This thread is now completely off topic. However, I will respond to the new allegations accordingly.
Firstly, there are many stories that have been told about what happened; the latest off-the-wall stories by Brandon (post #199) and Craig (post #212). We (my wife and I) have never said our side of the story, simply because we felt that it was both unprofessional and inappropriate. The big question here is, did we steal/swindle/wrangle the business out from under Bill? The answer is NO, absolutely not.
Through the unfortunate circumstances that transpired, we BOTH lost in this deal. This ultimately happened due to the honest mistake (mistake nonetheless) made on Bill’s behalf when he (as he stated) signed over the building into our names to avoid any potential lawsuits (e.g. customer slipping, etc.), as well as to avoid paying property taxes and association dues. Unfortunately Bill did NOT share this information with us, that he making the transfer, until after the fact.
During the time that we were conducting this transaction, we were in the middle of a personal bankruptcy. The BK (Bankruptcy) was NOT initiated after the business transaction. We had filed well before we even knew Bill was selling the business. We never mentioned the personal BK because it was just that, personal, and had absolutely no relevance to the matter (or so we thought). THIS is where WE made our mistake. It was a huge learning lesson, learned the hard way.
Our mistake was our naivety (which we take full accountability for) in never having experienced the BK process before, and we paid for it greatly by losing the ENTIRE business at one point. The moment that Bill transferred the building into our names - without us knowing until after the fact - it immediately became the property of the state (not ours).
The “acquisition” of real estate on our behalf raised a red flag with the state and triggered an immediate investigation by the BK Trustee who was appointed to our case. Of course then, looking further into our assets he discovered that there was also a business tied to this building, with MANY animals, equipment, etc. – all viewed as mere assets to the state. They then immediately made us close our doors, telling us that we no longer owned the business and that the state now owns it all. Needless to say, we were beside ourselves (in a negative way). We couldn’t believe what had just happened, and so abruptly! We immediately contacted Bill (which he can attest to) and told him what had happened, and how/why, and advised him to contact an attorney of his own to see what he could do about it from his side. We also diligently contacted our own attorney to see if there was ANY way he could turn over the decision because there’s been a huge mistake. We were told that nothing could be done due to the nature of the unsecured contract.
The contract made between us was completely legit, even notarized. The problem was that it was not a secured loan (which, like us at the time, most of you probably don’t even know what that means). Basically, a house or a car is a secured loan. Meaning, if you stop making payments, the lender can take it back because it’s secured by the collateral of the property itself. We learned a lot more than we ever wanted to know about this stuff, but hopefully sharing this info will protect someone in the future.
During the period of the next couple weeks, we could not allow any customers or employees to enter the building while the business was shut down. My wife and I had to tend to the thousands of animals ourselves (which took two people all day, every day), with the business generated zero income. We did this solely for the sake of the animals, as we had no idea if or when we would be allowed to continue on with the business at all. We kept pressing the matter, but we were continuously told that we no longer owned the business and that it all now belonged to the state. It wasn’t until we made a very aggressive bluff - stating that we would no longer care for the animals and just let them die, which would render thousands of their “assets” to be worthless and create an expensive mess that they would have to clean up (of course we would never have done that, but it was a necessary strategy that worked), that we were able to negotiate the ability to continue conducting business as usual.
When the dust finally settled, we were told that the state would now be selling the building and the business along with all of its assets on the open market. At this point, EVERYTHING was up in the air for ANYONE to purchase (!). Needless to say, this was an extremely stressful time for us. We felt as though the state had just used us as their slaves for a couple of weeks just to watch over their “assets” until they could figure out who to sell everything to.
I left my good-paying career of twelve years to make it on my own just before this endeavor. All the money we had at the time was given to Bill as a large down payment, so we had nothing. But, just like anybody else would do in this [unique] situation, we quickly scrambled to find SOME way to secure our investment. LUCKILY (extremely) I was able to convince my own mother to purchase the entire business and allow us to make payments to her.
