Info *BEWARE* Jim Stelpflug-Questionable Ethics

[DavidBeard]

An interesting conversation occurred just a moment ago on Facebook between myself and Jim (James?) Stelpflug. I believe he runs some shows in Wisconsin and maybe has another business name, I'm not entirely sure. We were casual friends on FB only recently and I'm not super familiar with the guy, but based on my interaction tonight I would question dealing with him thoroughly based purely on his admission of a lack of character screening when it comes to who he does business with.

Jim made a post about some new snakes he received and tagged Manny Frade (Perfect Predators, known criminal and less-than-ethical-to-say-the-least character) in the post. I made an inquiry on his post of whether or not its the same Manny Frade who was arrested for stealing money from senior citizens, and my post was deleted. Shortly after I made a couple follow up posts on Jim's post, including a link to a news article detailing Frade's criminal run-in last year, Jim deleted those other 2 posts and then un-friended me.

I thought it was odd, so I sent him a message on FB messenger and he went on to admit that he doesn't care what Grade has done, and deals regularly with other criminals in the hobby despite being fully aware of their sordid past/ethics. I feel strongly that someone who deals with people of a seedy nature knowingly only seeking our personal gain is a person lacking in moral fibre themselves. I have a feeling I'm not alone in this, so I wanted to make this information available to others where Jim cannot sweep it under the proverbial rug.

Unfortunately I was not able to get screen shots of my posts on Jim's post because he deleted them rather quickly, and I did not check FB again after making my initial post for 30+ minutes. I only have a notification showing that I had indeed replied to Jim's post, so hopefully that part makes sense.

 

[Snakesatsunset]

OF ALL PEOPLE in the industry, Jim is the most HONEST, Friendliest, most go out of the way for you be it customer or not person in the entire business. This post is not even in the guidelines of posting. This is not merit for a bad guy post.
Jim is one of the BEST guys in the business, and who cares who he does or has done business with. WE HAVE ALL DONE BUSINESS with someone who is not liked in this business, especially if they actually run a TRUE business (aka running shows, breeding operation with thousands of animals, thousands of rodents, etc) .

This is probably top post ever on Fauna for most ASSuming post ever. No evidence, no bad deal, no malice, no anything. Just someone who doesn't like someone so put someone else on a bad guy post because of personal opinion.

You TROLLED him on his own facebook page. You went out of your way to steal the post to something none of your business. He posted boashe got, tagged boa people for their opinions on his page, and you started posting unsolicitated aka TROLLING.

How did you not ASSume he wanted Manny to see he spent money elsewhere? or that he might have wanted to show Manny he got something he paid for, maybe Manny ripped him off, so Jim posted he got the animals anyways? You have no CLUE why he tagged Manny. You have actually NO RIGHT, and he has no MANDATORY OBLIGATION TO EXPLAIN SQUAT to you.

You see just by this post, and taking your time to go out of your way to post(troll) Jim, you have no Idea who JIM is. He is the guy that will not talk crap of anyone, even if you bring someone up to talk crap about. He is mindful, respectful, and believes its not his place to throw people under the bus no matter what.

JIM is one of a kind, incredibly nice and honest dude, and this business would not have the problems it has if people were more like him.

 

[Rhacosaurus Gex]

You made a BOI because someone didn't pass judgment on a guy to internet posts and rather make his own judgements? That is his business not yours.

 

[caffeinecynic]

Yeah no.

I'm no fan of Manny Frade, based on his legal troubles, and I admit that I kinda frown when I see people support the people in this hobby who are known for causing issues - but -

Jim Stelpflug has a stellar, golden reputation. The man is nothing if not professional to everyone he deals with; he goes above and beyond for his customers and for his friends. If he wants to deal with Manny, knowing the risks he's taking, that is his business in the end.

As far as I'm concerned, it changes nothing. I get that this is an info thread, but I think it's not really fair. Jim's not out defending Manny's actions, he's not out condoning them, and as he put it - that's Manny's business and has nothing to do with him.

 

[Fangthane]

Well, for all the apparently positive aspects of the subject, this thread also points out a negative for people to consider. If you're purchasing from the known dregs of the hobby, you are playing a tangible part in keeping them around to screw others. I can easily understand how some could choose to see that financial support as defending/condoning their shadiness - it's certainly not taking any kind of stand against it.

