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Aprylla Hall - Bad Guy

Sounds like a clear and concise explanation to me. I can't say how Paypal would be for a large $value purchase, since most of mine were under $10.

With so many scammers out there, I know that it can't be easy to have something go wrong... you don't want to snooze and allow a possible scammer access to your money, but you don't want to be too quick to jump the gun either... it's a difficult situation.

Reminds me of the one claim I've made to paypal. I bought something off ebay and almost immediately received a message from eBay Germany (?) in German telling me t hat the person was suspended from eBay and that i should not complete the transaction, and that I wasn't liable for completing the transaction. I tried to look up the item I'd purchased and it had been pulled, the person was listed as no longer a registered user (in spite of their 2000+ positive feedbacks and 99.9% good feedback rating)... So what do I do? Put in a claim now, or wait for an explanation? I ended up putting in a claim and sending an email to the person telling them how I wanted my item ($12 item sent media mail), and I didn't want the money, but that with all of the insecurity I had to have a claim until the item was sent to me. I even offered to pay her the cost of priority mail if she wanted to send it and make sure it arrived before the 2 week investigation was complete. She never contacted me, I never got my item, and I did get a refund. *shrug*

It sounds like you've explained yourself well, Aprylla, but that there has still been a lack of communication with your buyer... for whatever reason he hasn't felt that the answers you've given have been adequate, resulting in his asking them again and again.

I hope this gets resolved. It's events like these that have me wondering why ANYONE lives where Hurricanes visit!
 
critical bill said:
So why cant this guy get a refund by personal check, bank check, or money order?

Beause PayPal is sending his refund as soon as they can process the info (I did ask them to do this ASAP and IMMEDIATELY, but I am sure they have a million other people requesting the same thing of them). Pretty much all of the $$$ I have to my name as of this moment is tied up in my PayPal account and I have zero access to it. Even if I could, If I were to send him a check or mo for $450.00 today, PayPal would ALSO refund his $450.00 in the next few days, which would give him a *double* refund, which is definitely not warranted in this case.
 
Sasheena said:
It sounds like you've explained yourself well, Aprylla, but that there has still been a lack of communication with your buyer... for whatever reason he hasn't felt that the answers you've given have been adequate, resulting in his asking them again and again.

I hope this gets resolved. It's events like these that have me wondering why ANYONE lives where Hurricanes visit!

Just to let you know, here are the dates I e-mailed the Buyer: 7/3 (three times), 7/4 (once), 7/5 (twice), 7/6 (once), 7/9 (once), 7/13 (once), 7/14 (once), 7/17 (twice), 7/20 (twice), 7/21 (once), 7/25 (once) and 7/26 (4 times). I felt like I had kept in pretty good contact for the circumstances (hurricane). He kept asking the same questions even after I had sent him a line-by-line explanation of every detail he asked for. Evey time I sent him an e-mail he picked apart my every word and asked questions about his own questions and questions about my answers. It gets a bit frustrating when someone asks you the same thing over and over and you give them the best and most detailed answer you possibly can and they just don't "get it".

This whole thing can be simplified down to this: In an unfortunate event, I lost a lot of reptiles that died due to the heat. I offered to replace them and include a few extras. The buyer kept telling me he "wanted the snakes" and not the money. I told him I could ship the snakes out on August 1st with extras and he filed a PayPal claim instead (I still am not understanding why he filed a claim 9 days after he sent payment, and before the time his replacement snakes were to be shipped out to him). He then decided he still wanted the snakes, but also wanted to let the claim continue. I pretty much told him he wasn't getting the snakes AND his money back and that's when he posted this "bad guy" thread on the BOI about me, then after I had told him he would get his money back as soon as PayPal could get it to him.

I really just think he jumped the gun a little. Had he been a little bit understanding of my circumstances (hurricane and dead reptiles) he would have received his snakes (and several extra ones) on August 2nd. Like I said before, had he waiting until August 2nd, he still would have been well within his rights and time limit to file a PayPal claim if he were not satisfied with his snakes. I would still be willing to send him his snakes on August 1st for an August 2nd delivery if he cancelled the PayPal claim so that I would be assured that he wouldn't get the snakes and the money too, but I guess at this point he has opted for the refund, which is also fine by me. This board and everyone here is my witness that I did not take away the original offer from this guy, to send his snakes out on August 1st in lieu of a refund.

FYI, Had I known 2 years ago what a paid in the rear living right by the ocean would be, I never would have moved here. I am working as quickly as possible to get the $$$ together to move back to Atlanta, so somewhere besides "hurricane alley". LOL
 
