Beware Chameleon Counters

[monkeywrench133]

My apologies, I got my "Coles" mixed up. Ben Cole is the thread originator, and the picture of him with his spitting cobra is post #72.

 

[lanceheads]

Erin,
Go back and re-read my post.
I said it never happened to me. AND I don't believe they can spit while suspended.
Never said 100%, etc....with certainy that they WON'T spray/spit. I said it never happened to me and I explained my thoughts about spitters behavior.

When accessing them from an enclosure, I DO wear a full face sheild.

Arrogant and condensending??

And please, if you have a hard-on for Keith and his pictures, TELL HIM.

I stated MY OPINION of working/breeding Spitting Cobra's for 20 years.
Go get 20 years experience on working cobra's and come back and discuss it with me.

 

[Keith Northrop]

Baghdad Bob Welcome aboard!

As Keith's new PR Front man I can tell you "We are winning the War"......"The
Negative Karma you see is actually positive trader rating" "We are winning the....

 

[Adam80]

wow i feel bad for yall

300 some odd pages of people flashing their epeens and for what? arguing with someone like keith via the internet is like competing in the special olympics; even if you win your still retarded...gl with your business keith hopefully youll sell enough herps to get a nice el camino to park outside of your trailer...best wishes - Adam Turner

 

[Adam80]

posts not pages

i meant to say 300 some odd posts not pages...my bad -Adam Turner

 

[Adam80]

oh yeah

BTW I forgot to say how disgusting this whole thread was...its probably the most hideous, racist, most innappropriate piece of web junk Ive ever seen on a forum that is supposed to provide a useful resource to herp keepers...shame on all of you...tax reports, aerial photos, rap sheets...wtf is wrong with yall? the sad thing is that you are grown men and women Im sure many of you have children, why would any of you stoop so low? not only is it completely unnecessary...its down right scary...the scariest part about all of this is the fact that people of your maturity levels handle venomous reptiles, I wouldnt trust some of you with a bowl of cheerios in a rubber room...many people replied that they found this thread amusing but let me assure there is nothing comical about racist comments, vulgarity, and threats ...I would like to believe that everyone involved in this kind of behavior on this thread are better people than how they have represented themselves here, and I sincerely hope this type of behavior is not going to be the status quo for this forum...If it is then I see no reason for the BOI to continue -Adam Turner

 

[Cat_72]

its probably the most hideous, racist, most innappropriate piece of web junk Ive ever seen on a forum that is supposed to provide a useful resource to herp keepers...shame on all of you

And THIS statement by you is not any of those things?

arguing with someone like keith via the internet is like competing in the special olympics; even if you win your still retarded...gl with your business keith hopefully youll sell enough herps to get a nice el camino to park outside of your trailer...

Pot, meet kettle.

 

[Stardust]

Well I guess I am going to be the odd person out (story of my life).
People seem to be up in arms about this guy Keith, honestly all tho some of the time over the top, he is also funny and is finding the humor in all the shock and awe, lol Sounds like he is pulling a lot of chains and pressing button and having a great time doing so.
The bottom line that I see if thus far I have yet to read a bad sale, I have checked out his site it looks clean and well kept.
OK he has a past, it is just that, the past, he is apparently not losing any business over it and has moved on with his life.
Judge for yourself on whether you would do business with the guy, but I thought the BOI was for ousting bad guys who rip people off and about their animals and dealing I am not even sure why this is on here as a bad guy.

 

[Adam80]

fair enough

Agreed that probably wasnt the most tasteful thing to say but after reading through 60 pages of racist, derogatory, and anti american rhetoric from keith I was a kinda pissed...I dont think my tongue in cheek comment about an el camino compares to the horrible things keith has typed on this thread...my main beef with this thread aside from the overt vulgarity was the fact that peoples personal lives were being invaded to an extent that i find innappropriate for this type of forum...it was scary...it has made me nervous about the fact that I have posted my full name and where i live on this site...and although what I typed may have been a tad bit contradictory Im suprised that someone like you Cat (whose posts ive always found to be pretty dead on) would miss the point of what I said and liken my el camino comment to:

"Wes, you signed your post "Dumbass" That fits you perfect.....How many Pollacks' does
take to screw in a light bulb......Duhh...Never mind......DumbAss...."
__________________
Keith Northrop
Chameleon Counters
www.ChameleonCounters.com
[email protected]
(254-542-8200)

and

T Sutton,What sucks is a Hoover,your mama must have big stock in that
Company. Watch out who you let wire your ass up. Get out of Ben Coles Ass.
It could be better for you health. F**k you and Anyone that likes
you.....Jihad American Pig



