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Bob Clark

Niles are the deadliest crocodilian, period. What business does a 15 year old kid have with a Nile?? Let's get real here, out of the hundreds of people that have purchased these crocs, how many of them have the proper facility to house an adult Nile? Probably very few of them do.

I have done several shows in DFW where Bob has been a fellow vendor and he is always there with his crocs for sale. Usually a few hours into the show the promotors ask him to remove the "For Sale $200" tag and replace it with a "Display Only" tag. Yeah right, a baby Nile croc in a deli cup, great display item! At one of these shows a 15 year old kid was walking around with a Nile that he bought from Bob, not cool.

Also I would like to point out that the majority of these animals die before they reach any substantial size, those that do not are usually released into our area lakes or dumped off at a rescue facility. Recently there was a Nile Croc found swimming in the Trinity River near Houston! One of our local zoos received a call from a concerned parent who had discovered that her son had Nile and she wanted the zoo to take the animal! I also know of a reptile rescue in Oklahoma that has gotten at least two calls on them as well.

Casey- You are correct, one or two people should not be able to decide what animals are appropriate for what person. However, when a kid's arm gets bitten off or worse (God forbid), THAT is when certain groups will really start talking of bans etc. It is not myself and others causing these problems by speaking out about what we believe in. It is unscrupulous dealers/brokers/whatever you want to call them being irresponsible with regards to whom they are selling these animals to.

I am not jealous of Bob Clark, nor do I dislike him, I disagree with some of his business ethics and practices.
 
</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">THAT is when certain groups will really start talking of bans etc.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'> well if we wouldnt divide ourselves and all of us would stick togther none of us would ever have to worry about bans because theres alot more of us then, them, and no one really takes them seriously anymore, but were all to busy fueding over pointles things to stand togther, I can see tighter resrcitions such as in FL concerning crocs and large snakes, but theres no reason one cant sell them and/or own them, people need to go after the individuals not the whole, did you see that kid hand Bob the cash or did he tell you thats were he got it? or are you assuming because you didnt see any on anyone esles table?
 
Jason-

This issue is not "pointless", not to me anyway. I feel very strongly about it.

You say you see know reason why "one cant sell them and/or own them". Ok, do you feel that it is perfectly fine for any Joe Blow off the street to purchase a lion? Or okay for a minor to buy a venomous reptile? Because a Nile Croc is potentially just as deadly.

To answer your question regarding the kid that bought the croc: No, I did not see him give Bob the money, but where else would he have gotten it? This particular incident happened at one of the Arlington, Tx expos last year and when it was discovered that a 15 year old had purchased the animal the promotors stepped in and had Clark put a "Display Only" tag on the crocs. They still allowed him to keep them on his table, even though it is against city law to posses a crocodilian in the city of Arlington.

Look, I am not knocking Bob's python breeding efforts, I agree that he has done a tremedous amount of good with his work. I will even admit to drooling over his albino and super tiger retics at shows, they're beautiful animals. I just happen to feel that he is doing the wrong thing regarding the Nile crocs, and remember folks, it's just my opinion...  ;-)

Peace-
KH
 
"What's the difference between a Nile croc and an American alligator? Well, you really should not have to ask that question, but since you did, here you go.

1) American alligators are a domestic animal. Crocs are not.
2) American alligators are not known to attack, unless they have been conditioned by people feeding them in the wild. Usually they will flee when they see humans. Crocs are much more aggressive and have been known to include humans in their diet in their native habitat.
3) American alligators are rarely seen over twelve feet. Crocs can easily exceed that.
4) American alligators that have been captive bred and purchased, often end up being released into a local pond, canal or lake. Which is no big deal if you live anywhere in the southeastern United States, as previously mentioned they are a native species. Crocs that suffer this same unfortunate fait, will either parish (depending on location) attack someone or try to embed themselves into this new habitat. This has been a very big and ongoing problem with Caimen in South FL. These foriegn species can destroy the natural ecosystem by preying on native species, competing for food and breeding territories just to name a few.

I'm not taking any sides here, I just thought I'd point out some fact's.

Dennis Gulla
 
Dennis,

When you say, "American alligators are a domestic animal" are you saying that they are indigenous?  As I understand it, isn't the term "domestic" used referring animals such as dogs, cats, and the like?  I'm not being picky here (or, at least I'm not trying to be), but which way did you mean to use the word "domestic?"  As "indigenous" or as in a house pet?  I'm sure I know what you meant; just trying to clarify here.
 