I have had a chance to read Aprylla's response in full and feel that she is the one not telling the WHOLE story. I agree with everything she states up to the point at which she stopped. I told her repeatedly that I was trying to understand, and she is correct that I preferred the animals over the refund. If she would re-read all of her e-mails I reiterated this several times and was more that willing to wait.
The complaint was filed when she responded to my request for verification without supplying a phone number to verify the breeder and stating she would be away from her computer. I would think it would be easy for all to understand that it looked like an excuse or a delay tactic (or at least could have been) which would provide her the time to empty her account and leave me helpless. It was only AFTER that she explained that she did not want to provide a number for the breeder because she felt she would be compromising her wholesale source.
I was still willing to wait for the shipment (not "jump the gun" pch101) at this point however, she fails to tell you that she still refused to ship the snakes unless I canceled the complaint. I assured her that it would be canceled immediately upon receipt of the animals and that I would even be willing to purchase additional animals if they were available once I had received the first shipment and that all communication concerning this matter would be held solely between us. She stated that she did not trust me and ran the risk of being out the animals and still being forced to make a refund through PayPal and flatly refused to ship the animals stating she would "leave it up to Paypal." I will admit that at that point I did become furious and entered the forum to find out if anyone else might have experienced the same problem- but only AFTER she refused to ship the animals OR voluntarily make a refund.
She stated that she could not use the refund option from the original transaction on PayPal due to having her account frozen. This may or may not be true, I cannot say. However, when a complaint for non shipment is made, PayPal provides two option to RESOLVE THE COMPLAINT, that have nothing to do with the original transaction codes. One is to provide proof of shipment, the other is to click on the resolution button that states "issue a refund." And that has nothing to do with any of the original transaction options. Paypal gives you 10 days to make a response to the original complaint before freezing anything. Evidently there are several complaints filed simultaneously and that may have had something to do with her account being frozed.
As far as "picking apart every detail" of her e-mails, I simply told her that I was confused by her response because it contained so many inconsistencies and asked her to explain them. I'm sure that everyone has had experience with people that have lied to them by contradicting themselves and that was the way they were caught- in their inconsistencies. I'm not saying she DID lie, just that is was another very suspicious pattern in a circumstance that contained MANY suspicious circumstances. I explained this to her and apologized by telling her I could not cancel the complaint until I actually received the animals- after all, she had the money and the merchandise and was telling me she could not trust ME! That just convinced me that I had to keep the complaint in force until resolution was made. Other that those of you who have made it plain that you know her and will take her side no mater WHAT details come out, I'm sure you would have done the same faced with the circumstances and a total stranger. No one out there can HONESTLY say differently. The bottom line is- this thread was begun after, AND ONLY AFTER, she stated that she would not ship the animals.
 
Aprylla and pch101 are obviously friends and even quote each other with the "Jumping the gun" phrase. I think Sasheena was very accurate in describing what I was feeling after having sent the money, not received shipment, was faced with what seemed to be a delaying tactic, encountered a deceptive resolution to PayPal by providing them a tracking number (that they obviously would have taken as shipment made) and then refusal to ship the animals unless I dropped everything and placed myself at risk. Sasheena, you are absolutely correct- I felt it was my only option in protecting myself until I received shipment. And Aprylla- I have always been, and still am willing to complete the transaction. To date, I am the only party that has demonstrated any trust by sending you payment in full.
 
sig1980 said:
The bottom line is- this thread was begun after, AND ONLY AFTER, she stated that she would not ship the animals.

This thread was started AFTER I told you I wasn't shipping you the snakes BECAUSE I was getting a refund to you via PayPal. You can't have the snakes AND the refund too. Period.
 
Aprylla,
I'm sorry to hear about your situation and I believe your side of the story but you can resolve a Paypal dispute at any time by simply sending a refund to the person who filed the complaint.
I filed a complaint against Steven Beckerman earlier this year for a $500 Animal Plastics rack I purchased from him. After waiting and waiting, my rack never came and he didn't answer my emails or PM's. When Animal Plastics said they hadn't heard from him I filed a complaint.

When I was finally able to contact him I received this email from Paypal the same day. (keep in mind, I had filed a complaint and there was an active investigation).

"Dear Chris Raden,

Steven Beckerman ([email protected]) has refunded your payment.

This refund is currently pending, and will remain "Pending" until the funds have cleared from the sender's account, which usually takes up to 8 business days. You will be notified by email when the funds have cleared into your PayPal balance."

When the funds cleared, I received another email stating that the dispute was now resolved.
 
Never wanted both. You offered neither in the end. How can you tell me flat out that you will not ship unless I drop the complaint first and and expect me to leave myself totally unprotected. I lived up to my end of the deal by sending you payment in full in the first place. That show some sort of trust at least. When was I given the same?
 
The problem is that Paypal is NOTORIOUS for being very difficult to deal with. It seems that Aprylla mentioned that her account was limited due to the unfortunate circumstances she found herself in, and once you make a claim, you cannot back out and say "I'll come back later if I don't get the item"... it's very difficult because paypal has no heart. Now that there is a claim, the only thing that can happen is the refund, and due to the "limited" nature of the account that could take up to a week.
 
I don't know why this didn't appear. If it comes up twice then please excuse me.
Aprylla- you did not state that you would not ship the snake because you were issuing a refund. You stated you would not ship the snakes and leave it in the hands of PayPal. I have accepted [email protected] offer and forwarded him the e-mails. I apologize for not being computer literate enough to post them myself. Hopefully he will post the in a timely manner and you can all decide if I did anything unwarranted.
 
Tough One.....

Hopefully Jim will be able to give some good insight to all of this, he is really is one to help put things in order.

Aprylla-It may be helpful for you to send your e-mails to Jim also, this way he will have the e-mails from both parties here and be able to better decipher between the two of you.
 
Here are some e-mails...

These are exactly as I received them from Shawn, unedited by me. Honestly, they are unread as yet as I want everyone to be able to read them. They are also not reformatted except to remove a few blank lines. These are all of the e-mails that I was sent. Sadly, they read bottom to top.

From: Gilbert, Shawn I
Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 8:14 PM
To: Aprylla Hall
Subject: RE: Message about: 2005 Female Ball Pythons, Holdbacks, EMERGENCY SALE $25 Each