Keith M. Northrop
Chameleon Counters
2205 E. HWY 190
Copperas Cove, TX 76522
(254) 542-8200
www.ChameleonCounters.com

Again I appolgize if my trailer/el camino comment offended you Cat but I think its a far cry from some of the trash typed on this thread -Adam Turner

 

[Cat_72]

While what you typed may not be "as offensive" to some as what Keith has said, it is still offensive....could be more offensive to some. How about the parent of a mentally handicapped child who happens to proudly participate in the Special Olympics? I wasn't comparing what you posted to anything else posted on this thread, I just found it hard to believe that you followed it up with a post admonishing others for posting derogatory things.

 

[tac6]

 

[Adam80]

...

Again I think you missed the point of what I was trying to say and instead choose to focus on semantics...the whole special olympics thing was just a joking way of saying that arguing with someone via the net is pointless...I seriously doubt the mother of a handicapped person would be offended by what I said...and the derogatory banter on the thread was not really my main problem...what bothered me was the threats and the dredging up of people's personal information...and for what? is there a problem with keiths animals? no. Did keith rip someone off? no. was the picture he posted a little irresponsible? sure it was. but how do we go from that to posting the mans IRS audit? at first I was outraged by what keith said but the more I think about it the more I understand that he was just trying to get a rise out of a group of hypocritical wordsmiths who will say w/e and drag out as much dirty laundry as they can find, just for the sake of arguement...I've tried to explain my view on this...but too many people here think theyre dog the bounty hunter, and the rest of you are too busy arguing semantics to understand what im trying to say...Cat I look forward to you picking this post apart on your 4008 post inside two years...I m sure ive mispelled a word or two or said something you can take and run with for another 30-40 posts on this thread but im done ...goodnight and goodluck -Adam Turner

 

[tejasranger]

Good post Cathy

While what you typed may not be "as offensive" to some as what Keith has said, it is still offensive....could be more offensive to some. How about the parent of a mentally handicapped child who happens to proudly participate in the Special Olympics? I wasn't comparing what you posted to anything else posted on this thread, I just found it hard to believe that you followed it up with a post admonishing others for posting derogatory things.

Adam you just don't get it. Freedom of Speech protections allow Keith to say what he said. You have every right to disagree, but that's where it ends. Every person that is now or has been in the military swears an oath to protect and defend the Constitution of the United States. So in a way your complaining insults all of them. Do you know that Copperas Cove, TX is just a stones throw from Ft Hood? So if your are so upset,why don't you go stand in front of Keith's store with a sign and see how much support you get. Easier still would be for you to not read this thread again.

 

[Keith Northrop]

If I can't say anything nice.....(30 day trial)

I will refrain from saying it..........I notice that I am ranked with "Alltime Losers"......-400 plus Karma with not even so much as a House gecko shipped
with a regenerated tail.....Haha......Your talking to the man who advised everyone to Buy DELL's stock....(1993).......Become independant...say what,
where,when and why without fear. Ok...Ok...I got one for you..real Karma here...Mike...Were ever you are "Come Get your Croc Skull"!!!!!! I've had it for 3 years now...Mike shot a 12' Nile Croc(African Safari) and had the head sent back to the States.....It took several months and a couple hundred dollars to complete the restoration.....Since I never discussed price before only cost...the $250 I asked freaked him out....He disapperaed for three years....06/27/06....I got tagged by a 2' Western Diamondback Rattlesnake,
2 days later I was Dehydrated and Having visions..(Thats when I got Medical attention)...That's also when the Croc Skull started talking......HaHa....Said I was wrong....that I was trying to screw Mike out of the Skull....That Skull has been sitting there 3 years plus...It never peeped a word. Now this is where it gets wierd........My first Day back at the Job (one week Later) I am
talking to a Good regular customer, who tells me about her new Boy friend...
Yep...It was Mike....He came into my store the next day.....bought a snapping turtle.....Doesn't mention the Skull....I had my chance to make it
right.....I blew it......The girl has since dumped him....and he has gone off the
radar again............Now that's Karma.......Haha........

 

[Suncoast Herpetological]

Adam

I think you will find if you actually read through the entire thread that no mention of any of Keith's personal information was made until he began posting personal items about other posters on the thread. Also, nothing that was posted about Keith was not Public record. Matters of Public Record are protected under the Freedom of Information Act and are, therefore fair game.

Several of the items either posted by Keith or items he referenced or alluded to having possession of WERE NOT Public Record. Possessing those items or even stating you have them and referencing them is identity theft....also known as a Federal Crime.