"1) American alligators are a domestic animal. Crocs are not."

Are you serious?  Domestic?
 
Okay.....you guys know what I meant. American alligators are native to America.....not domestic. Crocs are not a native species. I was just trying to point out the differences in the two. Thanks for pointing that out.

Dennis Gulla
 
Since I was pressed for time this morning, here's the rest of my reply...

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">First off I would have to agree with you 100% on the crocs issue and animal welfare. But what do we leave then for the fate of hundreds of thousands of baby ball pythons and iguanas imported every year? Do they go to early retirement. Isn't the demand due to the fact that most of them die?</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>

Daniel, in the examples that you gave (balls, iguanas). The animals generally die because they can not or will not adapt to captivity. Stress and various pathogens are major contributors to their demise. In the case of captive crocodilians, their early demise results from a failure to provide adequate care.

With all of the Niles & american alligators that have made their way into the pet trade in the past several years, there should be a plethora of adult crocodilians in captivity. Yet, there is not.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">as far as him selling nile crocs, he has just as much right to do it as you have to seel your animals and I have to sell mine</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Jason, let me try to put it into perspective. If a customer wanted to buy a Dum from you, but did not have the means to properly care for it, would you still make the sale?

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">so you assume anyone who buys one cannot take care of it?</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Generally speaking, yes. Most people simply do not have the space or funds to properly care for Niles through adulthood. What happens to these animals after the novelty wears off and reality sets in? Zoos won't take them, as they have limited funds, and are not dumping grounds for throw-away pets.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"> know of alot of people who have them and love those animals and do everything for them,</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Honest question- what size are their crocs, and how long have they owned them?

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"> dont have any niles simply because of the size but I have caimans and I think they are the coolest thing under the sun</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Spectacled caimen are an entirely different animal, generally growing to less than half the size of Nile crocs. Proper husbandry of spectacled caimen is a bit more feasible. If you do breed them, you will have to make sure all of your out of state buyers acquire a Captive Bred Wildlife Permit from USFWS.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">do I like the idea of niles being on the market NO but do I agree with banning them NO, we all knonw what happens once one gets banned, the gov feels like they got their foot in the door now they want all the way in, </td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
I never suggested an outright ban, nor any type of permit system. What I had suggested is that certain sellers exercise a bit of discretion in who they sell such animals to.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">well I have to dissagree with ya there to because at the chicago show last oct I seen him refusing to sell to minors, I didnt set that show up, we were there both days and both days spent hours walking the show talking to everyone and seeing all the things I normally miss because I set them up, he refused selling a retic to one minor and talked a couple people out of the niles that he didnt feel right about, we probally spent 2 hrs or so at his table talking to him and his staff and checking out his animals</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Perhaps he has altered his ways in the past year or two. However, I'm curious as to why he was allowed to sell/display animals which were prohibited by Illinois state law. Illinois currently consideres all crocodilians to be "life-threatening", no matter the size, and prohibits their possession and sale.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">your a military guy I would think you would have a better apreciation for your rights in this country, owning a nile is one of them, if you dont agree with owning one thats fine but dont ? peoples ethics because they do</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Indeed we are a country of rights and freedoms, and that sets us apart from the rest.However, just because we have a right to something, it does not necessarily follow that exercising that right is ethical, per se. For example, the Jaycess have a right to conduct rattlesnake roundups, but I think that we would all agree that it's a fairly unethical prospect. As it stands, the First Ammendment provides the "right" to desecrate the American flag. Ethical?

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">How is that not an attack on Bob?  Pimping?  You say I made an ignorant attack.  Does your attack on Bob qualify as ignorant?</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
The contexts are different, but I'll give you that one.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I'm not attacking you here Ken, just asking if you apply the same standards to your own statements. </td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Aside from the original "jealous" comment, nothing you've said was taken as an attack.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Im Just a little Curious Here... What makes you think you have the right to Judge Bob Clark or the people he sells Niles or Retics to? </td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
The United States Constitution and the very principles on which our country was founded gives me that right. I'm sorry, but I did not realize that we had lost the right to freely express our opinions. I'll make note of that for future reference, though.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Who are you to say that the people whom he sells to are not expirenced enough to own them? Did you interview each person whom purchased either a Nile or a Retic from Bob? If so then I would say that if the conclusion you have come to is from the facts, and not just your opinions then so be it. The truth here is that you are passing judgement on Bob Clark with out really knowing the facts of each individual case in question.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Look at the totality of circumstances here. Niles grow to adult lengths of 16-20 feet. Seriously now, how many people do you know that can feed and house a croc that big? Also, with as many crocs that have been sold the past several years, how many subadults & adults have you seen around?
 
