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Bill Cagle

I'm reading, but since I have no opinions about big boas, and no opinions about hypos and hoggs.... it's hard to say much. I HAVE however been reading the nice lower case messages that John has been posting and am grateful that his messages are finally readable. (I did promise to read)

as to the guarantee and teh reality.... THAT makes a bad guy!

A pity.
 
Looks pretty bad

It is unfortunate that the guarantee isnt really a guarantee. If you are going to make it then you have to live with it. I wouldn't mind seeing a pic of this critter in question, especially towards the tail.<p>I also like the lower case letters and the much more pleasant attitude. Far more constructive and your case is much more believable. NEVER give anyone the benefit of the doubt when you are spending your money for investment purposes. If you just want the snake, then go for it. I have had some VERY surprising experiences with people I would have thought were wonderful because of the size of their operation and reputation over the last 15 years. You would be surprised how many of the "big players" are crooks. It is "funny" but I buy very little over the internet and sell quite a bit. I like to see the stuff in person but yet hope others will buy with my pic on the ad????? Oh well. It should be quite easy to tell if the animal in question is hypo or not by checking out the in saddles in the tail. Shouldnt have the black outlines except for the last 3 or so from the tip. Unfortunately i didnt catch that particular ad so I havent seen the animal.
 
Pic

No problem Rich here you go. Here is one of the tail.
Respectfully,
Stephen Kennedy
 

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Pic

And here is one of the body.
Respectfully,
Stephen Kennedy
 

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Am I Gullible?

Yep probably so ... but I would like to believe there are a few honest people left in the world. For me this is a hobby (aka enjoyment) if I have to guard and protect myself with everything I do in this field it removes the enjoyment and becomes more like work. Do I look at the world through rose colored glasses? I don't think so but I try to see the positive aspects in problems like these. I do believe I will make some new contacts with some good honest people because of this Bill Cagle episode. I have found a few "bad" people in this business but quite a few very "good" people. All in all I have lost a small amount in comparison to what Bill Cagle never had.
Don't feel bad for me for goodness sakes feel bad for Bill Cagle at least I still have my honest and integrity all Bill has is a small amount of money.
Respectfully,
 
I Have only had good dealing with Bill Cagle, and I know many others have as well. I am sure if anyone has a problem with Bill or any of his animals they could call him and talk about it. IMHO Bill is one of the good guys. Jim Elliott
 
That is a Blatant ripoff

That isnt a hypo anything on its best day. It also wouldnt seem to show very much hogg influence in it either but that can be very hard to tell. If that is what Bill sent you as a hypoxhogg I wount be doing anything with him in the forseeable future. <p>Having been on both sides of the fence, if this is a hobby to you I would strongly suggest you buy what you like, not chase after names of any kind. You have what appears to be a nice columbian redtail that is in apparently very good health. If you like the look of a hogg hypo or a pink elephant, than that s what you need to get whether it is free or 10,000. That is how you will keep the hobby fun for you. I would agree with you that Bill has lost far more than you have in this exchange. As a side bar, I would recommend looking at Rich Ihle's website. I beleive it is salmonboa.com or something like that. Check out his pictures to research what a hypo looks like and what makes it hypomelanistic. Good rule of thumb is you shouldnt see the black rings more than a few (3-4) saddles up from the tip of the tail. There are still good looking hypos and bad looking hypos (I have both unfortunately :) ) but atleast you will know the genetics are there.
 
I have talked with him

I Have only had good dealing with Bill Cagle, and I know many others have as well. I am sure if anyone has a problem with Bill or any of his animals they could call him and talk about it. IMHO Bill is one of the good guys. Jim Elliott
Click to expand...

Jim have you read this thread. I have talked with Bill. He is more than happy to talk about anything. He just comes up short in the do anything department. If you feel he is still a "good guy" maybe you should talk with him and let me know where I went wrong other than my original purchase from him. Jim I mean no disrespect but I believe you are way off base with this character.
Respectfully,
 
hypo

That is quite disgusting that someone first off misrepresents not only his "American Jungle" line, then has his own version of "motleys", but then goes and blatantly sells an animal that is 100% without a doubt nothing like he sold it as. Stephen, I would if I was in your shoes go to all of the forums and post your "PURCHASED FROM CAGLE AS A HYPO HOGG" just to "show off" to the people who are potential customers.

Also Rollo Joe I have a question how long has Cagle been actually producing boas and not just brokering? From what I had heard he only has bred boas for the past 4 years. (which is far from "longer then most people on here".) I could be mistaken but I can clearly remember a thread on KS stating such and even having someone else backing it up.