Robert

Your reference to the Bill of Rights and Freedom of Speech was interesting but misused and incorrect in this instance. That particular amendment refers to Congress not being able to pass laws curtailing that particular freedom. On a privately owned Forum such as this, the Bill of Rights does not offer any protection whatsoever. Keith has the "right" to spout his drivel on his own site or standing on a public street corner. He has absolutely no right to do so here unless Webslave says he does.

Here is the pertinent passage from the 1st Amendment:

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech,

At no time and in no place in this Country does he have the "right" to post SS numbers or state that he has hacked Bank Records from a Federal institution.

Incidentally, he has done both of those things in this thread

 

[Keith Northrop]

Hey Jim-O.....

You're giving me way to much credit...(No pun intended).........Your last 9 digits of your DL# happen to be the same.....Public info...open game as you say....I Bluffed you and others into thinking I compromised your financal info.....Haha....I did look up FL propertyTaxes.....Public Info....Once again.....Make assumptions.......You assume wrong.....I'm just
saying "Hey you get off of my Cloud" or risk getting vaporized......

 

[Jim O]

You're giving me way to much credit...(No pun intended).........Your last 9 digits of your DL# happen to be the same.....Public info...open game as you say....I Bluffed you and others into thinking I compromised your financal info.....Haha....I did look up FL propertyTaxes.....Public Info....Once again.....Make assumptions.......You assume wrong.....I'm just
saying "Hey you get off of my Cloud" or risk getting vaporized......

You did post someone's DL number which was deleted. If that was a DL number you obtained it illegally as states are prohibited from disclosing that information for personal use. Here is the relevant statute, the Drivers Privacy Protection Act of 1994:

Section 2721. Prohibition on release and use of certain personal information from State

motor vehicle records



(a) In General -- Except as provided in subsection (b), a State department of motor vehicles, and any officer, employee, or contractor, thereof, shall not knowingly disclose or otherwise make available to any person or entity personal information about any individualobtained by the department in connection with a motor vehicle record.



(b) Permissible Uses -- Personal information referred to in subsection (a) shall be disclosed for use in connection with matters of motor vehicle or driver safety and theft, motorvehicle emissions, motor vehicle product alterations, recalls, or advisories, performancemonitoring of motor vehicles and dealers by motor vehicle manufacturers, and removal of non-owner records from the original owner records of motor vehicle manufacturers to carry out thepurposes of the Automobile Information Disclosure Act, the Motor Vehicle Information and CostSaving Act, the National Traffic and Motor Vehicle Safety Act of 1966, the Anti-Car Theft Act of1992, and the Clean Air Act, and may be disclosed as follows:



(1) For use by any government agency, including any court or law enforcementagency, in carrying out its functions, or any private person or entity acting on behalf of a Federal, State, or local agency in carrying out its functions.



(2) For use in connection with matters of motor vehicle or driver safety and theft; motor vehicle emissions; motor vehicle product alterations, recalls, or advisories;performance monitoring of motor vehicles, motor vehicle parts and dealers; motorvehicle market research activities, including survey research; and removal of non-ownerrecords from the original owner records of motor vehicle manufacturers.



(3) For use in the normal course of business by a legitimate business or its agents, employees, or contractors, but only --



(A) to verify the accuracy of personal information submitted by the individual to the business or its agents, employees, or contractors; and



(B) if such information as so submitted is not correct or is no longer correct, to obtain the correct information, but only for the purposes of preventing fraud by, pursuing legal remedies against, or recovering on a debt or security interest against, the individual.



(4) For use in connection with any civil, criminal, administrative, or arbitral proceeding in any Federal, State, or local court or agency or before any self-regulatory body, including the service of process, investigation in anticipation of litigation, and the execution or enforcement of judgments and orders, or pursuant to an order of a Federal, State, or local court.



(5) For use in research activities, and for use in producing statistical reports, so long as the personal information is not published, redisclosed, or used to contact individuals.



(6) For use by any insurer or insurance support organization, or by a self-insured entity, or its agents, employees, or contractors, in connection with claims investigation activities, anti-fraud activities, rating or underwriting.



(7) For use in providing notice to the owners of towed or impounded vehicles.



(8) For use by any licensed private investigative agency or licensed security service for any purpose permitted under this subsection.



(9) For use by an employer or its agents or insurer to obtain or verify information relating to a holder of a commercial driver's license that is required under theCommercial Motor Vehicle Safety Act of 1986 (49 U.S.C. App. 2710 et seq.).