No, I am now convinced that your full intention was to rip me off. If you simply wanted to refund the money because you didn't trust me to cancel the complaint after you FINALLY lived up to your end of the bargain, you could do that in an instant. You say there is over $600.00 in your account. One of the options to resolve the matter is for you to click on the button "issue a refund." If that was your desire, you would have done it and there would not have been an issue of whether you trusted me enough to ship the animals. YOU DID NOT. Instead, you chose a deceptive option of providing Paypal with a tracking number that was SUPPOSED to be the tracking number for the shipment of the purchased item, ot the tracking number for a receipt. Since you are insisting that I cancel the complaint BEFORE you make an overdue shipment, my conclusion is that I was right in trying to protect myself. I have showed all the trust in the world by sending payment in full. I have waited patiently while you have continually reiterated your misfortunes. You spent the money I sent you without shipping the animals and now you continually accuse me of doing something wrong. For someone who supposedly is so concerned for their reputation, you have gone a long way in tarnishing it. All communications at this point have been between us only. I have not bothered plastering these e-mails over every reptile forum that you claim holds you in such high esteem. I have agreed to live up to my end of the bargain and cancel the complaint if you would simply ship the animals that I HAVE ALREADY PAID FOR IN FULL. To this point you have still refused to do that. Now, after taking my full payment, you still refuse to ship the animals and say you will "leave it up to Paypal." Well, I am not so inclined to leave it up to them alone. If you still refuse to ship the animals then my next step will be to Contact the Bureau of Criminal Investigation in the Pennsylvania State Police and every agency I possibly can in regard to interstate fraud. I leave it up to you.

From: Gilbert, Shawn I
Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 7:02 PM
To: Aprylla Hall
Subject: RE: Message about: 2005 Female Ball Pythons, Holdbacks, EMERGENCY SALE $25 Each

I am confused. Your first paragraph states that you have NEVER had any problems regarding reptile transactions, then you go on in your third paragraph states you RECENTLY got ripped off due to an order mistake.

Unfortunately, there was never anything bad written about the other people that ripped me off either, so that doesn't go to forming my opinion.

As far as trust goes, we have to remember that I already sent the money. I only filed the complaint after non receipt of the animals which I'm sure is not in dispute. You had told me before that your PayPal account was empty, so another item that cannot be disputed is that you received payment in full and spent it in full prior to shipping the animals. PayPal terms stipulate that I will only get my money back if there is enough money in the account to cover the refund. If I cancel the complaint, there is nothing to keep you from emptying the account and never responding again. You would simply set up another account in another name and I would be left holding air. You keep talking about trust, but you are the one with the merchandise AND the money, I still have nothing and have missed out on the opportunity to buy two other lots of female BP's (one at a lower price than yours- they were willing to take $400.00 shipped for a lot of 20) while waiting for you to make good on a sale that you already conducted. You see, your paypal account is not the only one empty, mine is too. I sent it all to you for these females. In fact I didn't even have $450.00 at the time, that is why I had initially asked if you would accept $400.00. I wasn't trying to lowball you, it was all that was in the account so I sent the whole $400.00 and added $50.00 from a credit card.

I made payment in full in good faith without ever seeing the animals I was getting, and even waited when you were going through your evacuation without taking any measures. I am even taking you at your word that you are not simply delaying shipment waiting for another import lot to substitute for the animals I have been told perished without any proof. Yet you now insist that I am the one who has somehow proven untrustworthy and you refuse to ship the animals until I leave myself totally unprotected. Since I am the ONLY ONE in this transaction that has EVER fulfilled their obligation I find it hard to believe that you are insisting that I drop everything and place my full trust in you. At what point am I going to be trusted and when will you live up to your end of the bargain?

From: Aprylla Hall [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Tue 7/26/2005 12:03 PM
To: Gilbert, Shawn I
Cc:
Subject: RE: Message about: 2005 Female Ball Pythons, Holdbacks, EMERGENCY SALE $25 Each

I'm sorry that I have to be the one to pay for the
mistakes (or thievery) of other people who have ripped
you off. I have never had any probelms like this with
my reptile transactions before. If I had, my name
would have been aroudn every reptiel messese board on
the "bad guy" list instead of the "good guy" list like
it is now.

I can only send the snakes if you cancel the
complaint. I don't know you either. I don't want to
end up without 25 snakes or so and without the
$450.00, not in the current financial shape I am in
right now, which is obviously bad. I am sure I can
find another buyer(s) for the snakes.

I do understand you position that you don't know me,
but I also don't know you. I have also been ripped
off (as recently as last a couple weeks ago) when I
trusted someone to cancel a PayPal complaint after he
received his animals in excellent condition and even
better than described. This guy who was accidentally
sent the wrong order (one that was sent prior to the
hurricane). When he did receive the correct order(2
boxes had been mixed up when labels were placed on
them, he received a ball python baby, which he was
allowed to keep, because I was able to send the other
persona another one) he told me the animals (leopard
geckos) were "some of the best he had ever seen" and
then stated "well, since you screwed my order up in
the first place, I'm not canceling my complaint
because I want my money back anyway". And guess what?
As incompetent as PayPal is, even though I sent them
copies of every e-mail he had sent me, along with the
tracking number and photos of the leopard geckos, they
STILL refunded his money ($320.00) and gave me ZERO
explanation (even though I DID send them the e-mail
where the guy admitted to have receiving them). I am
really beginning to hate Paypal anyway. Yes, they may
be a "quick and easy" way to pay, but when there is a
problem, they are very, very slow.

Also, you would *think* that when there is a dispute,
they would maybe "freeze" the funds in your account
that are "up to" the amount being disputed (in this
case $450.00), but no, they froze the whole account,
even the funds over the $450.00. So my biggest issue
here isn't really with you, it's with the way PayPal
has handled this. They also have made it nearly
impossible for me to RECEIVE money. I have items for
sale on Ebay and people are really ticked to find out
that I can't accept PayPal. I have lost some $$$
because of my PayPal account being frozen. And FYI,
if you want to verify my usual business practices,
check out my Ebay feedback. My user name there is:
backbaybargainsbiloxi

Anyway, I am sorry we couldn't get this worked out in
a quicker way. I guess PayPal will review this for
the next 30 days or so and get back to us with
whatever they decide. Just in case they they tell me
to send the snakes out and for me to keep the $450.00,
I will hold onto the snakes until PayPal makes their
decision.

Thanks.

