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Black Knight = Death

I second Rash's statement about using Nix as a mite treatment, so far it has proved to be much safer to herps than other products.

When I got my first mite infestation, I searched for a few days on the internet to find the "safest" method possible. The Nix solution (properly diluted: 1 59ml bottle to 1 gallon of water had never caused a death in a reptile.

It is a very good treatment, especially for herps that are more sensitive. At the time of my first infestation, I had 3 very young corns all under 16" and was afraid to use a product that would be harmful to them.

After the first treatment, I no longer found any mites. I still did the two follow up treatment a week apart for two more weeks to be sure.

Nix is not only good for killing adult mites but also for killing their eggs and larvae.

I personally think more herpers should look into Nix as a mite treatment. It is also very cost effective!

Pixie
 
I have just read the link to the proexotics directions on using Black Knight spray and in two areas it mentions to fog the enclosure with the snake in it!!!!

First time mentioned is after the snake has soaked for 1-2 hours, to put in in a shoe or sweater box and "lightly" fog the box with the snake in it!!!

Later on, consequent treatments, they say to fog the enclosures with the snakes in them?!!!

It sure doesn't sound like good advice to me!

Pixie
 
It sure doesn't sound like good advice to me!
Click to expand...

Yes but... Robin and the entire crew down at P.E. are among the very best in the Industry... and you're from Canada.

So that pretty much explains how much your opinion on the matter is worth.
 
Ummm.......owwie, Seamus.

I'm going to have to re-read PE's advice, though....I didn't interpret anything to suggest you fog the enclosure with the snake in it. Maybe Robyn should clarify?
 
No interpretation necessary!

From Pro Exotics:

Now that the cage is treated, pull your snake from soaking and put it into a plain, dry container. For most animals, we use empty Rubbermaid sweaterboxes. Now you can spray the animal itself. Once again, you are not trying to coat the actual animal (there is nothing in Black Knight that "coats", no slime, no slickness), you are simply fogging the container, another 2 or 3 seconds. (PLEASE NOTE: nothing is foolproof! For very small cages, neonate animals like tiny colubrids, or animals in deep shed, be smart, and use significantly less. It doesn’t take but a short half second shot to fill a shoebox, and remember, small newborns have TINY respiratory systems, and they can be overwhelmed by anything intruding on their airspace, so easy on the trigger there, cowboy.)
Click to expand...

I honestly think that is pretty straightforward. If you are using any more than that - you are wasting your money and your black knight.

There is no need to spray the animal directly, and while I don’t think it would be harmful to the animal, it is just not necessary, and the fogging step is extremely effective.
Click to expand...

If you need help understanding this - you shouldn't be playing with chemicals.

Let the cage and the animal sit for another hour or so, thank your lucky stars that reptile mites are not made of titanium, place the snake back into its cage, and fill the water bowl. That is it for today. Pretty simple, for a single cage. Of course, earlier I strongly recommended that you do ALL the cages, so perhaps you will need to repeat this 4, 5, or 100 more times.
Click to expand...

No mention of spraying the snake IN the cage here...

I've used Black Knight for over a year. When you take in rescue animals, you deal with a lot of mites.

Yes, you spray the cage. BUT - the animal is not in the cage, and neither is the water dish.

You treat the animal outside the cage, with a VERY small amount of black knight.

I've used Black Knight on iguanas, ball pythons, burmese pythons, common boas, rainbow boas, and a bunch more animals I dont care to list anymore (mainly because a Citron Cockatoo tried to take the end of my finger off!).

I've never lost an animal due to the use of black knight.
 
Black Knight

i have thought about the word usage for the FAQ quite a bit, but i have yet to find a better description, perhaps someone else can help...

you don't "fog" the cage or animal so it looks like San Francisco in the morning, that would be ridiculous. but it isn't exactly "misting" the cage either. a light fog, that sounded about right, and i explain it in the FAQ many times.

the problem i see the most is folks not reading close enough. i think the Black Knight piece is quite wordy, and STILL i always get emails from folks asking "do i spray the animal directly?" like it is hairspray or something. NO YOU DON'T. you spray the cage and animal separately in your initial treatment, and for follow ups, pull the water bowl and spray the animal in the cage, with a light spray. of just a couple of seconds.

i have no idea, or control, over how much people use. i think that any of the products used to effectively kill mites (oils and magic spells are not effective) can be overused with disastrous results.

we have had very very few problems over the years with Black Knight, but before that time, using No Pest strips, it was "understood" that you may very well have lots of problems. it too is a potentially dangerous product, but can be used very effectively. they are all chemical pesticides for goodness sakes, but you MUST get rid of mites, so you have few options.

