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Inquiry Black Pearl Reptiles

I

Its_JoeyHello

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Im looking to add some female Eastern Indigos to my collection. Has anyone worked with black Pearl? My friend has a 2013 female from them, but she has split scales, which seems to represent a genetic issue? I have seen them at shows but other then my one friend haven't ever heard good or bad reviews on them. Anything would help me out, thank you in advance.
 
The split scale thing with easterns is a myth based on everyone I've talked to who has actually bred them. The claim is that it's a sign of inbreeding, but people who have outcrossed completely unrelated animals still get babies with the split scales. No evidence at all that it means anything other than that the snake absorbed a yolk sac in the egg (which is a good thing obviously).

I worked with a bunch of hogs that came from black pearl and had no issues at all.
 
Its_JoeyHello said:
Im looking to add some female Eastern Indigos to my collection. Has anyone worked with black Pearl? My friend has a 2013 female from them, but she has split scales, which seems to represent a genetic issue? I have seen them at shows but other then my one friend haven't ever heard good or bad reviews on them. Anything would help me out, thank you in advance.
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I have never purchased from John personally, but I have reached out to him occasionally with questions. He was quick reply and was a big help when I needed it. I would not hesitate to buy from Black Pearl.
 
John at Black Pearl Reptiles is Awesome! Great customer service, excellent shipping, and most important his animals are top notch! I highly recommend them!!!
 
i do not know Black Pearl and have never purchased from John Michels. But i do keep and have bred indigos. Many well respected breeders certainly do believe the split scales are a sign of inbreeding.
 
I have purchased two animals from John and find him to be very easy to work with, however none were couperi so cannot vouch for the quality of the ones he deals in just the man himself
i feel any questions you ask of him he will reply honestly which is about as much as you can ask for nowadays
good luck as the couperi is the very pinnacle of north american colubrids
 
I've known John many many years and can say you'll be satisfied should you connect and purchase anything he may have to offer.
 
I have heard so far he is great to work with, however several snake produced by him that I have considered going with (my friends 2013 female) ( female black phase posted on this site) both have the split scale issue. Now John has told both owners that it is not a issue for breeding, but the breeder I purchased my male from states otherwise. Im interning as a DVM and I spoke with a friend that works with exotics, as for me they are a hobby and I only typically see small animals. They both state that it is a genetic weakness in a poorly diverse gene pool. My male has perfect scales and none are split. I would rather not produce offspring with split scales and would want to do my best to produce a gene pool as unrelated as possible. Does anyone have any advice on this? My friend is willing to give me his female 2013 for me allowing him to use my adult female black dragon in his water monitor breeding program, we would split the clutch.

Thanks in advance, I truly appreciate the input as I take this seriously.
 
I bought a yellow-tail cribo from him back in 2015. It was a good experience buying form him. Currently he is my number one choice for an eastern indigo someday.
 
Its_JoeyHello said:
I have heard so far he is great to work with, however several snake produced by him that I have considered going with (my friends 2013 female) ( female black phase posted on this site) both have the split scale issue. Now John has told both owners that it is not a issue for breeding, but the breeder I purchased my male from states otherwise. Im interning as a DVM and I spoke with a friend that works with exotics, as for me they are a hobby and I only typically see small animals. They both state that it is a genetic weakness in a poorly diverse gene pool. My male has perfect scales and none are split. I would rather not produce offspring with split scales and would want to do my best to produce a gene pool as unrelated as possible. Does anyone have any advice on this? My friend is willing to give me his female 2013 for me allowing him to use my adult female black dragon in his water monitor breeding program, we would split the clutch.

Thanks in advance, I truly appreciate the input as I take this seriously.
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Even if this were an issue directly related to a small gene pool (I don't work with them so I can't offer if it's due to line breeding) is your animal directly related to his line(s) offeredmfor sale? If not then you would be outcrossing both lines by breeding them together correct? I'm not sure how your friends animal relates to you initial question so that I can't comment on either.
 
If you are truly serious in this endeavor then you should research East Coast Drymarchon and Alan Brutosky in particular on Facebook.
You will find ALL of your answers right there.
Unfortunately the couperi situation in the USA is in a very dire state tbh as there has been SO much interbreeding over the last 2 decades or more which the Feds did not help by their handling of their federal protection status of this wonderful animal......and some overly entrepreneurial breeders.....

:shootfoot
 
The split scales themselves (not talking about umbilical scar scales) are obviously just cosmetic. But they are an indicator of inbreeding. The inbreeding can result in serious internal abnormalities, such as heart issues. There have been cases where heavily inbred indigos, without warning, died from heart complications. Problem is that the gene pool is so limited. None are legally available from the wild. Breeders breed related individuals because that is what they have. Some snake species, such as ball pythons, tolerate inbreeding very well. Indigos do not.
 
The title of the thread is an inquiry on Black Pearl Reptiles, it may have been better suited in a discussion forum, without any breeder's name involved. It's kind of sliding off topic when you are starting to talk about other breeders. My .02.
 
Jet76 said:
The title of the thread is an inquiry on Black Pearl Reptiles, it may have been better suited in a discussion forum, without any breeder's name involved. It's kind of sliding off topic when you are starting to talk about other breeders. My .02.
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This.

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Good folks, take the discussion regarding the species and inbreeding concerns to a discussion section or other means of correspondence. This thread is to be about Black Pearl Reptiles.
 
My apologies if my post was deemed off topic, was not meaning to reference a different BREEDER, just an excellent source of information in all things Drymarchon related.

:face_palm_02:
 
No problem. :) Just trying to corral the (valuable) side discussion into a non-BOI area so it does not distract from the central theme.
 
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