its progress

 

[TrpnBils]

I'm on my lunch break and almost out of time, so I'll make this quick. Here are a couple of pictures from last night. I'm going to get a fecal done ASAP too. He went to the bathroom overnight and it looked normal, but considering he hasn't eaten in weeks, it sort of made me wonder what it was that he was passing. When I came home for lunch this afternoon, he had gone again and there was definately blood in it. I changed the newspaper and gave him the crickets I got yesterday. He's just now finishing off the last of the 3 dozen I put in with him, and I'm planning on getting him some more food after work today.

By the way, I talked to the other reptile guy at work this morning and he said that I might be able to tell if his growth will be stunted based on how the head looks. He said that all of the lizards he's seen with stunted growth (due to poor husbandry) had very noticeable deformaties in the head, making it look "dwarfish" in his words. Can you tell based on these pictures?

 

[Jim O]

That snout may be a bit on the short side though again, time will tell. The fact that s/he's eating is a good sign though. Also, that animal looks to be a bit bigger than 12 inches in total length. How wide are those pages?

 

[DAND]

It looks pretty good. The belly doesn't look thin and the tail looks like it could hold more but it looks well enough. The head does look a little stubbed/stout. Are the fingers and toes okay?

 

[hhmoore]

I agree that the snout looks a bit short, esp in the second pic, but there is typically some structural change as they grow anyway...time will tell. From the photo, (and assuming it is in a 20 long) I would say it is probably around 16-17 inches...definitely small for its age. the body characteristics are interesting, though. You say this was taken last night, and you fed it today - but the belly looks nice and round. 2 guesses: 1) it drank a whole lot of water since your aunt said she was going to put some in, and/or 2) a belly full of worms. Overall, it isn't as thin as one would expect, given the story - my feeling is that the temps were probably low enough that it didn't need to burn all its fat stores (or it was better fed than you thought). Take a look at the base of the tail, the upper part of the legs, and where the legs meet the body (esp the front), though. To me it just looks a little light in those areas. could be the pic, could be me looking too hard. In any event, the little fella definitely looks like he will do well with the proper care...enjoy him!

 

[TrpnBils]

It looks pretty good. The belly doesn't look thin and the tail looks like it could hold more but it looks well enough. The head does look a little stubbed/stout. Are the fingers and toes okay?

Hi there, I didn't know you ever ventured over this forum...

Probably a third to a half of the claws are missing, but the toes are healed over fine and it doesn't look like it presents much of a problem. Also, the tail is a little funky at about the last half inch or so. It looks like it was broken off at some point, but it's grown back pretty well, and again, I don't think it'll be a problem.

-----------

As far as the worms go, if that's what it is, we'll find out soon enough. The vet the the zoo uses will be back in her office on Sunday so I'm going to give her a call and get a fecal done. The temps were a problem before I got him too like you mentioned. My cousin left the light on all night long because his bedroom was in the basement and it got cold in there (from what his mom told me anyway). He didn't have any thermometers in the tank, so I'm sure he was just guessing anyway.

 

[TrpnBils]

Also, that animal looks to be a bit bigger than 12 inches in total length. How wide are those pages?

The pages are 12.5" wide. He's at most 14" long, I'll get a picture next to a ruler or something later on tonight once he wakes up.

 

[DAND]

Hi there, I didn't know you ever ventured over this forum...

Yeah, I've made a few posts here.

Sounds like it's in a much better place. Hopefully worms aren't going to be a concern but find out either way and go from there. The nails missing aren't too big of a deal. Less to scratch with you with.

 

[TrpnBils]

Ah, I forgot to mention, he took a rat pinkie after work today. It was pre-killed and he didn't seem interested at first, but after I teased him with it for a couple of seconds he grabbed it and took it right down

 

[TripleMoonsExotic]

Here's a close up picture of my 5 month old Savannah...Notice the longer snout?

Your poor little guy definitly has a bit of a deformity. Whether it's from poor breeding or being confined to a small enclosure, I don't know...

 

[TrpnBils]

So what's that mean as far as groth potential - just delayed or not happening?

 

[hhmoore]

any answer at this time would be mainly guesswork...only time and food will tell

 

[TrpnBils]

Well, okay... the results from the fecal came back negative. However, he's still not right. Every time he goes to the bathroom, he drags his vent across the newspaper and leaves a small trail of blood. Any ideas?