Black Knight has been used for more than a decade by breeders and zoos around the country. it is easily the most effective product i have seen to eradicate mites. out of hundreds and hundreds of Black Knight orders, i have heard from just a handful of keepers that have had negative results. i feel badly for their animals, and i can't explain what went wrong. regardless, i am usually characterized as a "bastard" "jerk" "ashhole" or "insensitive greedy prick" for selling them the product. it is slightly offset by the "thanks" emails from the vast majority of folks that use it without incident. that name calling and blame still hurts though, but we must push forward and hold our ground in providing effective mite control (it is not even our product!). believe me folks, if we all had to go back to No Pest strips, the negative effects would be much greater and more frequent.

i really try hard to go over information in our FAQ that is not addressed on other sites or in books. a lot of it is really great for beginners, and a lot of it is great for experienced keepers because it makes you laugh out loud to remember all the dumb mistakes we have made as we learn the "secrets" of reptile husbandry : ) i would be interested to know what info on the FAQ that Steve finds so "bs" and bogus.

we continue to do our best : )
 
Um.......Black Knight is not illegal...I was just able to purchase it at a show....a heavily regulated show I might ad. Lots of places sell it and to be honest, it is way more effective than Pro-Vent.

Aside from the fact that if you spray Pro-Vent directly on your animals, you will kill them too....it is not meant to be used in that manner...also, if you create a "fog" in the tank and replace the animal while there is still a heavy haze, they will inhale it and either become very sick or die.

Another point....replacing the water bowl while there is residual chemical that the animal can track through and then get in the water ultimately drinking the chemical is risky as well...how soon were the animals given water after Black KNight was used...

One last point...we all know how hard mites can be to erraticate...It says nowhere on a can of Black Knight that it is meant as a mite spray for reptiles........You always take a chance when you use a chemical to get rid of parasites.....I for one have used it many times very, very carefully with no ill affects whatsoever.
 
Yes but... Robin and the entire crew down at P.E. are among the very best in the Industry... and you're from Canada.

So that pretty much explains how much your opinion on the matter is worth.
Click to expand...


Now isn't that just lovely!!! What does the fact that I am Canadian have anything to do with my opinion. You are obviously very prejudiced and I think it is sad that it is your only response to my posts. As to the 2 quotes I was referring to in the said link:

1st:
Now that the cage is treated, pull your snake from soaking and put it into a plain, dry container. For most animals, we use empty Rubbermaid sweaterboxes. Now you can spray the animal itself. Once again, you are not trying to coat the actual animal (there is nothing in Black Knight that "coats", no slime, no slickness), you are simply fogging the container, another 2 or 3 seconds. (PLEASE NOTE: nothing is foolproof! For very small cages, neonate animals like tiny colubrids, or animals in deep shed, be smart, and use significantly less. It doesn’t take but a short half second shot to fill a shoebox, and remember, small newborns have TINY respiratory systems, and they can be overwhelmed by anything intruding on their airspace, so easy on the trigger there, cowboy.)
Click to expand...

2nd
For your follow up treatments, it should be much easier. We pull the water bowls, leave the snake in the cage, and fog it out. Unless you see more live mites (and if you went through the first attack properly, you shouldn’t) this is all that is necessary for your 3 follow up treatments. But remember to hit them weekly.
Click to expand...


I posted my message in response to this post by Seamus after reading the FAQ.

Actually...

They don't.

They tell you to fog the enclosure with the animal removed...
Click to expand...


The only intention I had for posting was to show that the information sheet did in fact refer twice to "fogging" the enclosure (or sweater box) with the snake in it.

In no way was my post intended to put down the product itself or the information sheet provided by ProExotics. I very well know their reputation and believe it is well deserved.

I myself have never used Black Knight. When I was struck with a mite infestation, while cleaning my snakes' enclosures and giving them a bath daily I did research online for 3 days to find out the best solution for me. Especially since I had such young and small snakes.

I found the Nix solution to be the best suited to my needs. All others had higher risks of side effects or death. They also had a much smaller margin for error. In all of my research I have never heard of any death of a snake related to a Nix mite treatment when used at the proper dilution. One has been reported but the person used the product undiluted...

I understand that Black Knight is one of the most effective mite treatments and also one of the safest when used properly.

