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Allen Belcher / Big Daddy's Wholesale ... WARNING

gezzz man, this is getting worse every time I read it, mistreated and neglected animals, now feeders with steriods, it makes you shudder to think what might be going into your own animals...

Whats crazy is that some of those animals are high end morphs, I near died when I saw a piebald BP in there... holy.... I mean, even a Anole really dosen't deserve that treatment, but come on, at least protect the investment buddy... yesh...

I hope he is put out of business over this, or at the very least, this forces him to re-examine his animal treatment and they get a little better deal

Nice expose... well done
 
Wow!! Thanks for the heads up Byron!!!! Pictures speal a thousand words don't they...
 
That is unbelievable. I hope that you can call animal control on this whack job. That is just sickening!
 
Wow, I know you were pretty hyped about this job a couple of weeks ago. Sorry it turned into such a nightmare. I bought a gold dust day gecko from "Big Daddy's" at the Atlanta show...it didn't survive the quarentine. After seeing how those animals are kept I am glad I didn't just stick it in with my females, it might have wiped out several of my females. It is very disappointing to see someone keeping their animals in such an inhumane way. I also know that everyone appreciates the "heads up warning" on these guys! Thanks for the insight.
 
Shocking to say the very least.

Bryon

Is Allen a member here and does he have knowledge of this thread? Not that I ecpect him to attempt a defense but it would be interesting to hear some response.
 
Bryon,
I do not know either you or Allen, and don't believe that I have ever done business with either of you as well. From what you have posted here, it seems pretty clear that Allen's operation needs improvement, and that it would be wise to exercise caution when buying from him. I am deliberately understating what most would see as obvious conclusions, but want to play devil's advocate with you. I do not mean to question your integrity, but just to invoke some needed caution into your situation.
The pictures that you took, I assume were taken while you were an employee, likely "on the clock". Unless you had the permission of the owner, you may have placed yourself in some legal jeopardy. If you have not already done so, and as recommended by others, I would contact whatever local and state authorities that may have jurisdiction here, and see if you have in fact documented a statute violation, etc., and what the "whistle-blower" laws are, and if they afford you any protection. I might also spend $50 for 15 minutes with an attorney, and explain all, to include this thread. There is the potential for many legalities here, to include ownership of the pictures.
Again, I have no reason to not believe you. But it could be claimed that you were an employee for six weeks, and may have been a part of the problem, not necessarily a part of the solution. An argument could be made that you were taking the pictures so as to harm Allen's reputation, and therefor had motivation to stage some of them, or at least allow them to become photo opportunities that would serve your purpose. I could go on for pages here, but I only ask you to consider what an attorney representing Allen would say or ask in a deposition of you. You won't get one benefit of the doubt. It is possible that a more subtle approach to this thread would have been the wiser approach until you had legal advice. If you had it, and are in the clear, my humblest apologies.
I have probably written more than enough to make myself a target in this thread. For the record, should the photos and statements by Bryon be 100% accurate, it is a pitiful thing.
 
I was off-put by them at the Columbia show. Good size, sub adult veiled chameleons caught my eye. I was (and still am ) lookign for some sub adult females. I took a close look at them - every one had several missibg claws, torn right out, and had several bad sheds. There is no excuse for htis in a CB animal.

I inquired about a small, obviously gravid female chameleon in his cage. It did not look familiar to me. One guy replied that it was a "horned" chameleons (though it had no horns, just a small rostral bump), and the owner told me it was a "jackson".

I said, "oh, ok..." and left.

If he was going to lie about an animal to me, he'd lie about it to anyone. I hate that about as much as seeing poorly treated animals. when a vendor lies to an inexperienced buyer, he's esentially sentancing the animal to death.
 
I know one thing for sure, if I bought a 50% het ball python at the Columbia, SC and the Birmingham, AL shows. I would be emailing him for a refund!! Bryon stated he sold normals and he admitted it in his email!! This man can't be trusted!!
 
I'm almost speechless.

ANYONE who keeps animals of any kind in that filth and suffering should never have gotten in the animal business in the first place. And someone needs to escort him out of it.

Bryon, thank you so much for bringing this to light....you have no doubt kept some people from purchsing these doomed animals from him, and hopefully through this posting these animals can also be helped.

A person has to wonder.......why does someone who carse this little about animals even get involved with them in the first place? Greed, yes......but jeez, it seems there has to be some other kind of scam he get into that doesn't involve torture defenseless animals. Because living like they are is just that... TORTURE. It makes me ILL. As for him coming here to "defend himself", I'm sure he knows that would be pointless, there is NO excuse or defense for having conditions like that. NONE.
 
Man, this guy sure has it out for Allen. :uzi: :uzi: :uzi: If I was Allen I would be considering talking to a lawyer and seeing what can be done about someone taking pictures without his permission. With all that aside I would also like to state that if Bryon had the time to take the photo's he damn sure should have had time to do his JOB that he was hired for...TO CLEAN REPTILE CAGES.... don't seem to be working to hard to me except on getting revenge on Allen for something :toiletcla . Anyone here should know what a WHOLESALE REPTILE Business is, You mostly deal with Imported reptiles at wholesale prices so that could be the reason for dead frog, That is the main reason I don't do frogs, plain and simple the die. But that is besides the point. I think Bryon :uzi: :uzi: :uzi: just wants to HURT :hot: Allens business.
Just my 2 cents :toiletcla
Thanks David
 
snakebstr said:
With all that aside I would also like to state that if Bryon had the time to take the photo's he damn sure should have had time to do his JOB that he was hired for...TO CLEAN REPTILE CAGES....
Click to expand...