Aprylla

From: Gilbert, Shawn I
Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 7:48 AM
To: 'Aprylla Hall'
Subject: RE: Message about: 2005 Female Ball Pythons, Holdbacks, EMERGENCY SALE $25 Each

Like I had said, you may have honestly been set back by this series of events and a year and a half ago I would have never even initiated the complaint and waited for you to resolve the matter. However, with the regular manner in which I have been deceived with internet transactions, I feel I have to protect myself in any way that I can. I apologize for the fact that I do not personally know you and this is the only transaction I have to judge you by, but feel that if I cancel the complaint before receiving the animals it would just be a case of "fool me twice (or in this case - 4 times) shame on me."
I was not trying to circumvent your wholesale purchasing ability, only verify the origin of the animals. I'm sure that you are aware that there are plenty of unscrupulous people out there that represent wild caught animals that may be infested and not eating as CB stock. I have raised those animals before and dealt with the associated problems, but paid a price representative of an imported animal in lots from $7.00 to $11.00. I did not want that hassle again. I am also confident that even though you have been frustrated and victimized by these events, you would understand my point of view in wanting to protect myself if you looked at this as a third party. I have every intention of following through on the transaction that we started and will be happy to cancel the complaint upon the arrival of the animals. I am sorry that in good conscience I cannot do it sooner. I will state that after receiving the animals, if they are as represented and you have access to additional females, I would be happy to purchase additional animals. I hope that you understand my position.

Shawn I Gilbert


From: Aprylla Hall [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 12:18 AM
To: Gilbert, Shawn I
Subject: RE: Message about: 2005 Female Ball Pythons, Holdbacks, EMERGENCY SALE $25 Each

Here are the answers to your questions:

1) The animals weren't shipped because FedEx was not
accepting packages for delivery for a period of 2 days
plus over a weekend (a total of 4 days). I was
evacuated for the hurricane and felt it best to take
ALL of the animals I had with me. I had 30 total ball
pythons which I took, as well as many other reptiles,
a guinea pig, a cockatiel bird, a cat and a dog.
Unfortunately, several of my animals succumbed to the
heat. I lost 24 ball pythons, 16 during or directly
after getting back home and a few more within a couple
of days that I figured had been injured by the heat as
well. I still have 6. I decided not to send those 6
out to the guy who bought 10 because I was uncertain
how the heat had effected them (I was stranded with my
animals and my broken down car, in the heat, for about
40 hours). I also lost a bearded dragon that died
from the heat. I did all I could to keep everything
cooled, but I still lost the smallest and youngest of
the reptiles I had with me (the ball pythons). I'm
not sure what you mean by "transport them back" as you referenced in this e-mail and a couple others. When I was evacuated, I went basically 110 miles North. On my way back, about 90 miles form home, my car overheated and broke down. I was stranded on the side of Highway 49 for like I said, about 40 hours. I finally got a family member from Georgia on the phone and was able to get enough $$$ to call a wrecker and be towed home (I was totally flat broke, except for like maybe $40 cash) because I had to pay to stay in a hotel, pay for gas, etc for the evacuation.

2) After between the time you filed your complaint
with PayPal and the time they "limited" (froze) my
account I sold several other reptiles, including a
large red tegu and several other reptiles, so there is
now $612.00 plus change in my account that I can't
access. That is money I made form other reptiles that
I sold that were paid for. I now have no way to use
my FedEx account either since they debit my PayPal
debit card for shipping charges, so now I also have 5
very angry people wanting their reptiles and I can't
send them. FedEx now has my shipping account "on
hold" because the credit/debit card I have on my
shipping account is "frozen" by PayPal along with the
PayPal account funds.

3) I don't give out people's phone numbers, I didn't
even want to give you his e-mail address. I don't
generally reveal my wholesalers to everyone because if
I did, I wouldn't get the deals that I do. Normally I
would not have even given out his e-mail address.

4) As stated in the ad, these are CB females,
guaranteed by me personally. If you haven't checked,
I do have an excellent reputation on the Fauna BOI and
have references from some of the better known reptile
breeders in the country.

5) I didn't circumvent anything. PayPal still has my
account frozen. I did send you a merchandise credit certificate showing that you were entitled to the 20 female ball pythons you purchased. And yes, I was planning to also send you at least 5 extras. I didn't list them on the credit certificate because I didn't want there to be any confusion with PayPal after having 20 ball pythons listed in the payment then 25 listed on the credit.

6) Finally, why is it
> taking so long to ship the animals your "good friend
> who you have done business with for over three
> years" has if they are already available?

As I told you in another e-mail, he is NOT shipping
them to me. I have to go pick them up in person from
Georgia. I am TRADING him some of my personal items
(couch set and table, as well as some other things)
for these ball pythons. I had to wait until the last
weekend of the month (this coming weekend) to go get
them because I won't have $$ for gas to get there
until that time, when I get my last check from my
former employer on the 30th.

I have tried to explain this mess the best way I know
how. I am still willing to either refund your money
or send the snakes on Monday, August 1st. Either is
fine with me at this point, as I have resigned myself
to the fact that PayPal is holding onto the funds in
my account until they resolve this mess. I was
notified by them the other day that it would take "up
to 30 days" once the case was in review (and according
to what I see on PayPal, it went into review on
7/23/05). I am trying to )locally) sell off all of my household items, aquariums, and everything that isn't tied down in order to get the $$ together to move. My landlord has given me until August 10th to move, so I got a few days reprieve when I explained to her that some of my $$$ was frozen up by PayPal. I still don't have enough $$$ to move, but I will figure something out. I do have one good local job prospect and a 2nd interview tomorrow, so hopefully I will at least have a job soon (jobs here are difficult to find).