I doubt I'd really be able to bring myself to post a thread just to point out who someone chooses to associate with, but I don't really have any problem with David's choice to do so. If someone feels good about willingly sending their dollars to someone who's known to steal them from others, I also find myself in the camp that believes that's saying very unflattering things about such a person.

If name recognition compels you to defend someone who's choosing to financially support scammers, maybe that's saying something about you that you may want to seriously think about. Doesn't it seem counterproductive - bordering on hypocritical - to actively participate on a forum dedicated, in part, to outing the scammers, just to turn a blind eye on those who - actively, knowingly - help perpetuate their existence?

 

[caffeinecynic]

If name recognition compels you to defend someone who's choosing to financially support scammers, maybe that's saying something about you that you may want to seriously think about. Doesn't it seem counterproductive - bordering on hypocritical - to actively participate on a forum dedicated, in part, to outing the scammers, just to turn a blind eye on those who - actively, knowingly - help perpetuate their existence?

A lot of assumptions were made about the start of this post, though. Frankly, just because someone receives animals from another name in the hobby does not mean they bought or traded with them recently. For all we know, Jim might've gotten animals from Manny from a deal years and years old, that he was making right with him. Because we don't know those details, I think it's presumptuous to judge him for it - my two cents. Equally: I don't feel an explanation is owed to an outside party not involved in the transaction.

Just how I feel about it.

 

[Fangthane]

A lot of assumptions were made about the start of this post, though. Frankly, just because someone receives animals from another name in the hobby does not mean they bought or traded with them recently.

His need to point out other possibly questionable people he does business with - present tense - suggests that the timing isn't relevant. Based on his own writings, their past apparently makes no difference to him.

 

[Jim@SW]

His need to point out other possibly questionable people he does business with - present tense - suggests that the timing isn't relevant. Based on his own writings, their past apparently makes no difference to him.

I have been in this industry 35 years. The gentleman I named that I did past business with had issues with the law after my dealings. Fangthane if I were to purchase a animal from someone today. And the shoot and killed someone tomorrow. In your world I am a "bad guy"

My god this post is so ridiculous. Mr Beard got booted from a Facebook group we are in. Now he brings it here. All over his hatred of scaleless animals I am guessing? And we produce some

So back to the issue of the boas, and Manny Frade. I paid ZERO dollars for these animals to start with. It was a past trade, and these animals were sent to me yesterday. In some ways I am glad, and a few said I would never see anything. I was raised in a Christian home. I received them yesterday in perfect condition. Mr Frades past his just that. His past. He is the one that has to face the world daily for his actions. Not I, but now Mr Beard feels he needs to judge me without the facts????

 

[Snakesatsunset]

Like I said, ASSumptions made to just TROLL.
Probably one of the most ridiculous, out of spite, non informational posts on this board in AGES.
Literally all it did was make someone post their private business they had with someone who owed them.
Glad you got them Jim!

 

[Fangthane]

Fangthane if I were to purchase a animal from someone today. And the shoot and killed someone tomorrow. In your world I am a "bad guy"

No, but that's not the context of this particular situation. I haven't gone as far as labeling you a "bad guy;" but if you bought from someone who you already knew was a murderer, I would have much trouble seeing you as a very "good guy." Engaging in business with those who are known to be of poor character does nothing but encourage their continued presence in this hobby.

If you're fine with associations that include someone who's scammed retirees out of their savings, as well as screwing multiple people in the reptile business, don't be surprised when some some percentage of us have an issue with that decision. So long as their negative actions continue, you can't say anything is in their past - there are still recent, unresolved threads about Frade's shadiness. You're free to associate with whomever you choose; everyone privy to your choices are free to take that knowledge into consideration when deciding whether they want to include you among their associations.

 

[DavidBeard]

Nobody got booted from any FB groups, Jim. I left on my own accord, ask the admins. I have no personal grudges here, like I said: I barely know you, and honestly had never heard of you before I joined that FB group (Noobs in the Industry To Avoid, a secret group where the members mostly just screen shot new keepers and make fun of them amongst themselves).