Stephen, I have a good chance of producing some hypo hoggs with that male of mine you like and if I do you can have one for free. (and That I guarantee more then 48 hours ):D . And not the Cagle 48 hour guarantee aka to Cagle NOT AT ALL
 
hey stephen seeing as you are both in tn. maybe you should pay bill a vist and speak to him face to face. explain to him what he has done and give him the opertunity to make it right. all to all the friends of bill why dont you guys try calling him also and try to convince him that what he is doing is wrong and that it may be in his best interest to honor his own garuntee. lets see if we cant get stephen his money back his number has already been listed here in this thread here it is again
423)822-7878
if your reading this post and feel that bill's actions are wrong then give him a call and let him know it i also ask bill to come here and post his side of the story
nuff said
john peraza
 
first off id like to say that randy your a great guy for offering stephen a free hypo hog when you produce them . you are definatly someone who has earned my business in the future. take a look "capt cungle" fans this is what a "Good Guy" looks like
 
Since Stephen is a member of our forum, this hits kinda close to home. Missrepresented animals are my biggest pet peeve.With that in mind, Randy and I have discussed setting up a fund to get Stephen his money back. Hopefully we can have that set up today. Any money collected over the purchase price will then be donated to Fauna.

This is probably the wrong place to put this, but I don't know where else I would put it so that the people involved or who have feelings about this particular issue would read it. Moderators, please move it accordingly. Thanks in advance.
 
Thank You

Randy I do appreciate your offer but I could not accept that. If I did I would be no better than the person this thread is about. Randy you have done no wrong in this and it is not your place to make this right. Your offer says loads about your character but your character has never been in question. I would appreciate the opportunity to purchase some of those hypos but to be honest I have seen pics of your animals and would love to purchase them all.

John already working on the Chattanooga road trip but I will need sometime for this to pass before I could make it without doing something stupid. No point in letting one small act by a piece of trash influence negatively on my future.

Again don't feel to bad for me (other than my own stupidity). You really need to feel bad for Bill Cagle he has no ethics or credibility.

Luckily I'm financially stable enough to take this small hit but if it had happened to a younger herper tring to make ends meet and build a collection at the same time ... makes me shutter.

Respectfully,
 
No Please

Sorry Dave, again you like Randy, John, and others have a heart as big as Texas. This isn't about the money. Make the collection (I will donate also) and use the funds for bettering the herp industry. This is about a "Bad Guy" really I would be very happy with the outcome of this thread if it possibily saved some other individual from this type of problem.
You guys are the greatest but this isn't that bad a hit its just that bad a guy.
See when you churn the milk the cream does come to the top but Bill is still on the bottom ... lol
Respectfully,
 
i would like to know exactly how many people he has scamed like this. i know there has to more out there im sure stephen couldnt possibly be the only one. i personally would love to hear what people who have purchased the "american jungles" and "silver salmons" have to say about exactly what they thought they were buying?
 
Chris Mcquade

I'm trying to get a hold of Chris Mcquade. I'm real curious what he will think about this since Bill is saying that he purchased these from him as hypo/hoggs. Bill took the attitude in the phone that if they aren't what he says they are its Chris's fault because he purchased them as hypo/hoggs. The only contact info I have for Chris is the phone number given to me by Bill. I have left a message asking Chris for his email so that I might send him some pics to verify they are his and where sold as hypo/hogg. If anyone has any contact info for Chris you might advise him of this thread.
Reguardless of the outcome with Chris Mcquade, Bill cagle is still bad because of his non-100% guarantee thats good up until you use it.
Respectfully,
 
I did a search, and the only thing I could Find on McQuade is that John Apple had him listed on his good guy list. You might want to contat John and see if he has contact info for him and Gulf Coast Reptiles.
 
Going through the motions

I have filed a complaint with kingsnake (lol). They sent me the you must file it with the Internet Fraud and Complaint Center letter so I did that also. I paid by postal money order. I think I'll call the post office Monday and see if I can file a complaint there. Heck while I'm at it I might as well call his local police and get their address so I can file a complaint there. I know all this is most probably pointless but right now it makes me feel better ... lol. Chattanooga isn't that far ... it might be interesting to pursue this in a small claims court or something. They have a nice aquarium down there that the kids would love to see. Kill two birds with one stone. On second thought why ruin a nice trip by including Cagle in it.
Respectfully,
 
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