So basically, if you want to cancel the PayPal
complaint I can immediately refund your money. If you
want the snakes I can do that too. If not, I totally understand and am willing to just let PayPal work this out over the next 30 days or so. I am resigned to the fact that I am not going to have access to the funds in my PayPal account for at least 30 days anyway.

Aprylla

From: Gilbert, Shawn I
Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 11:41 PM
To: Aprylla Hall
Subject: RE: Message about: 2005 Female Ball Pythons, Holdbacks, EMERGENCY SALE $25 Each


You may have been honestly setback by unfortunate circumstances, but I have been ripped off so often in such a short time I no longer find myself able to trust strangers over the internet. I have a few problem with your several e-mails.

No explanation was ever offered as to why the animals were not shipped in the first place. Either before you evacuated or, if there was not enough time, after you did so. Why transport them back when they were already paid for?

You stated that about half the animals died. Now, not only did all 20 of the animals I purchase die, but an additional 10. Are you now saying that every ball python you had died?

You told me that if I filed a complaint with PayPal they wuld have to debit your account as you had no money in it. Now you say that you have $600.00 in it.

I asked you for a phone number of the person who bred the snakes to verify they were CB and you have never supplied it. You only supplied an e-mail address that we both know you COULD have set up yourself. (I'm not saying that you did).

I have seen import females for as low as $9.00. I do not want to risk my current collection with them. I need to have some proof that these are CBB in the U.S. I would much rather have the snakes than the refund if they can be verified.

You state in your last e-mail that you would be happy to refund my money "if I would let you". One of the possible resolutions to a PayPal complaint is "issue a refund" yet you chose to deceive PayPal and circumvent an automatic refund by providing a tracking number for an invoice, leading them to believe it was a tracking number for the items purchased.

You stated in one of your e-mails that if I was willing to wait for you to resolve this matter, you would send the 20 ball pythons I purchased "plus a few more for the delay", but now have never mentioned the additional animals.

Finally, why is it taking so long to ship the animals your "good friend who you have done business with for over three years" has if they are already available?


From: Aprylla Hall [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Thu 7/21/2005 2:02 PM
To: Gilbert, Shawn I
Cc:
Subject: RE: Message about: 2005 Female Ball Pythons, Holdbacks, EMERGENCY SALE $25 Each

I hope you have received my other e-mails and do hope
that you will respond soon.

I am trying to get this situation worked out as
quickly as humanly possible for your benefit and mine.


I advised PayPal of the tracking number for the
Merchandise Credit Certificate that was sent out to
you. Please let me know if you also would like that
tracking number, as it was sent Priority Mail with
Delivery Confirmation.

However, at this point if you would rather have a
refund, I would be glad to send it to you immediately
rather than wait for PayPal to resolve this. I just
checked with PayPal and their next step is this:


"Step 4 - PayPal Dispute Resolution Specialist reviews
case
In some cases, a buyer and seller are unable to agree
on a resolution. In these situations, the case is sent
to an impartial PayPal Dispute Resolution Specialist
for review. The specialist will collect relevant
information about the transaction from the buyer and
seller to determine whether the buyer's claim should
be granted. Cases are reviewed in the order in which
they are received. It may take several weeks to gather
the necessary information and come to a conclusion."

Unfortunately I don't have sveral weeks in order to
wait to be able to access the funds currently in my
account. I also have peopel that are trying to pay me
for items purchased on Ebay that can't do so because
my account is frozen until this matter is resolved.

Obviously it is up to you if you want to cancel the
claim and have me send you an immediate refund. I can
do that, or we can just sit and wait for "several
weeks" (as per PayPal's words) on their decision.

Please let me know something ASAP. I am to the point
here where I am about to be homeless because of this
situation. I am not kidding here in the least. I
*have* to be able to access my PayPal account (and
have people send $$$) in order to have money to be
able to get another place to live. I have $16 in my
bank account right now and that's all I have to my
name except the funds in my PayPal account.

This all started because of a hurricane (Hurricane
Dennis). I would hope that you would be understanding
enough to understand that things have happened that
are beyond my control.

I am terrified right now that I am going to be
homeless soon and living in my car. You are the only
person who can fix this situation and I am begging you
to do so. I will refund your money immediately if you
will just allow me to do so.

Thanks.

Aprylla

--- "Gilbert, Shawn I" <[email protected]> wrote:

> I simply asked for a phone number to verify your
> source. Since you have
> failed to provide it, I must assume that this was a
> scam in the first
> place. I expect an immediate refund.
>
> Shawn I Gilbert
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Aprylla Hall [mailto:[email protected]]
> Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2005 4:31 AM
> To: Gilbert, Shawn I
> Subject: RE: Message about: 2005 Female Ball
> Pythons, Holdbacks,
> EMERGENCY SALE $25 Each
>
> I apologize, but yesterday morning I went to Atlanta
> for a job interview. That is where I am trying to
> relocate back to (I lived there my whole life up
> until
> 2 years ago). I also took this morning and
> afternoon
> to try to find somewhere to live temporarily up
> there.
> I just got back this evening and made it my first
> priority to check my e-mails.
>
> As for the ball pythons, I have to go and pick them
> up
> because of what I am trading for them is sorta too
> large to be shipped. I am taking Donnie several
> items
> from my household that he has always wanted in
> trade.
> I have a 120 year old very large coffee table and a
> black velvet couch and loveseat. I can always get
> new
> furniture after I figure out where I am moving to.
> I
> hate to trade the tabel, but I honestly have
> absolutely nothing right now financially in order to
> buy more snakes to send you. Donnie knows what sort
> of bad luck I have encountered as of late, so he has
> been nice enough to offer me that trade deal for 30
> baby ball pythons (20 I owe you, 10 I owe to someone
> else).
>
> The ones I am getting from him are from early to
> mid-June hatch. Some of them probably have the same
> father snake as some of the ones I had that passed,
> since he used a lot fewer males to breed the
> females.
>
> With any luck we won't have any more hurricanes this
> year so that shipping won't be affected and I won't
> have to evacuate anymore. Or hopefully I can just
> move out of this hellhole that is called
> Mississippi.
>
> Will be back in touch soon. I have a job interview
> late tomorrow in New Orleans, so I will probably be
> away from my computer until Tuesday.
>
> Aprylla
>

