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Bad Guy Al Brown-Browns Boas-Nightmare Transaction

I've been zapped buy 120v many times and I'm here to tell you that its more startling then actually harmful.

But hey, go for the law suit...everyone else does. :rolleyes:
 
You guys are all wrapped up with the law suit aspect. Pat just wanted you all to see what kind of business man Mr brown is. And hopes that after brown sees this that he may rectify what Brussels done
 
To the people that have commented on the use of "old" heat tape - what is the shelf life of that product? The original comment stated that the tape was several years old, sitting in a roll in his house...no implication of previous use (IMO, meaning it is for all practical purposes - new).
 
hhmoore said:
To the people that have commented on the use of "old" heat tape - what is the shelf life of that product? The original comment stated that the tape was several years old, sitting in a roll in his house...no implication of previous use (IMO, meaning it is for all practical purposes - new).
Click to expand...

I am not sure there is going to be a definitive answer to this question, to be honest. When my brother was plumbing he advised clients to replace their tape every 10 years. Keep in mind this is tape used as designed, only turning on for short periods of time to keep pipes from freezing. Used more or less constantly the life span may be less, or it may be longer. I have had one cage I made back in '96 that has the original tape, still works. I wonder if the on/off hot/cold cycle fatigues the materials faster than steady load does?

In my experience when tape fails it just stops working, it doesn't pose a hazard, others may have a different experience.

In my opinion the amount of time tape sits on a shelf does not affect its shelf life, there is no degrading of materials unless the product was exposed to conditions that could degrade it, chemicals, extreme temperature fluctuations, etc.

In this case, going by the descriptions, it sounds like the tape was simply not installed properly, and if it shorts out or breaks I would look to that cause rather than how old it is.

Personally I started to move away from heat tape some time ago, I just don't like it as much as I do other materials.:shrug01:
 
That was basically my point - a roll of heat tape doesn't "go bad" sitting on a shelf for a few years (in normal situations).
 
I have been in the pet trade literally my entire life. I have seen heat tapefail and melt breeding racks and start fires.

And yes sitting on a self rolled up can effect the life of the tape. Some retailers will throw tape away if it is not sold by a certain point.
 
Well, then, what IS the shelf life of a roll of heat tape? (not the functional life - we're talking about unused heat tape) At what point is it no good?
Who are some of these retailers that throw away unsold heat tape, I'd like to contact them for information on this?
 
Anybody have a package they haven't opened yet? is there a manufactured date on it? Maybe in my travels today I will stop by a Home Depot and check it out.

AFAIK there is no "shelf life". It is just plastic coated wires, nothing to go bad or deteriorate until it is put to use.

Any product can be bad off the shelf from manufacturer's defect, and something like heat tape may experience that failure pretty often comparable to other products. Car tires can dry rot on the shelf, for example, but heat tape does not have any components that do something similar, at least as far as I know...
 
So you're saying that many retailers throw away heat tape that sits around too long; but you are unable/unwilling to state how long that is, or identify any of them so I can ask them myself? If it's such a common practice, why should I have to attend an expo to get information?
 
Drew Zaun said:
Anybody have a package they haven't opened yet? is there a manufactured date on it? Maybe in my travels today I will stop by a Home Depot and check it out.

AFAIK there is no "shelf life". It is just plastic coated wires, nothing to go bad or deteriorate until it is put to use.

Any product can be bad off the shelf from manufacturer's defect, and something like heat tape may experience that failure pretty often comparable to other products. Car tires can dry rot on the shelf, for example, but heat tape does not have any components that do something similar, at least as far as I know...
Click to expand...

I have remnants of a roll, I'll check for info when I go to my other house this afternoon. While this line of discussion does seem somewhat offtopic, the reason I brought it up was because negative comments were made about using "old" (not used) heat tape that was sitting on a shelf. While the nature of the first few posts by Mr Moyer sort of set this up, I'm willing to look for some validity in his statements.
 
Harald,

I would go to a plumbing supply store or a hardware store before going to a reptile expo. Talk to the people who are most familiar with it. I think I am going to drop by the HD today and see what I see with the products they sell, unless someone beats me to it.
 
It's not that there is a shelf life persay but don't expect it to work 100% and when dealing with electricity I want it to work 110% properly. End of story. This thread isn't about the shelf life of tape it is about brown wiring it wrong

Back to Mr brown his rack and ethics.
 
Sorry, but I don't need to be redirected....I considered the relevance to this thread/topic before I started. You implied that there was something wrong with using an older roll of heat tape. I've sent emails to The Bean Farm and Calorique. If THEY say it goes bad sitting on a shelf, I'll believe them...
So, tell me again why you are so involved in this, as opposed to the OP?
 
"Nail him to the wall", "I'd take his business", Good lord people... He didnt murder the guys kids. He built a crappy rack. And so he owes him a full refund. And if he doesnt pay for that then sue him for the cost of the rack + repairs. But thats it, he doesnt owe you "his business"(not that you, the OP, said that).

Im really surprised by the reaction from some of you. From other threads I've always thought you guys were reasonable people. If you really think getting a little shock means your now the proud new owner of someone elses livelihood than your completely unreasonable (at least in this scenario).

Crappy workmanship, yes. Horrible customer service, absolutely. But a little shock (even several little shocks) and some rust doesnt constitute stringing him up...
 
Because everything the op has stated i have seen with my own eyes. To see the panels malfuntion, to see the heat tape wired wrong, to see it cut wrong, to feel the shock (which again it didn't kill anyone but still freakn hurt) and now to see the rust. This thread is about brown and his ethics. After all that Gf happened.
 
SPJ said:
Don't make idiotic statements. :rolleyes:
The wiring was a hazard on the rack. He used subpar material (old flex watt) and cut corners (no insulation, no soldering the connections) and cut into the live part of the flex watt that carries the current.
He is liable. It's just pure luck that it was only a shock and not something even worse.
I can't see how anyone can justify this shoddy workmanship and excuses as to why it's not Browns fault.
Anyone who makes jokes about this situation or defends the seller needs to re-examine themselves.
Click to expand...

Come on, I get it, I was just trying to get everyone to stop for one second and actually think about what people are saying here... does anyone really, I mean REALLY think that suing someone for "Everything" is going to pan out when the amount in dispute is $1200? Does anyone think that a person that runs a slipshod business like this even HAS $1200 or more laying around to pay out?

I was just trying to make a humorous comment on everyone jumping on the Sue Train... this is a hack job working out of his basement, this isn't some legitimate business you're going to win an "injury suit" from. I mean, if he has the money, time, and thinks it will pan out for him, he should absolutely pursue it, but over $1200 and a few shocks that have proven non-life-threatening and non-injurious? I think it's silly hyperbole, and that realistic solutions such as bringing pressure to bear on the seller as the BOI usually does so well are FAR more helpful/useful/likelytoresultinpotentialrestitution.

Didn't mean to pee in your Cheerios.
 
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