Jim doesn't have a completely perfect record, from my research. Looks like he owes $400 to this customer from 2014 when he didn't know the difference between a Yellowbelly Ball and a Spectre:

I did a trade with Jim Stelpflug of SW Reptiles several years ago, and it did not go as planned. I sent a Mojave Het Axanthic male to Jim, in trade for a Spectre male. Both were valued at approximately $1500 at the time of the trade. When I received the "Spectre" male, I asked Jim if he was sure it was a Spectre, as it looked identical to my female YB. He assured me it was. I actually asked a few different times, because I was convinced it was just a YB. He got annoyed and passed me off to the actual breeder who produced the snake. The breeder told me if he did not prove out, he would send me a trio of spectres. I produced an Ivory with the supposed Spectre, which proved it was just a $50 YB male. I talked to the breeder who said he would send me a trio of Spectres, and after a little back and forth, he made good on his promise. Unfortunately, there is probably a $400 or more gap between the value of the trio I got from the breeder, not from Jim, but from the guy Jim passed me off to, and the snake I sent Jim. So, I am having to wait another year for the new Spectre male to get up to breeding size, so no Super Stripes for me until maybe this year.

Mistakes happen, and the breeder followed through with what he said he would do, Jim passed me off, and now will not return my emails regarding the $400 which I feel is still owed to me. I would not do business with Jim again.
__________________
Dark Continent Constrictors

The post can be viewed here:

http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/forums/showthread.php?t=128974

So apparently, his decisions to support known criminals in the hobby and give them his business IS indicative of his own ability to make ethical decisions. That was my point. I have no vendetta towards a person I barely know. I just want people to KNOW who they're dealing with, and the company you keep says a lot about a person.

 

[DavidBeard]

Well, for all the apparently positive aspects of the subject, this thread also points out a negative for people to consider. If you're purchasing from the known dregs of the hobby, you are playing a tangible part in keeping them around to screw others. I can easily understand how some could choose to see that financial support as defending/condoning their shadiness - it's certainly not taking any kind of stand against it.

I doubt I'd really be able to bring myself to post a thread just to point out who someone chooses to associate with, but I don't really have any problem with David's choice to do so. If someone feels good about willingly sending their dollars to someone who's known to steal them from others, I also find myself in the camp that believes that's saying very unflattering things about such a person.

If name recognition compels you to defend someone who's choosing to financially support scammers, maybe that's saying something about you that you may want to seriously think about. Doesn't it seem counterproductive - bordering on hypocritical - to actively participate on a forum dedicated, in part, to outing the scammers, just to turn a blind eye on those who - actively, knowingly - help perpetuate their existence?

Couldn't have said it any better, Dan. You pretty much nailed it.

 

[MomofDnNnD]

(OT) Real nice

Nobody got booted from any FB groups, Jim. I left on my own accord, ask the admins. I have no personal grudges here, like I said: I barely know you, and honestly had never heard of you before I joined that FB group (Noobs in the Industry To Avoid, a secret group where the members mostly just screen shot new keepers and make fun of them amongst themselves).

Real nice. I'd be very curious to see who is in this secret FB group, so I know who to avoid now (and I'm not referring to the Noobs).

 

[Jim@SW]

I guess if we need to talk about #11 of ten years ago roughly. I had a Spector male that belonged to Brock Wagner here. A long with a few others animals that we were working together in joint ventures. So yes I did turn the matter over to Brock. He did handle the matter as I remember it in a professional manner as well. Though like I said it was sometime in the past.

I plainly see the the David and Dan witch hunt will continue no matter for what reasons.
Simply you two feel you need to warn people, because I received some boas in payment for a past debt?

 

[Jim@SW]

I believe I am in 40 Facebook groups. Which I don't remember asking to join one ball python group ever. I get added lol

 

[DavidBeard]

Nobody got booted from any FB groups, Jim. I left on my own accord, ask the admins. I have no personal grudges here, like I said: I barely know you, and honestly had never heard of you before I joined that FB group (Noobs in the Industry To Avoid, a secret group where the members mostly just screen shot new keepers and make fun of them amongst themselves).