From: Gilbert, Shawn I
Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 8:18 AM
To: 'Aprylla Hall'
Subject: RE: Message about: 2005 Female Ball Pythons, Holdbacks, EMERGENCY SALE $25 Each

Okay, I am sympathetic to having problems and am trying to understand the way things have happened. What I can't understand is- why would they have been transported both ways in the first place? I would think that you would have just shipped them first, or at the very least shipped them from the location you evacuated to if there had not been enough time.

I am not saying that I don't believe you, it's just that I have now been burned on three different occasions with internet purchases and am out significant money on some high end purchases (nearly $5,500.00) so I am starting to become a pessimist. Then I paid $700.00 a piece for "het" albino females that turned out to be normals.

This time, I just wanted some captive born females that I could raise myself and go from there, but it is starting to sound fishy. There are a flood of imports out there that people are substituting for CB or representing as CB and I was trying to stay away from that.

Could you supply a phone number of the guy that is supposed to have the females that you plan on sending?

-----Original Message-----
From: Aprylla Hall [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 11:12 AM
To: Gilbert, Shawn I
Subject: RE: Message about: 2005 Female Ball Pythons, Holdbacks, EMERGENCY SALE $25 Each

There was a problem that occurred during the time I
evacuated for the hurricane. The majority of the
reptiles I took with me, about half of them (mostly
ball pythons plus one bearded dragon), have died. I
will have to guess that it is because of the extreme
heat with them (and me) being stranded in a broken
down car for almost 2 days. I did all I could to cool
them and myself during the trip, including taking the containers to shady areas, etc. When the wrecker picked up my car and me, I even left the windows down in transit so that air could flow and allow the reptiles to be cooled some. Unfortunately, some of the reptiles had died before I got home. This morning several others had passed, possibly also due to stress. I wish now that I had just stayed home, or at least left the reptiles here. However, when I left there was a mandatory evacuation order for my area and a Category 4 hurricane looked like it was going to make a direct hit on us.

Anyway, here is what I can offer at this point. The
same guy I purchased these babies from has several
more (and does have many females) that I will be able
to go and get from him the last weekend in July (2
weeks from tomorrow basically). I would be able to
send all of the female ball pythons to you and ship on
Monday, August 1st. These are all very well
established, feeding on thawed frozen, cb, etc. Most
were hatched early to mid-June. I am going to make a
trade with Donnie to get these, but he has assured me
is will hold onto these for me. I have done business
with him for over 3 years and have known him even
longer. If I could go pick these snakes up sooner I
would, but finances won't allow it right now
unfortunately.

In the alternative, I can refund your money if you
would like. However, please note that it will
possibly be June 29th before I can send a refund.
That will be the first time that I know for sure I
will have enough $$$ to send you a full refund. To be
honest with you, right now my bank account is
seriously overdrawn and I had to borrow $$$ from a
family member just to get my car towed home when it
broke down.

Also, since you paid through PayPal, obviously you are
free to file through them for a refund. I am not sure
how that works, but I am guessing that they would just
refund your $$ and make my PayPal account a negative
balance since there aren't any funds in it.

I sincerely apologize for this entire mess. These
tropical storms and hurricanes have basically
financially ruined me. Makes me wish I had never
moved out of Atlanta. :(

Please let me know what you would like for me to do
from this point. I will be happy to send snakes (plus
a couple extras for your time and trouble) on August
1st, or either of the other alternatives.

Thank you and I look forward to hearing from you soon.

Aprylla


--- "Gilbert, Shawn I" <[email protected]> wrote:

