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Bad Guy Beware of Jerry Kruse

??

Tom, after reading this forum I checked out KS and it was the opinions of others to ask for a refund. Check it yourself. To be CONSTRUCTIVE, I have had wild caught milks dimple up like that pic and go through successive sheds and I have cured it by putting them in a bag with anti-fungal powder(used to treat jock-itch, try having that in your snake room and explaning it! LMAO!). Shake and bake! Just make manually water them a few days to prevent excessive ingestion.
 
"Let there be zonata disease for all to ponder..."

Yes, Jerry. I am a bully. I'm sorry for trying to bully you to do the right thing and refund Stu's money. I should just shut up and let you destroy the on line reptile business for the rest of us. My bad....Thank you Mr. Webslave for removing my violation.:yesnod:


REFUND HIS MONEY AND I WILL GLADLY DISAPPEAR......
 
This is the first time a customer has had a snake die? Let me see------oh, yeah, Phil Patton, the one who had to call you a zillion times and wait like two years for his two hundred or so dollars back. But he never did get his money back, he got a hypo-e female zonata instead. That snake died after a short while. Refund----Nope. Offer to send him another----Nope. Sorry to bring a "band camp" situation back into this Jeff, but I think many of these things show WHY we are all here. Get real. Stu is out 3,100 dollars at this point and ANYONE that knows anything about zonata would call this z disease when they saw those pics, including Jerry. (of course not now, because he is involved) There is no test to confirm z disease at this point, so what is a vet going to do? These animals, if they recover or not, cannot be re-sold, bred and babies sold (by anyone with morals), so what is there to sort out? Stu came here because this was not handled in the only way any reasonable person thinks it should be handled. I can even see there being some sort of partial liability if Stu had these animals for months prior to them showing symptoms, but that is not the case. I think someone else had stated this, but even pet-smart gives you a thirty day money back guarantee.

Joe
 
Good grief, I want my time back on reading all of the childish behaviour I have seen from most people on here EXCEPT Stu, Jerry, and Jeff S.

Funny how much grown adults wanna pile on insults, be keyboard commandos, and go on and on and on about something they really do not know the absolute answer to. The " fairness " and " neutral " opinions that some claim the BOI is good for is surely not showing up here. People, if you do not KNOW exactly what the problem is, why bother wasting your precious breath being a child on a forum?

This is why I know of so much drama in the scene. Too many people not putting what really matters in life above what really does not.

This is between Stu and Jerry, no one else.

The scenario that these animals may have been completely fine leaving Jerry's place, getting stressed from shipping, and then, after being received by Stu, breaking out into these conditions due to stress has not even been addressed. Too funny!! Animals are individuals, both in manner and health aspects. Conditions such as humidity and temp changes, etc., could have played a part in what these animals are going thru. Is it ZD? Who knows? NO ONE knows for sure completely. Only way is thru testing and vet visits.

Let Stu and Jerry work this out. Very sad to see how this whole episode has turned into a bad episode of Days of our Lives.
 
Joe I've no idea what you're talking about. Patton and I loooong ago had a single transaction regarding Sierras. That is very long ago, again, and Phil and I diminished in our conversations over time for no particular reason. We herped together in Virginia some years ago and there was no issue between us. His wife is in the military, he stepped back away from snakes, and thats that. Nice axe you have there btw, and why I don't know. Just because I guess.
 
Sorry but I've been out most of the day and got home at 10 PM. Been on here for the last hour just catching up on some reading.

Jeff Schofield-You are incorrect, Sir! I do not want these animals. I want them out of my collection and I have asked for a refund. If you read my post then you will see that things transpired over time. As time passed my desires changed. I started out wanting them but now I do not.

Jerry-You have not been able to reach me because I have you call blocked. I have no desire to communicate with you any further. I stated that in my last email to you. I told you not to contact me anymore. I was unable to work this out with you and that is why we are here now. I cannot "work" anything out with someone who has threatened to "blast" me. Don't misunderstand me though. You do not scare me. After 24 years in the Army and 3 wars I don't scare easily. Besides I've been blasted and Im still here! The only communication I want from you at this point is a check and I will return the snakes providing they are still alive of course.
 