Seamus, I am really baffled as to why I got such a rude response from you. It is completely uncalled for and I hope that it will not be the norm. I honestly don't think it will benefit the site to treat new members in such a way.

Pixie
 
Yes but... Robin and the entire crew down at P.E. are among the very best in the Industry... and you're from Canada.

So that pretty much explains how much your opinion on the matter is worth.
Click to expand...

Wow! That was just plain rude and uncalled for!! What does being from Canada have to do with anything? Just because she is from Canada, she can't have an opinion worthy of being expressed?
 
And it works very well on mites when used properly with a dash of commonsense thrown in!
 
Not trying to stir up trouble, just getting the message out, no matter what you guys may say this product will kill your snake..... if not used the right way, not everyone knows this, now i see a little change in your web site about how to use blacknight, thats a positive thing keep the herpers informed, you have a great site i have been there many times keep up the good work , thats all i have to say

Tim McEwen Plymouth MA
 
the "change" on the site has been there for quite some time.

we can all agree that reptile mites are a terror. you HAVE to get rid of them.

we have used many different products, for many years, and Black Knight is the best product available. there is nothing "safer" as all the effective products are chemical pesticide based.

Black Knight is certainly a better choice than the "olive/vegetable oil" concoctions and other useless myths that folks so freely give out to neophytes that don't know any better ("just soak 'em for an hour, that'll do it!"). that is the blind leading the blind. i have used this product and i believe in this product, and while it is certainly not foolproof, it is still the best available treatment.

thanks for the comments on the site.

Black Knight=dead mites
 
my experience

I got a new snake a while back and didn't notice it had some mites until about a week later. It was in quarantine but i had some snakes in the bedroom next door so I decided to treat any snakes that had been anywhere near this one just in case (I'm a little paranoid).
I treated about 40 snakes. I pulled all the water bowls, replaced the substrates with newspaper and used as directed. I only had a problem with one snake...a western hognose. I noticed that evening that this hognose was having spasms/convulsions. I put the hognose in a cage that hadn't been treated and planned to bring him to the vet first thing in the morning. The next morning he was fine and he's never had any problems since.
I've never seen another mite on the snake that had them or any other snake in my collection. I think Black Knight is a good product and would use it again if I ever needed to. I think it's important to use it as directed and monitor your animals afterward for any adverse effects.
 
I have used Black Knight for treatment as well as preventative treatment for over a year, and I am very happy with the result, even more happy than Provent-A-Mite, the first chemical I used. With Provent-A-Mite, two of my boas had shedding problem (there habitat condition are same before and after spraying Provent-A-Mite). It also took 3 or more applications in order to get rid of mite.
With Black Knight, I just slightly spray the cages/containers with my animals and water dishes REMOVED, and wait for a second or two before I put them back. Although I slightly spray the cages/containers, the mist caused fog in the containers, so you don't really need to spray it like air freshener;) Also, I can see the result right after the first application, and most of the time, I don't need to put the second application until a month later, for preventative. I spray all my animals whenever I bring a new one in the collection, or every 2 months for preventative treatment. Hope this help.
 
Provent a mite

Sorry about your green snake dude, I know they are beautiful and fun little animals. Like some of the other replies have stated, Provent a mite is a great product. I started using it about 3 years ago after I saw it advertised in Reptiles magazine. I have followed the instructions on the can, to include waiting until cage furniture and substrate are dry. I have recieved several mite infested snakes over the last few years and provent a mite does the trick every time. You can now purchase it in most reptile stores or order through a reptile supply company.
 
SPJ said:
I had a rough green snake go into convulsions and die when I used it.
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Don't most green snakes get their water by drinking the droplets of water that forms on their body, when they are misted....I could be wrong but I know my green snake did that...

Are you sure it was inhalation and not digestion of BK roach spray that killed it...

Just my two cents
 
Mite treatment???

In the past 10 years I've had snake mites 2x and treated successfully with NIX. This is sold over the counter in Pharmacy stores. Used as a hair lice treatment for children. Comes in 2 oz jar for about $10. One qt. water per ounce or adjust accordingly for one time usage. Only the water dish is removed from cage before a light spritzing is applied in entire cage. Mites disappeared in minutes. Replace water dish in 15 minutes. (Never had a heavy infestation and used with snakes only, since that is all I keep.) Of course the best solution is to isolate new snakes on white paper for 2 weeks to see if the sob's pop up.

Mike
 
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