Real nice. I'd be very curious to see who is in this secret FB group, so I know who to avoid now (and I'm not referring to the Noobs).

To be perfectly honest I did not recognize 99% of the people in the secret group, but it is run by Tom Pecanic, and its most comprised of self-righteous trolls who do nothing but flap their gums about other people behind their backs. Its very high-school-esque and I was not part of the group for long.

 

[DavidBeard]

I guess if we need to talk about #11 of ten years ago roughly. I had a Spector male that belonged to Brock Wagner here. A long with a few others animals that we were working together in joint ventures. So yes I did turn the matter over to Brock. He did handle the matter as I remember it in a professional manner as well. Though like I said it was sometime in the past.

I plainly see the the David and Dan witch hunt will continue no matter for what reasons.
Simply you two feel you need to warn people, because I received some boas in payment for a past debt?

Length of time does not absolve you of wrong doing, Jim. You dropped the ball. You passed the buck on an animal that YOU sold. Something that a person of such high esteemed reputation would not do, if they were truly of such quality character.

You're missing my point entirely, which is not surprising given your stance on doing business with known criminals and scam artists. Your hyperbolic verbiage ("witch hunt") is a poor attempt at playing some kind of victim, when in reality you're probably not too thrilled that people can see your unscrupulous nature out in the open. You have no problems dealing with folks who rip others off......and coincidentally you have shown in the past the ability to conduct business in a less-than-honest manner, as evident from the Spectre situation.

If you sell an animal as having a certain genetic background, a certain sex, a certain detail that makes it more valuable to prospective buyers, then it is indeed YOUR responsibility to follow through on those details and make amends if a mistake is made. You did no do so, and left the guy to deal with the breeder. I thought you were adamantly opposed to "flippers", based on your posts in the Noobs In The Industry To Avoid group?

 

[Jim@SW]

David I did not own the animal. I did not sell the animal you are talking about. It was in possession, and I shipped the animal. If the animal was was sick, it in poor appearance. Which it was not. Then it was on me. I turned the matter over to Brock. In which I was involved through the process myself. The matter was handled by the snakes owner. I realize you just am getting started with a couple of corns, and a albino ball. I wish you the best, but because I collected a debt in snakes I am at fault?
I guess I didn't realize the the snake group was some secret group deal. Seems as many people talk a lot of this group, and a few others. I don't think it is to secret

 

[Lucille]

If you sell an animal as having a certain genetic background, a certain sex, a certain detail that makes it more valuable to prospective buyers, then it is indeed YOUR responsibility to follow through on those details and make amends if a mistake is made.

There is no time limit on amends. Perhaps the issue could be revisited and the issue put right?

 

[DavidBeard]

David I did not own the animal. I did not sell the animal you are talking about. It was in possession, and I shipped the animal. If the animal was was sick, it in poor appearance. Which it was not. Then it was on me. I turned the matter over to Brock. In which I was involved through the process myself. The matter was handled by the snakes owner. I realize you just am getting started with a couple of corns, and a albino ball. I wish you the best, but because I collected a debt in snakes I am at fault?
I guess I didn't realize the the snake group was some secret group deal. Seems as many people talk a lot of this group, and a few others. I don't think it is to secret

Now it seems that you're being purposely vague and obtuse in order to try and maintain some kind of distance from responsibility. The person did not trade with the owner, they traded with YOU. It was in your possession, YOU mitigated the trade and YOU sent one of your animals in return for the other.....why were you offering your own animals up in exchange for an animal you didn't own (allegedly)? Do you have any kind of evidence to back up your claims? I'm going to wager that the answer is no and you will only continue to make dismissive posts regarding the subject......another example of your lack of character.

By "secret" group, I meant that the group can not be found or viewed by people who are not already in the group. There are ways of editing who can view groups on FB, and that group is definitely "off the radar" as much as possible.

Not sure what you meant by me "just getting started", a quick search on my history on this site alone lets you know this isn't my first rodeo. I've been keeping reptiles seriously for close to 20 years. I vended my first reptile show as a teenager in the late 90's. I have a small collection these days because of time/work constraints. That was a nice *attempt* at an underhanded comment, though....you do get an "a" for effort.