All I have to say to that is then the boss should have had him cleaning instead of laying sewer pipe and everything else he was doing.

snakebstr said:
Anyone here should know what a WHOLESALE REPTILE Business is,
Click to expand...

Anyone who does a wholesale business should know what quarantine is!!!!!!!

I think you know Allen and are just here to throw doubt on Bryon. I don't think its a coincidence that you from AL!!

Another question, if Bryon was such a bad employee and didn't do his job, why would Allen want him back?

If I owned a wholesale company and my cages needed to be cleaned, I guarantee my employee wouldn't be out laying sewer pipe!!

Are you trying to say Allen doesn't know what the conditions are in his wholesale facility?!?!?!?! Get Real!!!!
 
Come on man.....you have got to be kidding...I own a reptile business.. I wholesale, retail and internet out of the same location..there are quarantine rules and overall morals you stand by when you do business...this guy obviously doesn't go by the same rules and morals as most in this business.
I WOULD EXPECT an employee to do the same as Bryon did here if my place looked at all like this...
There is no excuse for this, even if they come on to defend themselves, THERE IS NO EXCUSE!
TOM
 
I too am outraged by the disgusting manner in which he keeps his animals.....those are some ball morphs that I would give my right arm to own!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I have to agree with Jim though, please be careful legally wise by what you do and say, it would be very easy for Allen to counter on you and clean up his place and say that you were slandering him and possibly press for a lawsuit. I too have worked for a pet store in which the animals were left in poor conditons (although not as bad as Big Daddy's Wholesale) and after two months of cleaning up animal cages day after day for the same pay of someone else (including the owner) while they sat on their fanny made me quickly decide that although the animals needed help, it wasnt just my problem. I began to worry about bringing a disease home on accident via my dirty clothes or shoes to my own animals, and I hightailed it outta there. (One so called breeder room had not been cleaned in MONTHS when I arrived. I found magggots as well as a hamster eating another that had been left to rot in the cage.) The last I heard a friend of mine went in there and turned around and walked out the smell was so bad. If anything comes out of this thread, hopefully Allen will wise up and learn that he has ALOT to loose by treating his animals that way. :(
 
As I said earlier, I cannot condone the way that things appear.

The standards, or apparent lack thereof, are not acceptable from an ethical standpoint in any situation. All due respect to Bryon, I don't want to take his account verbatim, ie "that he was directed to lay pipe instead of clean cages". I do not know that it was that simple. Allen could come here and post, but my guess is that he is first going to pursue this at a higher level, if one is available to him.
Maybe just for the sake of argument Tom, I looked at this opinion which you stated:
I WOULD EXPECT an employee to do the same as Bryon did here if my place looked at all like this...
Click to expand...
Maybe so, but Bryon was there for six weeks, so should his indignation at the situation have moved him to action sooner if things are as we have been told? We also have this from an acquaintance of Bryon's in post #25:
Wow, I know you were pretty hyped about this job a couple of weeks ago.
Click to expand...
Its not so much that I question Bryon's motives, as I truly do not know. But I don't want to make conclusive assumptions as to it all either.
 
Jim, (and having talked to you a few times before) I think I can say with all sincerity that you are like me, you realize that, as an owner of a business, you are the end of the road when it comes to responsibility. We are it....all the burdens are placed on our shoulders...you are only as good as your worst employee.
That is why I blame Allen totally and without question. If you have an imacculate place, but your customer service sucks because you only hire cleaners, then it is your fault.
If you have a dispiseably dirty environment but make money, it is your fault because you hired sales people. The balance is where you need to be. Even if Allen is a great guy, a good businessman, he is lacking somewhere. We all are, but, There is a cutoff on where it is morally and ethically ok. The pictures justify, in my mind, the conclusion that all is not well with Big Daddy's wholesale.
Hopefully this thread will bring a good conclusion to this whole matter.
TOM
 
Tom, I think we agree completely with regard to the accountability of the owner, either for things as they are, and/or for the actions of employees. The current appearance of this situation is not good for Allen. Even if it is 50% as bad as alleged, its bad. I do not know if Bryon had an ax to grind by the time he decided to take pictures and make this an eventual BOI thread. It is quite possible that he is as honorable in this as the sky is blue, and only saw all of this as a last resort, having exhausted all other means. And It is possible that both are true, that he exhausted all means and had an ax to grind either because of what we know, or because of some other incident. While the deed has been done here, I would also hope that others faced with his situation would be sure that they have looked into all ramifications in advance of posting the full expose, and exercise restraint where prudent. I am not concluding that Bryon has not considered all of this and gotten good counsel already. I don't know.
 
Chamco said:
Its not so much that I question Bryon's motives, as I truly do not know. But I don't want to make conclusive assumptions as to it all either.
Click to expand...

But they way you quote everything so far, you are assuming he has an hidden agenda. You have stated it could be staged etc. It sounds like you are trying to provide Allen with an excuse. Maybe I just don't understand what your getting at. So far I have not seen or heard one thing to validate the assumptions your are making. Selling normals as possible hets and laying sewer pipe are validated in Bryon's response and Allen's email. That right there lends credibility to his account!!
 
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