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Broke his fast..... Kind of

E

Elfmaze

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my 4 year old Ball hasn't eatten since october. Then two nights ago I thought that we finally made some headway when he took a mouse and ate it normally. But then he threw it up the same night. I don't know what could be wrong with him. Hes in his new tank and temperatures were good the past two weeks.
 
Not eating since October wouldnt normally concern me on an adult ball, could have been cycling, some dont give up on breeding. The fact that he regurged is entirely a different story. First off I will say that I hate tanks and I think they are the worst thing for ball pythons, some may disagree, but glass just doesnt hold heat very well, especially on "reptile" tanks. Also has he been a normal feeder in the past, or has he had issues? A vet visit is always reccomended in a situation like this, and they can do a fecal so you can see if it is some sort of internal parasite. If so they will give you something like fenbendazole or metrozol (Flagyl/Panacur), and if its not then you know you need to evaluate your husbandry. You said his temps are good, what do you consider good? Good luck, Dan M.
 
Hes in a wooden 80 gallon i built. Temp has an ambient of around 80* in the morning with a 75* cooler side and a 95* hot spot. He has always been a good feeder.
Another problem i have been having with him is he keeps getting a light scale rot. It comes about midway thru his cycle and leaves with the next shed. even in my steril quarentene tank he still got the rouged up scales.
 
I dont know how much you know about ball pythons, but 80 gallons is way way way to big for that snake, unless there are hides everywhere, and even then seems excessive. They are very nervous animals and not eating in 7 months once he eats he needs to be able to stay warm and out of sight for a few days so he can digest in peace. There is no need for a cool side near 75. I would keep the cool side around maybe 82 and a warm side of around 90 and the ambient temp somewhere in between. Too warm or too cool can cause regurging very easily even in an otherwise healthy animal, but especially in one who's system hasnt seen food in a bit. Now mind you I am by no means a ball expert, but I would cut down the size of his enclosure. That way you can easily control his temps and know exactly what temp he is at. As far as the scale thing goes that is something I am not familiar with, as none of my snakes have ever had any scale issues ever. I would see a vet about that immediately, and have the fecal done as I said. Good luck! Dan M.
 
If it's leaving with each shed, it's not scale rot. Every one of my ball pythons gets a pink belly and rough belly scales a week or two before they turn blue. It's normal.

80g is definitely way too big -- you're stressing him out with all that floor space and open air. A 40-50g would be very suitable and easier to maintain temps. 75 is too cool on the cool side, bring it up to at least 80. I wouldn't do 95 on the warm side, that's a bit on the hot end and he may not like it. I personally use 90 warm, 80 cool. Make sure you're using digital thermometers with probes to measure your temps, and that your heating elements are controlled by a thermostat.
 
The enclosure accually has two balls in it, they have been living together for about two years without issues. But yes lots of hides, the reason for the temp swing is the heat lamp in the one side. He is a very mobile snake, and if he is awake he will be wandering around climbing on all the branches and hides. Ultimatly the enclosure was built for the red tail, but she is still too small to justify it.

Should i try waiting two weeks keeping him hydrated and maby try a hopper next time?
 
I agree keeping more than one together can be trouble, however if what you say is true and they have been living together in that enclosure for two years I cant see the issue. Unless perhaps something has changed. Are they two males, and possibly one, or both have hit maturity and maybe are getting stressed out by the presence of another male(dont even know that they do that, but judging by their characteristics seems resonable). What over the course of the last year has changed to cause him to go off feed, and them to regurge? I would seperate them into smaller enclosures and monitor them to see how they do. Is the other one still eating? You certainly dont have to worry about them missing each other lol. Good luck once again. I used to have 2 adult balls that lived together years ago, but they were the exception to balls not the rule. They lived together, even shared the same hide box. Then during feeding time you would lay two sheets on the floor and feed them right there, and they ate everytime and never had any issues, but that is a once in a lifetime thing. They normally dont behave this way. I strongly reccomend seperateing them, especially if the one may be sick. No need to share a cage. Dan M.
 