This was not as easy of a feat as it may sound. At first she wanted nothing to do with it, AT ALL. The ONLY way I was able to finally convince her to do so, was as an investment opportunity; where she would own the building and we would pay her rent. If my parents weren’t about to retire themselves (and could use the steady income) then it would NOT have happened and I have no idea what would have happened. Nobody was looking to buy a reptile store, or had the cash reserves to do so (the ENTIRE amount for the complete business and building had to be paid up front in full to the state, like at an auction) during the worst recession in history.
We were always open and up front with Bill throughout the entire situation that we were ALL in (mistakes made on both sides). As Bill stated himself, he still continued to help out with the business - mainly tending to the many babies we had on hand - for a few months. We allowed him to come and go as he pleased because we knew how attached he still was. We even allowed him to have his own key to the building. These facts alone debunk the various stories out there that paint the picture of us “stealing the business” in any way. How many of you would stick around for months helping out the very people who intentionally stole your business from you.
Bill had a difficult time detaching himself while there (understandably so), and continued to allow certain people that he knew to enter into our employees only areas to hangout/volunteer at will. We spoke with him about this on more than one occasion and simply addressed the fact that we were not comfortable with people being allowed in certain areas so loosely, namely where we keep baby animals with a considerable amount of value to them. He respectfully complied for the most part, but it did continue. It wasn’t until we started noticing snakes missing that this “arrangement” became an obvious issue. Please note, that I am NOT saying that he ever stole anything from us.
When questioned, Bill would tell me that, “oh, you didn’t want this snake, so I sold it to so and so,” or, “I owed this guy this snake.” I always believed that he was telling the truth, even though he no longer had the right to make any of those decisions, but that’s beside the point. It was obvious at this junction that the whole situation was erroneous, and so we felt the need to make appropriate changes (e.g. take the key back, etc.).
Bill,
Regarding the following statements that you posted:
“I heard Robert was not going to pay anymore because I told people I had lost the Serpentatium in his bankruptcy.”
We were advised by our attorney to not pay you, due to possible legal ramifications.
“If Robert told anyone he is still paying me, I would like to see it.”
I have never made such a statement to anyone.
“Robert did'nt breed anything except possibly ball pythons until he took over my collection. I had all the breeders already bred and ready to lay, corns, kings, boas, pythons, false water cobras, rat snakes etc.”
When we initially took over the business, you are correct; I didn’t breed any of the animals that you mentioned, initially. You already took care of it all for that season. However, it has been me who has been the sole breeder of ALL the species we purchased ever since. And I have been successful with ever one of them (other than the dang Tiger Rat Snakes!)
Before I purchased the business, my experience was having extensive knowledge in breeding various species, such as many gecko species, Uromastyx, Bearded Dragons, Ball Pythons, etc., along with various invertebrates. Regardless, I was an extreme hobbyist who had kept MANY different species for many years, so I was not a “rookie” of any sort. But again, this is not the point.
The point is, I am being blamed by certain [bitter] people for taking credit for your past breeding successes. But I have never done so. They are simply picking away at my choice of verbiage on our company website and using it as an attack.
Example #1: Our website states that The Serpentarium was established in 1989.
The business in question was established in 1989. We purchased said business in 2009. Their mentality is that, since we changed the name, it is now a “new business”. However, at the same time, these people are also saying that I simply took over and am just running Bill’s old business.
In reality, we didn’t really “change” the name, we merely shortened it to the name that everybody knows and refers to it as (seemed a whole lot simpler). Now, if we would’ve changed the name to, “Robert’s Reptiles,” and made the same business statements, then they might have an argument.
Now, while I can certainly understand how some confusion or conflict may be had with certain folk, allow me to provide some perspective on the matter with a similar scenario:
Let’s say, if someone were to purchase the company Facebook today, and then the new owner makes a statement the very next day that, "they are the biggest and most recognized social network in the world, established in 2004." That would be a fair and accurate statement made by the new owner, regardless if he shortened the name to just FB, as many people refer to it. That is NOT the new owner trying to take credit for Mark Zuckerberg's past accomplishments. I believe most people understand this.
Example #2: Our website states that we are the biggest producer of False Water Cobras.
