Allen Belcher / Big Daddy's Wholesale ... WARNING

[Dennis Hultman]

These last three posts are not your best. BTW

Probably because it is the only time I have disagreed with your posts directly.

We have given each other rep points before too.

I have given you rep points for past posts. You have never given me any. LOL.

I didn’t agree with the private messages between you and Laura being posted here and I don’t agree with you posting information that Laura gave you during private messages.


Is that hard to understand?

 

[Chameleon Company]

Dennis writes:
I have given you rep points for past posts. You have never given me any. LOL.

I owe you then, for you have many worthy posts.

 

[reptilebreeder]

I'll make my comment short and to the point.

Jim, you have moved from Devil's advocate to Devil's agent. You used to be right on the money but anymore I am forced to take your opinions and comments as nothing more than worthless chatter. I have never seen someone so off base as you especially given the numerous threads here. What a pity too.

Griz

I agree with this post, except for the bold part, I've felt he's been off base on a number of recent threads. It's one of the reasons I haven't been participating in the BOI. Maybe if enough people take notice it will force him to stay on topic and not hijack the thread when he feels it is not BOI "worthy" or "worth a pot to piss in", or biased when he knows the person being "bad guyed".
I wouldn't be surprised if he tags your karma either. Seems to be his little playground. He tagged me saying I called him a liar. This after he inferred I was inferior?, stupid? [compared to him, I guess] in my english comprehension. Seems we both posted our opinions, but I didn't and run and tag his karma. The whole time I've been here participating in the BOI, especially when it got really ugly last year, and I've been negatively tagged twice? the other was Ray Strickland. Go figure.

Now since I've gone ahead and posted here, I might as well make my opinion on topic. Those photos show disgusting, even neglect/abuse of animal care. Quite frankly, I don't care what the motives were of the OP. Allen should not have given him the "ammo" he needed to launch an "attack", alterior motives or not. Those photos don't just show spilled water, there is at least one photo (Blood Python? I haven't gone back and looked) where it is obvious that it had been wet for some time, as the bedding looked like shag carpet (mold). The photos showing feces, not just a pre-cleaning shot of a freshly dirty cage, in my opinion. The feces has that very old look to it, like you see in petcos, or petsmarts, plus there are several piles. This is, in an of itself, BOI worthy. period.

 

[BryonsBoas]

Jim
I find it odd that your on here calling folks out on actions you don't find agreeable or professional yet you sent out an e-mail claiming my mental status is to be questioned among other personal info that..

1) You never got from me since to this day we've only spoken outside of thread once in pm that has already been covered.

2) You have not a lick of proof to back up yet took at face value anyway.

3) The info you used came from Allen who you said forwarded all his e-mails from me to you. Try reading the part where Allen said " He never had to be so defensive to someone he's only known for just over a month" . Just how well do you think he really knows me.

Next time you wanna know something about me , ask me yourself instead of sitting around with your buddy trying to come up with something to discredit me. Try following that of which you spew on these boards while your at it. I don't mind being questioned but try to come up with something better . Maybe I can be schitzo in the next batch?

 

[Griz]

Rich, I just joined the Hell forum today and let me say, it was quite the eye opener. People who I have had a great deal of respect for are a little bit more tarnished then I had imagined. Given what I have seen take place in an unmoderated forum, I can only say that I am sorry for giving you (Rich) such a hard time (about a matter dealing with site rules enforcement).

Since I am the author of the quotes that Jim has used, and since I am the only one who can accurately inform you of their true meaning, I will elaborate:

The first quote was very carefully worded so as to not offend. I purposely used the word "tarnished" as it implies being in a condition other than the original state. HELL changed my perception on a few people but not in an overly negative way. For those few, my opinion of them, as a whole, is still 100% of what it was prior to joining HELL. Brass is easily tarnished but the underlying properties are still beautiful. That is how I view some of those in HELL. They are still beautiful individuals but I know I don't want to get into a war of the words with them in a no-holds bar arena.

Jim, you have moved from Devil's advocate to Devil's agent. You used to be right on the money but anymore I am forced to take your opinions and comments as nothing more than worthless chatter. I have never seen someone so off base as you especially given the numerous threads here. What a pity too.