Accidentally hit the add reply button too soon...

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"> personally am a huge Fan, and a distant friend of Bobss and am kinda wonderring what makes you come to this conclusion of a man whom has not only proven himself over the years as a top notch breeder, but as one hell of a man as well?</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
I never said that Bob wasn't a top-notch breeder. I merely questioned his selling of Nile crocs to certain individuals.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I personally wouldnt purchase reptiles from anyone BUT Bob Clark. His stock is world Known, his ethics are very practicle, and he personally is one hell of a nice guy. You get your animals when he says you will, they arrive alive, and they are the best damn looking animals I have seen to date. </td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Likewise, I never questioned the quality of his animals or his general demeanor. I'm sure that Bob is a really nice guy, and I only flaw him on the two points that I had mentioned.

Otherwise, I have nothing against Bob. In the past, I've recommended him to people looking for certain pythons, and will continue to do so. Just because I have a strong opinion about his selling Nile crocs, it does not mean that I dislike the man.

One last thing in closing (finally)...
</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I can see tighter resrcitions such as in FL concerning crocs and large snakes</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Actually Jas, Florida is a fairly lenient state. Yes, they have permit requirements, but the permits are both easy to obtain and inexpensive. There's no restrictions on large snakes at the state level, and all one needs to do to obtain a Venomous Reptile License or Class I/Class II Wildlife Permit is demonstrate that you are able to properly house and maintain whatever restricted animals that you will be working with. The only downside to FL is that you can't possess eastern indigos.  <img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':('>
 
Kelli "No, I did not see him give Bob the money, but where else would he have gotten it?" thats guilt by association, whos to say that it wasnt some super cheap discount deal on the first table the kid seen? most 15yrs old dont have $250-300 to throw away on a croc

Ken
</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Illinois currently consideres all crocodilians to be "life-threatening", no matter the size, and prohibits their possession and sale.
</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Ken that is not Illinios law at all, Ill try to find it for you later but it reads something like "any animal considered dangerous or deadly" its a matter of opinion, there is no set standards here, case laws states any croc up to 4.5ft is not illegal or dangerous, the thing is, Illinios is about the stupidist state in the world and I cannot wait to leave here, what they are harrasing and arresting people for here is aligators, under the endangered species act, I know of 5 differant people here in this state that in the last year have been arrested for owning an endangered animal, none were arrested because it was a croc, one was even given an endangered species permit for his gators

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Jason, let me try to put it into perspective. If a customer wanted to buy a Dum from you, but did not have the means to properly care for it, would you still make the sale?</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'> abosulty not, but being relistic about it, its hard to judge people you meet at shows, every now and again yes I will get a bad feeing about someone and refuse the sale, its even harder to tell over the internet, people can talk and type a good game, being realistic the sad thing is I know some of my animals have wound up in poor homes anyone who produces animals nad sells to the general public runs the same risk and if they have produced the amount amount that I have some of theirs have wound up in poor homes as well
</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Proper husbandry of spectacled caimen </td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'> Ke sometimes you do assume to much, I keep Dwarfs, no permits required, although I did get my exhibitors permit incase I ver get that knock on my door so I can tell them to get the he!l off my property
</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Also, with as many crocs that have been sold the past several years, how many subadults & adults have you seen around?</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'> well honeslty theres alot but croc people normally dont advertise what they have and where its at for obvious reasons but generally speaking niles dont grow as rapid as gators and havnt been on the mainstream market as long, up until a couple years ago it was only the diehards that could even afford them

i agree with ya on some points man i just dont think it makes a person wrong for selling them, later on dude
 
</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Illinios is about the stupidist state in the world and I cannot wait to leave here</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>Aha! Something that we can absolutely, positively, unequivicobaly agree on! <img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'>

I won't even begin to rant about IL, and especially Chicago's, failed experiment in gun control (aka criminal empowerment), as this really isn't the place for a lengthy 2nd Ammendment discussion. Let's just say God help any private citizen who thinks that they can exercise their right to bear arms in the windy city. Of course, elected officials have exempted themselves from those laws.

In Chi-town, having a Leatherman or Swiss Army knife in your pocket is a misdemeanor. So is playing with one of those Nerf guns- remember the ones that shot little foam darts? Yep, having a Nerf gun can get you six months in jail or a $200 fine.