Stu, I meant "blast" you with words. Why do some words have to be selectively taken so literally? And please stop the military bravado already -- no one is doing any scaring of any kind Stu. I am simply asking for us to have a reasonable conversation without public intervention. Not to force anything upon you, just to talk. Can you do that and stop treating me like I'm trying to screw you?!?
 
joecop said:
This is the first time a customer has had a snake die? Let me see------oh, yeah, Phil Patton, the one who had to call you a zillion times and wait like two years for his two hundred or so dollars back. But he never did get his money back, he got a hypo-e female zonata instead. That snake died after a short while. Refund----Nope. Offer to send him another----Nope. Sorry to bring a "band camp" situation back into this Jeff, but I think many of these things show WHY we are all here. Get real. Stu is out 3,100 dollars at this point and ANYONE that knows anything about zonata would call this z disease when they saw those pics, including Jerry. (of course not now, because he is involved) There is no test to confirm z disease at this point, so what is a vet going to do? These animals, if they recover or not, cannot be re-sold, bred and babies sold (by anyone with morals), so what is there to sort out? Stu came here because this was not handled in the only way any reasonable person thinks it should be handled. I can even see there being some sort of partial liability if Stu had these animals for months prior to them showing symptoms, but that is not the case. I think someone else had stated this, but even pet-smart gives you a thirty day money back guarantee.

Joe
Click to expand...

Joe, past transgressions aside, I'm trying to use LOGIC here. This wasnt a "out of the egg" deal, Jerry worked with these individually so he likely knows them better than Stu. If I had a website called ZONATA anything I would be super paranoid about any disease that cant be diagnosed or cured dont cha think? If it is a contagious as described and Jerry a horrible person wouldnt you see his whole collection up for sale? CHEAP!? Lets take this one step further, you say that a reasonable person shouldnt keep, sell or give away a CURED snake with this mystery disease? Thats pretty foolish.
SO, lets take it at face value, Stu is a good keeper, Jerry doesnt have the "disease" in his collection. Does Stu have any other Zonata? Could other snakes in Stu's collection be carriers of such a disease? Was quarantining protocol adhered to? Disinfection? What is different in the way they keep them? Substrate? Temps? Humidity? How suddenly does this begin? If I was the seller I would run out and get a VET who knows this stuff to inspect my whole collection and write a statement to the effect that my collection was disease free. To me my reputation would be worth more than this AND the $3100 in lost revenue combined. If I were Stu I'd document, document, document everything. What can be ruled out, what cant. And maybe, if everyone is professional, maybe we catch a break and isolate the CAUSE of the disease instead of just slinging mud.
Lastly, comparing anyone to PETSMART, why would you sling that bull? PETSMART would tell you to PROVE that it has a disease! Just looking at it isnt enough, there has to be some kind of proof AND you also have to prove that the seller knew about it too! Laws vary from state to state but its called BURDEN OF PROOF for a reason. Remember the saying CAVEAT EMPTOR? Let the buyer beware, and if I bought Zonata and knew of "Zonata disease" I dont think it would take me 2 weeks and $3100 to figure out if my snakes were sick but thats me.
 
Jeff, if the ANy snake looked dry like that...I would NEVER have sent it anywhere. All snakes were in perfect condition. Of course, the more I say this the more the short-sighted folks think I'm trying to "blame" someone else when that is NOT the case at all. All I'vce wanted to do is work this out -- but if Stu isn't willing to do that, well, then Stu isn't willing to. Some people are passive-aggressive, some are impulsive, some prefer to abandon ship, and then there are some who are just the opposite. Stu is behaving like I am trying to screw him & I resent that. Be it as it may, I will not discuss any arrangements publicly. Stu, I am asking for a simple telephone call to make arrangements between us personally. I have been through enough in the last 19 pages, in many ways unnecessarily so and I'm NOT the only one who feels that way lately. One call. You have my #. I am obviously awake at this late hour. I will not make any public arrangements in this fashion. If you do not have my #, I am more than happy to give it to you again.
 
StuTennyson said:
Sorry but I've been out most of the day and got home at 10 PM. Been on here for the last hour just catching up on some reading.

Jeff Schofield-You are incorrect, Sir! I do not want these animals. I want them out of my collection and I have asked for a refund. If you read my post then you will see that things transpired over time. As time passed my desires changed. I started out wanting them but now I do not.

Jerry-You have not been able to reach me because I have you call blocked. I have no desire to communicate with you any further. I stated that in my last email to you. I told you not to contact me anymore. I was unable to work this out with you and that is why we are here now. I cannot "work" anything out with someone who has threatened to "blast" me. Don't misunderstand me though. You do not scare me. After 24 years in the Army and 3 wars I don't scare easily. Besides I've been blasted and Im still here! The only communication I want from you at this point is a check and I will return the snakes providing they are still alive of course.
Click to expand...

Stu..come on man...I know you are a good guy. If Jerry is trying to work this out, as I firmly believe that this is between you and him, you should allow the person whom you made a BOI post about, to try to work this out with you. Words in internet form can form into things much different than a simple conversation physically between two people either in person or on a call.

Using the internet as a crutch may not get the quickest results.