Now, we have 2 quotes all from the same person. But, allow me to explain how these tie in together so that it is clear:

Jim, the criteria I used to formulate my opinions of those in HELL are no different then the criteria I used to for you. I feel that you have stepped over the line of common decency (i.e. respect), solely for the purpose of elevating your very own pedestal. You have been given a solid history of evidence regarding Allen's history, yet you somehow feel the need to continue your rather excellent disposition on "How to speak down to people".

I was the one who brought CS's criminal history into his own thread, as it is relevant. If this is not proper protocol then why in the world is it relevant and allowed in court proceedings? It shows a pattern of behavior that supports the original intent of this, as well as the numerous other threads regarding Allen. Oh wait, that's right, the only information that should be relevant to this particular thread is if Allen was charged by the Animal Control officer for maintaining dirty cow pens, right? It's a repeated behavior Jim, a repeated behavior of dishonesty.

You're missing the mark Jim. I considered you one in which I held in high regards and despite this thread, I do appreciate when a person can offer a different view then what is the norm. However, my respect for that person’s point of view is only extended until such time as their behavior becomes obscene or intolerable. You've reached that point with me Jim. You've reached that point with the vast majority of those on this board. Your ability to play Devil's Advocate has now become your very own Achilles’ heel.

Griz

 

[Chameleon Company]

Griz,

If you want to elevate the BOI to the equivelency of court proceedings, I am surely not going to stop you. Kangaroo court maybe? Seems a lot more like "The Smoking Gun.com" of late, and I guess we have you to thank in part for that. Laura and I spoke at length about this issue yesterday, and she has no misunderstanding of my view, and why I was critical of her. It was a great conversation too, as while we may not agree on everything, she gets it. You don't Griz. I have no doubt that if I had a criminal record, one of a very identifiable group of folks would have thrown it into the thread by now. In fact, I would ecpect a few of you to trip and fall over each other in the race to post it. So now we have brass and Hell and more of the devil and Achilles .......... well, bass fishing should be so easy.

 

[Griz]

Jim, call it as you will but the board, as a whole, see's this for what it is. Your attempt at verbal eloquence to provide a "shock and awe" experience for the readers is heavily overshadowed by the lack of substance and logic in said postings. I would rather see this board provide substance to the threads by following court protocol then the alternative that you seem so intent on providing. Somehow, turning the BOI into a rerun of the Bozo show (you know, no substance but amusing for a very few), doesn't seem to fulfilling either, does it?

Griz

 

[Chameleon Company]

Whatever channel you like to watch Griz. Over 400 posts now, and the only direct transaction originally reported in the entire thread, where goods and services were exchanged between Allen and the entity making the post, was reported as having gone very well by the customer. So what else do we have in 400 posts? One of the most pointless threads ever to grace the BOI, and the posting of a criminal conviction from three years ago. Not much of a fan of that, but it happens. And then to have others, who understand the difficulties of bearing the burden of that kind of mistake for the rest of their lives, be the first to post and suggest that it's likely only the tip of the iceberg etc, and this person cannot be trusted again ........ well, as I said, she and I have had a nice direct communication about it. There are hundreds of legitimate bad guy posts in the last couple of years, including the 13 month old one on Allen which I referenced. I know a few where y'all evidently missed the criminal past. But at least they are threads with a theft or scam reported in them. Do your research, between the Bozo episodes, and stick the evidence there. I would think it in poor taste at this point, but that never stopped anybody. I have no trouble appreciating that folks don't like dealing with criminals, convicted or otherwise. But we can sit back and watch the bait, and see how many other folks who have a criminal record are the first to swim up and post something akin to "once a criminal, always a criminal". Heck, even a bad day fishing is better than a good day at work, or watching Bozo.

 

[Griz]

Jim, the only difference between a rut and a grave is the depth. I had hoped you were just in the former but alas, such is not the case. I have never seen someone stop digging with their shovel only to grab the backhoe to complete the job. It's your reputation my friend and hopefully the fog on your glasses will clear so that you can revive what little respect some of us have left for you. I hope he was worth it Jim, I really do.

Griz

 

[Chameleon Company]

Thank you for the kind words Bob.