> Just checking on the status?
>
> Shawn I Gilbert
> Troop B, Washington
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Aprylla Hall [mailto:[email protected]]
> Sent: Saturday, July 09, 2005 9:18 AM
> To: Gilbert, Shawn I
> Subject: RE: Message about: 2005 Female Ball
> Pythons, Holdbacks,
> EMERGENCY SALE $25 Each
>
> ***THIS IS A MASS E-MAIL BEING SENT TO EVERYONE WHO
> HAS PURCHASED A REPTILE FROM ME IN THE LAST FEW
> DAYS.***
>
> I apologize for the impersonal nature of this
> e-mail.
> It is much easier for me to send one e-mail to 10
> people than to send ten e-mails to ten people and
> time
> is of the essence right now :(
>
> As some of you know, I live in Biloxi, MS. You may
> also have seen on your local news that there is a
> hurricane in the Gulf of Mexico. I live
> about 300 feet from the ocean (Gulf of Mexico).
> Right
> now, we are directly in the center of the projected
> path of Hurricane Dennis and we are under a
> Hurricane
> Warning. Evacuation are starting to occur here as
> well. I live in Area 1 (or "A") and will be one of
> the
> first under a mandatory evacuation (right now I am
> under a Voluntary Evacuation last I checked).
> However, I am not waiting too long to leave. I am
> already in the process off packing up ALL of my
> animals (including
> all reptiles that were purchased from me) and
> heading
> over to my mother's apartment to ride out the storm
> there. Although she is also in evacuation area 1,
> she
> is in a very sturdy ground floor brick apartment
> building that was practically undamaged by Hurricane
> Camille in the late 60's (other than some very minor
> flooding and busted windows). Unfortunately, I have
> no where else to go. The hotels for at least a 300
> mile radius of here have been booked for over a week
> from what I found out yesterday when I tried to book
> one.
>
> Anyway, FedEx has ceased operations in this area
> temporarily until the storm has passed. They hope
> to
> resume regular deliveries and pick-ups possibly
> Monday, or as soon as is possible to safely do so.
>
> I am letting you know all these things since you
> have
> purchased a reptile(s) from me which has not yet
> shipped. Please know that I am doing everything
> humanly possible to protect my family, which
> includes
> my pets and reptiles.
>
> We will most likely lose power here for several days
> if/when the hurricane makes landfall anywhere near
> our
> area. This means that I will not be able to access
> my
> e-mail until power is restored to my area. Just
> wanted to let you know in case you e-mail me and do
> not receive a response.
>
> Also, just before I leave, I will post a "Yahoo Auto
> Response/Vacation" message. You will receive this "away message"
> anytime you e-mail me, as it will be automatically sent to any
> incoming e-mail.
>
> Thank you for your patience and please wish us luck.
>
> This will be my first hurricane. When we make it
> through this one we are going to begin looking for a
> house that is a good bit further inland, since we
> are
> moving at the end of the month anyway.
>
> Thanks again and I will be back in touch ASAP.
>
> Aprylla
>
>
> --- "Gilbert, Shawn I" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > I am so sorry it took so long. After the hat
> water
> > tank went bad in the basement, we had to remove
> the
> > carpeting- which meant disconnecting the computer.
>
> > Then had trouble getting it going again. I made a
> > deposit in my bank account with a check I had
> > received from someone else, but then was told it
> > would not be posted for three days! So when I
> > signed on to make the payment to you, I had
> intended
> > to use my credit card, but it automatically went
> to
> > my bank account. I know that the credit card
> should
> > be the automatic backup, but please let me know if
> > there were any problems.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Aprylla Hall [mailto:[email protected]]
> > Sent: Tue 7/5/2005 9:20 PM
> > To: Gilbert, Shawn I
> > Cc:
> > Subject: RE: Message about: 2005 Female Ball
> > Pythons, Holdbacks, EMERGENCY SALE $25 Each
> >
> >
> >
> > Will go ahead and send you a PayPal invoice in
> case
> > that is how you wanted to pay. I will be from
> mine
> > and my fiancee's (Damien Sentell's) business
> > ([email protected]). Just wanted to let
> > you
> > know. THANKS!
> >
> > Aprylla
> >
> >
> > --- "Gilbert, Shawn I" <[email protected]>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > I am sorry for not checking my e-mail after our
> > last
> > > message together, I thought everything was set
> > for
> > > me to purchase all of them. My hot water tank
> > went
> > > bad and I had to replace it and have been off
> the
> > > computer since we last talked on the 3rd.
> Please
> > > tell me you haven't sold them.
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Aprylla Hall
> > [mailto:[email protected]]
> > > Sent: Mon 7/4/2005 5:23 PM
> > > To: Gilbert, Shawn I
> > > Cc:
> > > Subject: RE: Message about: 2005 Female
> > Ball
> > > Pythons, Holdbacks, EMERGENCY SALE $25 Each
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > I'm not sure what I could send you since
> I
> > don't
> > > have
> > > anything regarding these. If you'd like
> I
> > could
> > > type
> > > up a guarantee that these are CB and send
> > it with
> > > them...? Other than that there is no
> > paperwork,
> > > since
> > > they are nothing special except for
> normals
> > > (meaning
> > > not "het" for anything).
> > >
> > > Please let me know if you wanted them or
> > not, its
> > > ok
> > > if you don't, I have 4 other people who
> > want to
> > > purchase a total of 12, so I have other
> > buyers
> > > lined
> > > up if you have decided not to purchase
> > them. :)
> > >
> > > Just let me know. THANKS!
> > >
> > > Aprylla
> > >
> > >
> > > --- "Gilbert, Shawn I"

I believe this message, which was early on, was "truncated".
 
"The complaint was filed when she responded to my request for verification without supplying a phone number to verify the breeder and stating she would be away from her computer."

So you filed a complaint with paypal and froze up her account over a verification issue that SHOULD have been discussed before the deal was ever sealed and money was sent. Smart move... The deal was done. You had no business making additional demands. The deal was not for CB Snakes with papers from the original breeder. It was for cb ball pythons. If you needed some sort of verification, you should have made the request BEFORE the deal was finalized.

"I would think it would be easy for all to understand that it looked like an excuse or a delay tactic (or at least could have been) which would provide her the time to empty her account and leave me helpless."

What it looked like or could have been is really irrelevant. You acted impulsively, and yes, in my opinion you did jump the gun with your complaint. Did you ever call her? I think she more than explained things to you during the situation and after.

"It was only AFTER that she explained that she did not want to provide a number for the breeder because she felt she would be compromising her wholesale source."

Again, was the original deal contingent on her providing you some sort of proof? You should realize that most brokers do not give out the contact info to their wholesale sources for obvious reasons. If you as a buyer do not like this, than you as a buyer always have the option to pass on the deal, and deal with someone else. After you send money, you cannot make additional demands and then file a complaint with paypal because she would not give you that Information. She offered to send you replacements and some extras for your trouble. If you did not like it or if you felt it too fishy, I would not fault you for one second, but you should have simply asked for a refund instead of filing the complaint.

"I was still willing to wait for the shipment (not "jump the gun" pch101) at this point however, she fails to tell you that she still refused to ship the snakes unless I canceled the complaint."

Are you not listening to her? Apparently she is broke due to some unfortunate circumstances. Circumstances that she made you aware of. Then you froze her only access to any funds that she had. She could send through UPS, but If I were her, I would not either. I would just wait for the refund and be done with you for good.

"I'm sure that everyone has had experience with people that have lied to them by contradicting themselves and that was the way they were caught- in their inconsistencies."