(10) For use in connection with the operation of private toll transportation facilities.



(11) For any other use in response to requests for individual motor vehicle records if the motor vehicle department has provided in a clear and conspicuous manner on forms for issuance or renewal of operator's permits, titles, registrations, or identification cards, notice that personal information collected by the department may be disclosed to any business or person, and has provided in a clear and conspicuous manner on such forms an opportunity to prohibit such disclosures.



(12) For bulk distribution for surveys, marketing or solicitations if the motorvehicle department has implemented methods and procedures to ensure that --



(A) individuals are provided an opportunity, in a clear and conspicuous manner, to prohibit such uses; and



(B) the information will be used, rented, or sold solely for bulk distribution for surveys, marketing, and solicitations, and that surveys, marketing, and solicitations will not be directed at those individuals who have requested in a timely fashion that they not be directed at them.



(13) For use by any requester, if the requester demonstrates it has obtained the written consent of the individual to whom the information pertains.



(14) For any other use specifically authorized under the law of the State that holds the record, if such use is related to the operation of a motor vehicle or public safety.




(c) Resale or Redisclosure -- An authorized recipient of personal information (except a recipient under subsection (b)(11) or (12)) may resell or redisclose the information only for a use permitted under subsection (b) (but not for uses under subsection (b)(11) or (12)). An authorized recipient under subsection (b)(11) may resell or redisclose personal information for any purpose. An authorized recipient under subsection (b)(12) may resell or redisclose personal information pursuant to subsection (b)(12). Any authorized recipient (except a recipient under subsection(b)(11)) that resells or rediscloses personal information covered by this title must keep for a period of 5 years records identifying each person or entity that receives information and the permitted purpose for which the information will be used and must make such records available to the motor vehicle department upon request.



(d) Waiver Procedures -- A State motor vehicle department may establish and carry out procedures under which the department or its agents, upon receiving a request for personalinformation that does not fall within one of the exceptions in subsection (b), may mail a copy of the request to the individual about whom the information was requested, informing suchindividual of the request, together with a statement to the effect that the information will not be released unless the individual waives such individual's right to privacy under this section.



Section 2722. Additional unlawful acts



(a) Procurement for Unlawful Purpose -- It shall be unlawful for any person knowingly to obtain or disclose personal information, from a motor vehicle record, for any use not permitted under section 2721(b) of this title.



(b) False Representation -- It shall be unlawful for any person to make false representation to obtain any personal information from an individual's motor vehicle record.



Section 2723. Penalties



(a) Criminal Fine -- A person who knowingly violates this chapter shall be fined underthis title.



(b) Violations by State Department of Motor Vehicles -- Any State department of motor vehicles that has a policy or practice of substantial noncompliance with this chapter shall be subject to a civil penalty imposed by the Attorney General of not more than $5,000 a day for each day of substantial noncompliance.



Section 2724. Civil action



(a) Cause of Action -- A person who knowingly obtains, discloses or uses personal information, from a motor vehicle record, for a purpose not permitted under this chapter shall be liable to the individual to whom the information pertains, who may bring a civil action in a United States district court.



(b) Remedies -- The court may award --



(1) actual damages, but not less than liquidated damages in the amount of $2,500;



(2) punitive damages upon proof of willful or reckless disregard of the law;



(3) reasonable attorneys' fees and other litigation costs reasonably incurred; and



(4) such other preliminary and equitable relief as the court determines to be appropriate.



Section 2725. Definitions



In this chapter --



(1) "motor vehicle record" means any record that pertains to a motor vehicle operator's permit, motor vehicle title, motor vehicle registration, or identification card issued by a department of motor vehicles;



(2) "person" means an individual, organization or entity, but does not include a State or agency thereof; and



(3) "personal information" means information that identifies an individual,including an individual's photograph, social security number, driver identification number,name, address (but not the 5-digit zip code), telephone number, and medical or disabilityinformation, but does not include information on vehicular accidents, driving violations,and driver's status.

So if, and I repeat if, you have any DL numbers, you have them illegally. They are not "public info" open to your intrusion. And wherever they came from may also be liable to criminal penalties. So when you published Mike G's numbers, was that a bluff, or a real number? Maybe the FBI should look into it. What's the nearest FBI office to you Keith? I'll call them in the morning. They can decide if you're bluffing.

While I'm at it, I'll call Ernie Lee (http://www.ci.copperas-cove.tx.us/pages/animal_control/animal_control.htm) about how you handle venomous reptiles.

Or maybe I'm bluffing...

As for FL real estate taxes, whatever has that to do with me?