Ones male the other female. which could explane the fast. The younger female is one of the best feeding snakes i own. the male(problem snake) historically will eat just about anywhere, he has been know to strike at rodents while you're holding him and he'll proceed to swallow the thing while wrapped around you're hand. VERY Tamed snake and Has never had any problems untill this winter.

I refuse to admit that these things are so delacate that they can't figure out where to go to thermoregulate themselves. They do survive in the wild without thermostats right?
 
Yeah thats why i hate using UTH and other contact heat sources. I will generally only use lamps.

Had one case when i was using a UTH and the temperature probe got pulled up, the heater kept getting hotter trying to compinsate. luckly no critters were hurt. But never been a dan of UTH
 
However, it's common knowledge that they need belly heat in order to properly digest their food. Overheat lamps don't provide that kind of heat, and lamps easily overheat enclosures just as easily by not being regulated.
 
The types of burns there are from direct heat contact. Like sitting on a hot rock. I'm more talking about ambient thermo regulation, i believe they can sence there core temperature correct?


Didn't know about the belly heat thing
 
Yes, they can sense their core temperature. But if it's too hot on one end, you're forcing him to be on the other end -- not to mention forcing him to live with a cagemate 24-7 with no break from each other.

You never did answer as to what kind of thermometers you're using to measure temps?
 
Elfmaze said:
*FAN for dan
Click to expand...

I saw this and thought I had a fan... oh well lol. Anyway I use heat tape and a thermostat and I love it. No resp problems, no nothing, all of my animals know where the heat tape is and sit on it when they want and move of it when they feel like it. Most good thermostats will turn off if they sense something may be wrong, plus with heat tape if it does malfunction at least the animal can move off of it and be away from the heat for the most part. I have used it for a while and never once have I had an issue. Lamps dont offer you the ability to control the temperature, and they get very very hot directly underneath them. This goes back to why I am not a big fan of tanks to begin with. You could easily build a two box rack for these guys for very little money and get a thermostat and some heat tape and be good to go. If you need any advice on how to do such things, or where to buy from let me know, and I help as much as I can. Racks are just so Ideal for balls as they allow them the privacy they crave, and you will see them thrive if set up right. Take care, Dan M.
 
Nice pics Jen. I'm going to vomit now. Even still being a noob I have seen different things. None of which look good or anything, seeing the starved animals I've seen makes me want to vomit to. I donno what it is but to see a Creature burned like that with its skin hanging off, UGH! My tummy turns. Who owned that Snake and more importantly did it live? Thta poor thing. If somebody handed me a Snake in that condition I'd feel better stickin it in the freezer. What a painful life!
 
Couple of quick thoughts....

Besides not creating the needed belly heat, overhead lights are notorious for drying out the humidity that Ball Pythons need.

How much younger is this "young female" that is kept together with this male? A pair should NOT be kept together at all if she is under breeding age/weight. She can be bred too young, causing problems and/or death. He also probably is not going to eat if he is kept in constant breeding mode.
 
Leighanne said:
Nice pics Jen. I'm going to vomit now. Even still being a noob I have seen different things. None of which look good or anything, seeing the starved animals I've seen makes me want to vomit to. I donno what it is but to see a Creature burned like that with its skin hanging off, UGH! My tummy turns. Who owned that Snake and more importantly did it live? Thta poor thing. If somebody handed me a Snake in that condition I'd feel better stickin it in the freezer. What a painful life!
Click to expand...

Why would you put it in the freezer? What a cruel and horrible death. It was 2 different snakes, by the way.

Those pics are tough to see, but necessary to get through to some of the dense people that come on those forums and think they can skimp on their snakes' enclosures, then wonder why they don't eat or they regurge or they get respiratory infections. I have to make it as blunt and point-proven as possible to get it through to them.
 
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