Do what it takes to get this rectified. If it means to have actual, real life conversation with the said individual on a phone call, to produce the best and highest quality results, let it happen. Do not let you posting about your scenario be in vain

I will leave you with two things:

1. Thank you for serving our country. I bow my knee to you.
2. Your Sanderson locality alterna ROCK!!!!

:)
 
Jerry-You have already screwed me. I'm just trying not to let you do it again. I have no desire to let you "work" with these and send them back to me. I do not want anything in my collection that is suspect. I just want a refund.

Jeff S.-Sorry but you're missing the point.
 
Billy Fraser-I appreciate what you are trying to do, really. However I don't think you understand that I have already tried to "work" things out with Jerry to no avail. That's why I'm here. His only solution is for me to send them to him to "work" with them and return them to me. That's his only option. That is unacceptable to me. I cannot have snakes in my collection that are suspect.

Thank you for your kind words. I'll put a gift alterna in your Christmas stocking next year!
 
Stew, please with the dramatics already. The bottom line here is that I didn't jump at the precise moment you wanted me to. Is that how I screwed you? I'm trying to have a personal conversation with you TO ARRANGE A FRIGGIN' REFUND which I WILL NOT DO ON HERE. What is so hard to comprehend?!? Jeezuzzzz....
 
Obviously that's NOT my only option....if you'd give me the time of day and stop with the dramatics, maybe we'd get somewhere already. Do you have my telephone #? A simple yes or no will suffice.
 
If we are putting phrases out there Jeff, what about "the customer is always right" or the "customer comes first". I have no gripe with you Jeff, but sit back and put yourself in Stu's place. AND I ask Jerry to do the same. You cannot sit there and tell me you would not want your money back! Jerry, I am not going to sit here and make claims I cannot back up. You don't remember any of that huh? How he gave you money for Pulchra that he never got, and the Bass Lake animals he sent you, which I think you still have. The hypo-e female (that died) you sent him instead of the money , (which he did agree to , yes). I can go find emails if I need to. For you to say you don't remember is crazy Jerry. Maybe Phil himself will see this and state it all first hand. I have stated how I feel and I hope this does get settled and you make things right with Stu. I think it has been stated the only way that will happen though.


Joe
 
Joe, you still grinding away huh.......why don't you have Phil call me or email me from Germany so he can refresh my memory. Last we spoke all was well, which I may add was a very long time ago. And if it weren't, it would be between me and Phil. Not you. Seems you get off on being provocative as evidenced by your constant negative commentaries and have an aggressive side yourself there officer -- how you'd tell me stories not too long ago of how you'd race up to someone who, say, cut you off on the road and confront them. Yes Joe, I recall you having a bit of an aggressive streak. Listen, why don't you just let Stu and I do our thing.
 
Before this thread gets any more emotional, can we all just simmer it down a bit?

I'm going to go out on a limb here. I admit that my experience with mountain kings is slight, at best. So maybe what I am going to say has no bearing whatsoever on this issue. But just in case.....

I don't know what Stu's experience level is with these snakes, but by viewing his website, I see that he seems to have a fair collection of tri-colored kings and milks. Are these zonata being kept in any different conditions than your other snakes? What is the humidity level in the cages for the zonata?

There is a reason I am asking this. I looked at those photos, and first thing that pops into my mind is that I've seen that skin condition before. Several times in baby corn snakes I hatched out, and a long while back in at least one young adult blotched king snake. In ALL cases, the cause was from the cages being TOO damp, not too dry. Although the skin LOOKS dry, it's exactly the opposite. In the case of the blotched king I specifically remember, the snake's skin and eyes looked all crinkly, like it was having trouble shedding a dry skin, and pretty much like those zonata's look. I kept on thinking the snake's environment was too dry, and it was dehydrated, so I kept on putting dampened paper towels into it's cage, hoping the additional moisture would help it get rid of that crinkled "dry" skin. After a week or so of this, with no improvement, I just decided to go 180 degrees with the environment modification by putting the snake in a cage with a lot more airflow with consequently much lower humidity. The snake went immediately into a shed cycle, and shook loose of a shed skin that felt as thick as a leather glove. And after that, no more problems. That's when I embarked on a project to open up the airflow in ALL of my cages.

With the baby corns, I hatched out the eggs in containers with no airflow, and honestly sometimes they were hatching out faster than I could deal with them in a timely fashion. In some instances, those hatching containers got TOO wet, particularly from the babies all deciding to crawl through the water dish I provided for them, and some would get that same exact look as the pics of the zonata. Again, simply moving them all into cages with more airflow and consequently lower humidity, straightened them right up after a shed.

Again, I am certainly not any even minimal expert on zonata specifically, and know absolutely nothing about this "zonata disease" mentioned, and I might be coming from far, far out in right field with my observations, but I think I would be doing a disservice by not at least mentioning my experiences.

So take this all for what it is worth to you. But at the very least, please look at ALL possibilities.
 
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