 

[Intense Herpetoculture]

Sorry, Jimo, but for many years I used to obtain DL numbers from the state under the freedom of information act. They gave them out each and every time.

As for Ernie, they all know Keith has venomous, that he has been biten, call Ernie, see what he says.

You did post someone's DL number which was deleted. If that was a DL number you obtained it illegally as states are prohibited from disclosing that information for personal use. Here is the relevant statute, the Drivers Privacy Protection Act of 1994:

So if, and I repeat if, you have any DL numbers, you have them illegally. They are not "public info" open to your intrusion. And wherever they came from may also be liable to criminal penalties. So when you published Mike G's numbers, was that a bluff, or a real number? Maybe the FBI should look into it. What's the nearest FBI office to you Keith? I'll call them in the morning. They can decide if you're bluffing.

While I'm at it, I'll call Ernie Lee (http://www.ci.copperas-cove.tx.us/pages/animal_control/animal_control.htm) about how you handle venomous reptiles.

Or maybe I'm bluffing...

As for FL real estate taxes, whatever has that to do with me?

 

[Jim O]

Sorry, Jimo, but for many years I used to obtain DL numbers from the state under the freedom of information act. They gave them out each and every time

Obtaining them for legitimate use is legal. Redisclosing is not. Read the statute Justyn. Keith published someone's DL number here. That is a illegal. Keep defending it and it refelcts well on you and your regard for people's privacy.

As for the Freedom of Information Act, that is a Federal statute (see http://www.usdoj.gov/oip/index.html) and has no bearing on states, so you either do not know what the applicable state statute is, or you're being less than honest. I really do not care. The above, as I posted it, is applicable federal statute and is binding on all states. Want to test it? Get my DL number and publish it here and see what happens to you.

As for your state, Texas, the release of said information is governed by the Public Information Act. There is a nice lengthy PDF at http://oag.state.tx.us/AG_Publications/pdfs/publicinfo_hb2006.pdf which says, in part:

Section 552.130 of the Government Code provides as follows:
(a) Information is excepted from [required public disclosure] if the information relates to:
(1) a motor vehicle operator’s or driver’s license or permit issued by an agency of this state;
(2) a motor vehicle title or registration issued by an agency of this state;
or
(3) a personal identification document issued by an agency of this state or a local agency authorized to issue an identification document.

(b) Information described by Subsection (a) may be released only if, and in the manner, authorized by Chapter 730, Transportation Code.

Examples of information excepted from required public disclosure under section 552.130(a)(1) include the license number, class, restrictions, and expiration date of a driver’s license issued by an agency of the State of Texas.

Examples of information excepted from disclosure under section 552.130(a)(2) include a vehicle identification number and license plate number relating to a title or registration issued by an agency of the State of Texas. Information relating to a license, title, or registration issued by a state other than Texas is not excepted from disclosure under section 552.130.

So...you can't legally get Texas DL numbers (they are EXCEPTED from required public disclosure) and Freedom of Information Act is irrelevant. Blasts a hole in your story, doesn't it?

BTW, just what were you doing obtaining DL numbers?

 

[Cat_72]

Again I think you missed the point of what I was trying to say and instead choose to focus on semantics...the whole special olympics thing was just a joking way of saying that arguing with someone via the net is pointless...I seriously doubt the mother of a handicapped person would be offended by what I said...and the derogatory banter on the thread was not really my main problem...what bothered me was the threats and the dredging up of people's personal information...and for what? is there a problem with keiths animals? no. Did keith rip someone off? no. was the picture he posted a little irresponsible? sure it was. but how do we go from that to posting the mans IRS audit? at first I was outraged by what keith said but the more I think about it the more I understand that he was just trying to get a rise out of a group of hypocritical wordsmiths who will say w/e and drag out as much dirty laundry as they can find, just for the sake of arguement...I've tried to explain my view on this...but too many people here think theyre dog the bounty hunter, and the rest of you are too busy arguing semantics to understand what im trying to say...Cat I look forward to you picking this post apart on your 4008 post inside two years...I m sure ive mispelled a word or two or said something you can take and run with for another 30-40 posts on this thread but im done ...goodnight and goodluck -Adam Turner

Again, I was not compaing the content of your post to the others here. I'm sorry if you don't understand that....and it has nothing to do with semantics however you choose to spin it.
I understand your point, and did not say I completely disagree with it, however if you could have made it without the "retarded" and "trailer trash" type comments, your post would not have seemed quite so hypocritical. Doubt how much someone could be offended all you want....you don't know until that person tells you so.