God forbid you wear a scarf covering your nose/mouth in the winter- technically, that requires a written permit from the mayor.

The list of asinine laws goes on and on. I've strayed a bit too far off-topic in this reply.  <img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':0'>
 
Jason-

Obviously you have never been down here for one of the Irving/Arlington Texas Reptile Expos. I think the last one had a whooping 14 vendors. There was only one vendor at that show selling Niles, trust me.

Well, we are off tomorrow to West Texas, gonna go do some real herping, if we're lucky we'll bring back a suboc or two, maybe a bairdi and I won't turn my nose up at anyu greybands either!

take care..
 
Ya that doesnt surprise me at all, I cant wait to go back east, land of the free. Back home in PA the only regulations we had to worry about was township, none of this crap from the state, they got better things to do then intrude in our lives. Any heres that law ill post the link below.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">(720 ILCS 585/0.1)
   Sec. 0.1.  As  used  in  this  Act,  unless  the  context  otherwise requires:
   "Dangerous  animal"  means  a  lion, tiger, leopard, ocelot, jaguar, cheetah, margay, mountain lion, lynx, bobcat, jaguarundi,  bear,  hyena, wolf or coyote, or any poisonous or life-threatening reptile.
   "Owner"  means  any  person  who  (a)  has  a right of property in a dangerous animal, (b) keeps or harbors a dangerous  animal,  ©  has  a dangerous  animal  in  his care, or (d) acts as custodian of a dangerous animal.
   "Person"  means  any  individual,  firm,  association,  partnership, corporation, or other legal entity, any public or  private  institution, the  State  of  Illinois,  or  any  municipal  corporation  or political subdivision of the State.
(Source: P.A. 84-28.)

   (720 ILCS 585/1)
   Sec. 1.  No person shall have a right of property in, keep,  harbor, care  for,  act  as  custodian  of  or  maintain  in  his possession any dangerous animal  except  at  a  properly  maintained  zoological  park, federally   licensed   exhibit,  circus,   scientific   or  educational institution, research laboratory, veterinary hospital or  animal  refuge in an escape-proof enclosure.
(Source: P.A. 84-28.)

   (720 ILCS 585/2)
   Sec. 2.  It is no defense to a  violation  of  Section  1  that  the person violating such Section has attempted to domesticate the dangerous animal.   If  there  appears  to  be  imminent danger to the public, any dangerous animal found not in compliance with the provisions of this Act
shall be subject to seizure and may immediately be placed in an approved facility.   Upon the conviction of a person for a violation  of  Section 1,  the animal with regard to which the conviction was obtained shall be confiscated and placed in an approved facility, with the  owner  thereof to  be  responsible  for  all  costs  connected  with  the  seizure  and
confiscation  of  such  animal. Approved facilities include, but are not limited to,  a  zoological  park,  federally  licensed  exhibit,  humane society, veterinary hospital or animal refuge.
(Source: P.A. 84-28.)
</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">No person shall have a right of property in, keep,  harbor,care  for,  act  as  custodian  of  or  maintain  in  his possession any dangerous animal</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'> see its all a matter of opinion, it doesnt state anything specific, gives them more room to harrass people I guess
http://www.legis.state.il.us/ilcs/ch720/ch720act585.htm

Kelli, after seeing him in Chicago I just have a hard time believing he would knowingly sell to a minor maybe the kid had an adult there, I dont know, anyway take care best of luck herping......
 
I have bought from bob, met the guy, and like him. To be honest though Kevin from NERD is much more my kind of guy to deal with. I have bought countless snakes off of him and if you ask me, he has better retics.
 
Better Retics than Bob Clark.  Riiiiight.  I doubt it considering he's the first guy to produce just about every one of the new morphs.  I'm sure that Bob Clark holds his best back and sells the rest.  Meaning that he would have the best animals.  I'd imagine that most of the retics that NERD has originated from Bob Clark.  I always thought it was pretty much understood he was the best retic breeder and had the best animals.  Am I right?<img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'>???
-Lucas
 
</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>Better Retics than Bob Clark.  Riiiiight.  I doubt it considering he's the first guy to produce just about every one of the new morphs.  I'm sure that Bob Clark holds his best back and sells the rest.  Meaning that he would have the best animals.</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">

Lucas,

You may be right. It would be illogical to sell your best animals if you plan to continue to improve their genetics.