Unless someone can prove that they produced more than 100 babies this year (and last year), then this statement is also true. But even if someone produced 150 FWC’s next year, they would need to be consistent in doing so for more than just a year or two in order for me to remove our statement.
Example #3: [Relating to example #2] It is said that I personally claim to have been the one breeding the many species that we work with for over 20 years.
I have never once made that statement. The statement I have made, is that “we” (meaning, The Serpentarium as a company entity) have been breeding these particular species for over 20 years. The statement is fair and accurate.
What some people fail to realize is that we purchased the business and own everything about it, including its history (good and bad). Anyone who does a search on “Great Valley Serpentarium” will see that it wasn’t all good. We inherited many of the “bad things” that came along with the business as well and have done our very best to eliminate those issues. I believe we have done so successfully.
Some people also tend to say that The Serpentarium’s current success is all owed to Bill. That’s an ignorant statement, and couldn’t be farther from the truth. As if we’ve been doing nothing for the past 3+ years. About 90% of our customer base is all new customers, people who have never even heard of The Serpentarium before. And that is because Bill did very little (if any) advertising in his days. WE utilize expensive billboards in high traffic areas.
Bill has certainly had his time, made his accomplishments, became a pioneer in the industry, etc., and I looked up to him. After 20 years he was simply “burned out” (his own words) and looking to retire (understandably so). The fact that he decided to sell the business during the worst time of the worst recession the world has ever seen, played a huge part in his decision, and was a huge hurdling factor that we had to overcome on our own.
Everybody automatically thinks that the business “must’ve made so much money,” mostly due to Bill’s breeding successes and achievements. But the fact of the matter is, when we purchased it (during the worst recession ever), the business was merely surviving. We knew this from reviewing the financial statements that Bill provided us with during our due diligence. However, the vision I had/have for the company far outweighed the risk. Many changes had to be made and we knew it wouldn’t be accepted by all, but in order for the business to be truly successful, not just surviving, the changes were absolutely necessary.
We made MANY changes to the business and created many NEW features; from sacrificing the manager’s office to outfit an in-store b-day party room, to converting the storage room into a room completely dedicated to Tarantulas, to changing the entire business model from the ground up, and MORE (Workshops, Experiences, Taxidermy Services, etc.), all of which have become very popular and what we are NOW known for. We also opened a second retail location and have a third location that we utilize as a distribution center for the many products we stock our stores with.
Out of all the changes we’ve made, the most controversial is our Admission. However, the initial shock of paying admission (which doesn’t apply to regular feeder customers, and is immediate same day store credit for anybody who does pay) quickly wore off and has become completely “normal” to our customers. In fact, for every one customer who still might say something about the admission (which rarely happens), 20+ people say that we should be charging more than just $2.
For those of you who have not visited the The Serpentarium, only about 15-20% of Bill’s original animals still remain at the facility. Moving away from certain projects and following industry/consumer demands, we sold off most of the projects that he had going on. The thousands of animals that currently exist were all derived by us.
All in all, Bill cannot (nor do I believe he would try to) take credit for what we have grown and transformed the business into today. Anyone who says so is simply bitter that the business has definitely changed.
Lastly, we had and still have the utmost respect for you, Bill, despite everything that has happened. We also forgive you for the mistakes that you’ve made and the things that you’ve said. If we could have at all prevented what had happened, we would have.
On the flip side, the people who deserve absolutely NO respect, are the ones who continue to perpetrate the many lies that they’ve been feeding their “followers” for the past three years. You should be ashamed of yourselves.
To everyone who has kept up with this thread,
I apologize for the delayed response and this long post. I wanted to make sure that I covered all topics and provided you all with as much details as you so desire. I hope that I have covered enough to explain the entire situation and have answered any questions that you may have/had.
However, I am extremely busy and honestly do not have the time for this inappropriate thread. It has taken up way too much of my time already. I am now going to permanently pull myself away from this and hope that you all realize where the truth lies. If you want to judge me, then come visit our facility yourself and make your own assessment based on your own experience.
My offer STILL stands for Brandon (OP), allowing him a full refund.
Best regards,
Robert Coral
The Serpentarium
www.SnakeMuseum.com