 

[hill4803]

The BOI is to make people aware of the business practices of people in this hobby. If I were buying an animal, (especially an expensive morph similar to some in the photos) I would think it important to know that the person I am dealing with has exercised due care and diligence in keeping the animal in a clean and safe environment. This thread is about Allen's lack of care or regard for his animals (and therefore, his customers) by keeping his animals in filthy conditions. The semantics can continue, but the fact remains that Allen has shown that he is NOT someone I, or many others, would want to do business with. This debate about criminal records and hypocrisy is just smoke and mirrors...some people need to go back and look at the posted pictures.

Ro Hill

 

[ArkValRep]

Good Experience with Allen

undefinedHi. I want to share with you my recent dealings with Allen Belcher in Alabama. First of all, let me preface this by saying that until about two months ago I didn't know the man whatsoever. However, I recently negotiated a transaction and bought some high end ball python morphs from him. This required quite a bit of trust because I sent him a very large sum of money. This was difficult to do because I am a full-time police sergeant and have a tendency to see the darker side of humanity on a fairly routine basis. This makes me inherently more skeptical than your average person. Additionally, I have been in the reptile business for some time and have been burned, as have many of you who have dealt via the internet for any length of time. For these reasons I spoke at length with Mr. Belcher and also searched the other threads here on the BOI. I read the two negative threads thoroughly. They concerned me for obvious reasons. Instead of just cancelling our deal though, I spoke with Mr. Belcher about the posts. He was more than willing to address both threads in detail. Amazingly, he wasn't angry at all, and didn't criticize anyone. He did feel that he'd been treated unfairly by both of the parties that started the threads though. His explanations were very reasonable. However, Mr. Belcher could totally understand my apprehension and politely insisted I speak with some of his references. I spoke with one of his business associates by the name of Michael Cole. Mr. Cole was more than happy to recommend Mr. Belcher without any reservations. In fact, he emphatically recommended him as trustworthy and honest. I spoke again with Mr. Belcher and he was more than willing to do whatever it took to make sure I was happy with our deal. He was even willing to cancel my check if I didn't feel 100% satisified with completing the deal. To make a long story short, we completed the deal and I am thankful we did. I received ten of the healthiest snakes I have ever laid eyes on. They are all plump and parasite-free. I will have no reservations whatsoever in dealing with Mr. Belcher from this point forward. If you are considering a deal with him I encourage you to speak with him yourself and research his references. He is a genuine man who is honest and really cares for his animals. If you have any questions or would like to talk to me about my experience personally, feel free to call me and I would be happy to talk with you.

 

[airtrixx]

Now that is a load of BS, I bought an BCI from him in august at the philadelphia show...he had no intentions of explaining anything to me, he also did not seem to know how to sex the animal he was selling to me...after 3 weeks of vet visits after the show the animal died. Pathology tests have concluded IBD. NUMEROUS LARGE Eosinophilic cytoplasmic inclusion bodies. IF anyone would like a copy of my test for any legal action please please please contact me, Anyone who keeps animals like this in these conditions should be placed in a cell full of AIDS and piss and feces. In the mean time i will be waiting for my other animals to die. Thanks allen you rock.

 

[Dixie Reptiles]

If you bought the snake and had problems with it why didnt you contact Allen as soon as you had a problem.What about the other two boas they should be infected .You also told Allen it was no big deal and here you are on the b.o.i.? I have been to Allen,s shop I saw nothing out of order to warrent the other nonsense about him on the previous posts.I have snakes I bought from him and have no problems with them.He also vends at my Show in Birmingham Al and I have had no complaints so far.It appears you read the other posts and chimmed in.This whole thing sounds fishy to me.Terry Heuring/Dixie Reptile Shows

 

[Dennis Hultman]

Now that is a load of BS, I bought an BCI from him in august at the philadelphia show...he had no intentions of explaining anything to me, he also did not seem to know how to sex the animal he was selling to me...after 3 weeks of vet visits after the show the animal died. Pathology tests have concluded IBD. NUMEROUS LARGE Eosinophilic cytoplasmic inclusion bodies. IF anyone would like a copy of my test for any legal action please please please contact me, Anyone who keeps animals like this in these conditions should be placed in a cell full of AIDS and piss and feces. In the mean time i will be waiting for my other animals to die. Thanks allen you rock.

Serious accusations. Scan it and post it.

 

[Junkyard]

There is something missing here, Terry, do you know Ron?