On the other hand I have seen better looking albino ball pythons (as far as contrast is concerned) from other breeders other than Bob (and he was the first one to produce them) and better piebalds than what P. Kahl sells (and he was the first one to produce them too).

Regards,  <img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'>
 
Ken,
  You also mentioned Retics. What about Burms? Burms have the potential of reaching enormous sizes the same as retics do. Yes you have the constitutional right to have an opinion but not to pass judgment. I, being the hobby for 22 years now think that each case (owning of large constrictors) should be dealt with on a one on one basis. Hell I know some adults that shouldnt own large constrictors.
  Also if your talking about Retics and things why not mention Boa's. pound for pound they are they strongest of all large constrictors. Should a parent not allow thier 16 year old son to own a Boa? You mentioned Bob selling Retics and Crocs to minors... well how did the minor get the shows? more then likely his parents took him/her. Therefore Im sure the parent gave permision for thier child to own these animals. Thus making the parent responsible not Bob. What about the pet stores who sell Burms or Retics to minors? They dont ever tell people that the 3 foot pretty lil snake will reach 10 ft in a years time. Why not bash them?
  I think the point im trying to make is you shouldnt judge people by thier age. If a person is 17 should he not own a retic? Hell in a years time that same person that is 17 could possibley being defending your rights to free speech in the military. Maybe Im wrong but If im gonna trust someone with my life... then why not trust them to own a reptile?
 
</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Lucas Denning @ June 09 2002,20:30)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Better Retics than Bob Clark.  Riiiiight.  </td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Hey, based on my experience from buying retics from BOTH guy, kevins have impressed me more.

I have boughten several yellow head retics that where hatched from retics that Kev imported and bred. I'm sure those didn't come from Bob Clark, unless he has some breed and release program he has kept secret.

The baby I bought from Kevin that was from a het to het for calico breeding didn't originate from Bob, considering all of the animals invloved never came from Clark stock. Its a superb retic, and even if it doesn't turn calico like several of its littermates have so far, its still one of the mosy docile and gorgeous retics I have encountered.

Thats just a couple of examples. I have more I could list. I'm going by my experience here, mine. My experiences have taught me that Kevin has better retics. Sorry if you disagree but you are not going to change my mind b/c you think otherwise. Its not like Bob is perfect, you know.
 
</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">One thing that I can assure you of is that The Barkers are a bit more selective about their clientele. Retics & Nile crocs aren't sold to anyone with a fistful of dollars. Nor have they made a scene a the Arlington expo when informed that they could not sell Nile crocs (note- the Barkers do not sell Nile crocs. I am referring to the subject of the inquiry).</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>

I know I'm a "newbie" on this particular site, so sorry if this offends anyone, BUT, I believe the original inquiry was that boaguy wanted to know how the animals people received from him (Bob)were,what's his service are like etc. Many people replied with praise about both subjects, his service and his animals, and though you(Ken) also said he would be satisfied with a purchase from Bob clark,it seems that you couldn't resist putting him down as well...

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">The only things that I can personally fault him for are the ethics of selling Nile crocs to anyone with $200 and the aforementioned outburst at the Arlington expo.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>  

I personally do NOT think that it was necessary to lash out this way. You could have said that you didn't like the fact that he sold nile crocs and left it at that, but you went a bit further and started a p*ssing match, by incinuating that Bob(unlike the barkers) doesn't care who he sells to or doesn't care about the animals he sells. Which, if I didn't know better(like boaguy), would make me think that I may not want to buy from such a person.

Every one is entitled to their opinion, and mine is that if you don't "mean" to attack somebody's ethics, then learn how to phrase it as such. And stop bellyaching over something that "one person" can't hold the blame for. It is the responsibility of all, breeders, owners, parents, herp society's, and our communities to make sure that previously mentioned incidents do not occur. I don't know about the arlington situation, or the 15 yr old boy, but I DO know that this is NOT a "typical" occurance when Bob is at a show or selling his animals.

Boaguy,  I know that both Bob and the Barkers are reputable people, their services and their animals are top notch, and until this post, I have NEVER heard anything bad about Bob in particular. All reports of his animals are fantastic, as said here by others and his services, including shipping and what have you, are Great as well.

So Good luck to you.
 
</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Ya that doesnt surprise me at all, I cant wait to go back east, land of the free. Back home in PA the only regulations we had to worry about was township, none of this crap from the state, they got better things to do then intrude in our lives. </td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>

Btw, classic Dum's, Thank goodness for that. I am from Pa. and I am grateful that we don't have the more strict laws that other states do.
 
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