I think you are a little paranoid and impulsive, and I think that you became your own worst enemy.

"I'm not saying she DID lie, just that is was another very suspicious pattern in a circumstance that contained MANY suspicious circumstances."


All you needed to do was just turn on CNN. There was indeed a Hurricane...

"I explained this to her and apologized by telling her I could not cancel the complaint until I actually received the animals-"

COULD not remove it? Don't you mean WOULD not remove it? So what was it that was the problem here. She set up a time with you to ship the animals and explained everything, and you still filed a complaint because you did not get the additional info that you felt you were entitled to. Well, you were not.

"after all, she had the money and the merchandise and was telling me she could not trust ME! "

Actually, I would not trust you at this point either. For such a suspicious guy. surely you can see that it looks as though you are attempting to take advantage of the situation and double dip just like the previous customer did to her. Not saying that you would, but it certainly could be looked that way. See my point...

"Aprylla and pch101 are obviously friends and even quote each other with the "Jumping the gun" phrase. "

Here is a perfect example of your "gun jumping" ways. I was and have been very objective here. I have maintained through this entire thread that I felt you acted too early with the complaint. However, I have been very critical of Aprylla throughout most of this thread, even though you had provided us with no evidence (up until just now by way of Jim) of anything even after being asked to do so repeatedly. Now that she has come here it is quite clear to me why you are in this situation. You tried to kick her while she was down because you could not get the info that you wanted after the deal was already done, and in kicking her you ended up breaking your foot in the process and crippling the both of you. Now, let me explain one last thing to you Mr. quick draw McGraw. I have never dealt with , or spoken to Aprylla that I am aware of. We are not friends, and I assume she quoted me, because I have such a great way words with words! I think this thread is just an example of your inexperience and quickness to jump to false conclusions. I have some advice for you, if you do not trust someone than do not make deals with them.
 
Well both of you are stuck! Aprylla says she cannot ship or refund because of her frozen account being tied to FedEx also, but she is afraid that as soon as she sends either money or snakes Shawn will end up with his money and the snakes or double his money back.

Shawn wants either his money or the snakes before he is willing to lift the complaint.

Crap happens, but please do not pick it up and throw it at others, it end up on them and yourself. Personally I think the ball is in your hands Shawn. Maybe you ought to lift the complaint and find out if PayPal will send you your money. If not, then return the complaint and let Aprylla stay financially lost. Being stubborn may end up with this thread being far longer then is necessary.
 
I went and checked out Aprylla's auctions on ebay and saw a pair of pants my husband would like. Her auctions all state that she accepts Pay Pal. So I used the "Buy It Now" option and paid for them via Pay Pal. Here is the confirmation email I just received-

Dear Kellie Hammack,

This email confirms that you, kellihiss, have paid [email protected] $13.04 USD using PayPal.

If you have questions about the shipping and tracking of your purchased item or service, please contact the seller [email protected].

Just figured I would post this. Hope I get the pants.
 
So, do I now retract my last post and say "Aprylla pay up or ship the snakes"?
 
KelliH said:
I went and checked out Aprylla's auctions on ebay and saw a pair of pants my husband would like. Her auctions all state that she accepts Pay Pal. So I used the "Buy It Now" option and paid for them via Pay Pal. Here is the confirmation email I just received-



Just figured I would post this. Hope I get the pants.

Yes you will receive the pants, LOL. I will have them shipped out tomororw morning via USPS.

Because my only source of income right now is my Ebay auctions, I asked PayPal the other day if I could have a PayPal account in my own name (the other account belongs to Damien, my fiancee, his is the account in dispute/frozen/limited). PayPal told me that I could have my own account in my name (since Damien was the only person listed on his) so long as it didn't have the same bank account attached to it because that is not allowed. So I re-opened my old savings acount and deposited thier minimum $25.00 in the account. I then opened a PayPal account in my own name in order to be able to accept PayPal payments. The account that is frozen in this dispute is Damien ([email protected]) *my* account is ([email protected]). My account was just verified this afternoon since the 2 small deposits PayPal deposits to verify the the account just showed up this afternoon.

So yes, now I *do* have a way to receive money again on my Ebay auctions, there is now $17.79 in my PayPal acount if anyone is interested, LOL. As I stated before, Ebay is my only source of income at this point, and I am listing in the next few days basically everything I won on there in order to get the $$ together we need to move (99.0 % of my Ebay customers use PayPal to pay and would probably not buy otherwise unless they could use PayPal). I do not feel this was in ANY way dishonest, I even asked PayPal first if this was acceptable, and only opened my own account after hearing back from them. However, it will be 60 DAYS before I qualify to get a PayPal debit/credit card so that I can *fully* re-instate my FedEx account.

I also just got my Account Rep's supervisor on the phone at FedEx and told him the situation, he was sympathetic and understood that over the past year or so I have shipped over 150 packages with them and spent a lot of money shipping with them, and would like to continue to do so. He has agreed for the one load of shipments (6 or 7 packages) to let me give them a cashier's check for the full amount of my packages that I am shipping out on Monday to other Buyers who have been patiently waiting as I wait to have my FedEx account re-instated.
 
Ok, well if the Pay Pal hadn't been accepted I would have mailed you a money order. I completely understand about desperate and horrible situations. If you had anything else listed I could have used I would have bought those items also.

I was actually surprised when the Pay Pal went through, since a few posts ago you said that you were unable to receive Pay Pal for Ebay transactions and that some of your Ebay customers were irritated by it. Surprised enough to feel I needed to post that information in this thread.

Anyway, that is all.
 
Shawn,

Given that Aprylla has come here and given a reasonable explanation and has an excellent reputation I would remove the complaint. Hopefully that unfreezes the account so that she can then issue the refund. I believe that she will.
 
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