 

[airtrixx]

Well at first i was pissed, i did just get the results today. But i am pretty reasonable and definitley want to get to the bottom of it, I just emailed allen about this and i am grateful that he is actually talking to me about it. I have the results and am thinking of posting them but i want to be sure the disease was already present. the other two snakes were separated before they even got to my house so i will be keeping in contact with their owners to stay tuned to the health of those snakes. IBD is an asymtomatic disease so the others could have it but might not soon or never show it. My 1 other snake is a corn snake baby that cannot carry the disease and who also is in great shape. The first week i had the boa it regurged its first meal and the next meal two weeks later, lost much weight and couldnt turn over when i flipped it, after the first week i noticed mites and thats when i took it to the vet. after the vet visit it died two days later, but not before it pooped, i checked the runny stool and it was infested with little green parasites ( i observed these myself on my microscope). thats when i decided to pay the money for the necropsy and pathology test. This all happened in a total of three weeks. the reasoning i didnt call allen was because i lost the card i got from him and could not find " big daddys wholesale" from a google search then i saw an ad after i discovered kingsnake.com thats when i contacted him right after i got the test results back.

Now when i found this thread and pictures that allen does not deny are of his shop, i was scared for the other snakes i aquired since. Im sorry but i dont care if you have a million animals, if you have the money for that many animals what is the harm in cutting down to the size that you can actually professionally manage?? Or hire the help that is needed, vacation or not the health and lives of those expensive/cheap animals alike are on his shoulders.

Now about the not wanting to talk to me at the show and not seeming to know how to sex the animals, this was my opinion. When a guy pops a snake and turns around and then asks someone elses opinion that shows me a little bit of insecurity of your work. Also, even though i was only purchasing a $50 snake allen did not seem to interested in spending 5 min with me on how to care for the snake, then I asked him particularly on breeding and his exact words were " wait three years and just throw them together". After extensive reasearch this is pretty damn general to the real procedure.


Business is business and if thats all this is to allen, then he still needs much improvement in the customer relations but hell what do i know, it was only 50 bucks right.

I will keep updated on the well being of the other snakes. And allen, please keep better. Those pics are disgusting, and if it is just numbers that are the problem with maintenence, maintain the numbers.

 

[Dixie Reptiles]

Ron,you own one corn snake and this makes you an expert on how to maintian a large collection.You have alot to learn.You could take pics at any large facility and find dirty cages.I have over a 100 snakes and before I can clean all of my cages several will have defecated again,the only way to stop this is to clean 24/7.I have read the patholgy report and will send a copy to one of our vets.From what I read in the report it is not conclusive.I think you have over reacted.Allen has offered you your money back even though he doesnt remember you,he is also looking into this and contacting others that bought snakes from him.Now lets be realistic,he is a wholesaler that breeds buys sells and trades.At a show he does not have time to tell you how to breed boas or have long conversation about snakes in gereral.He drove from Al. to Pa.to sell snakes for a two day show .Do your homework before you buy something.You just keep trying to hurt his business and I will keep making you look like a fool.This should not have been put on the b.o.i.,you are e-mailng him and posting here at the same time.Terry

 

[floridaboy85]

Dixie Reptiles-> If i may ask. Where is Allen's retail location?? I will be up in Pheonix City around Christmas and would like to to check it out. Although I'm fairly certain I wont be purchasing anything.

Ron-> If you have conclusive test that were positive for IBD then you need to post them as proof. If you do not have test that confirm IBD is present then you need to retract and apologize for the false accusation.

Andrew Elholm

 

[Cat_72]

Now that is a load of BS, I bought an BCI from him in august at the philadelphia show...he had no intentions of explaining anything to me, he also did not seem to know how to sex the animal he was selling to me...after 3 weeks of vet visits after the show the animal died. Pathology tests have concluded IBD. NUMEROUS LARGE Eosinophilic cytoplasmic inclusion bodies. IF anyone would like a copy of my test for any legal action please please please contact me, Anyone who keeps animals like this in these conditions should be placed in a cell full of AIDS and piss and feces. In the mean time i will be waiting for my other animals to die. Thanks allen you rock.

I think the necropsy and pathology reports need to be posted here, with an accusation this serious. If this is true, and the animal did die from IBD.....people need to know. MANY people need to know. Regardless of whether or not Ron is "emailing" with Allen. If the tests were NOT conclusive, then it is a different story.....