Bad Guy Buyer Beware Keith Cantore AKA Albinocollector

[albinocollector]

The D3 in the combined lipid soluble vitamin shot is indicated for MBD. Whether as a therapeutic or prophylactic application, I cannot say from the screen shots provided. I would normally not include A, but there was an ocular issue identified (hence the gentamicin) on some level.

The gentamicin is for the infected/inflamed eyes secondary to a primary respiratory infection (for which the enrofloxacin was prescribed) that I thought John had mentioned elsewhere in the thread already. Puffy and inflamed eyes are commonly associated with RIs, so it makes sense.

The animal was medicated somewhat comprehensively in response to the presentation of multiple symptoms.

Nick I sent this man thsi Turtle OCT 9th he claims this 1 month old turtle had MBD when he got it yet its stil alive till yesterday !! you know liek I do a snapper witha MOOSHY shell like he described is doen in dasy to a week not 2 months later this man is taking us all on a spin I dont doubt he went to teh Vet but I know it wasnt when I sent him that turtle how can NOV 16th be tied to MY FAULT from OCT 9th ?? when I was never told or thsi was never meantioned to me would you send this man a free turtle after 2 months and 2 days ??????

 

[allesuberschildkroten]

I think you missed the part that it was hatched in Sept and ONLY weighs 10 grams.... Plz do tell me how this new little baby already has MBD??????????

 

[albinocollector]

And the UNLESS the Vet actually ran tests on the turtle to make sure what it was... All John had to do is say this is whats wrong and they would have treated it for that. Not one time when I've my turtles to the vet has the vet done anything to disprove what I was saying and treated based on the info I gave.... So unless the vet was a turtle expert they probably just treated it based on the info given....

Very true I only had 1 vet that didnt ask me what the problem was and thats the vet I use to thsi day the rest asked me I told them and I tell them the meds I wanted as if I was the doctor wich I coudlve also been wrong but last few years I have a great vet taht knows his stuff

 

[nickolasanastasiou]

haha Good point I wasnt paying attention been up all day and tired but still Nick I sent this man teh turtle on OCT 9th he just now called me to make thsi claim to me 3 days ago YOU TELL ME WHAT you would do Nick ??????? and I know I have dealt with you and you are very fair I also know no way in hell would you take thsi mans word fro it that he calles you 2 months and 5 days later to say you owe him a turtle

If he came to me within a reasonable period of time, I would do what I might consider reasonable to make him whole. If inexpensive, a replacement. If expensive, a return for a full refund.

However, if I was not made aware of an issue until approximately two months after the transaction I was engaged in, I would wish my buyer well and offer him what guidance I could.

I have TOS which address such specifically. Contact within the hour for a DOA with clear photographic evidence. If there is a condition discrepancy, I need to be made aware within the day (and then I will work to give options ranging from assistance, discount, a wait-and-see approach, or refund for return). If I get no word back within the day, terms are then closed unless *I* decide otherwise.

People unintentionally kill these creatures (especially baby animals) often with well-meaning yet poor-ending husbandry errors. Those cute baby red ear sliders people buy? Most die. Anoles? Most die. Goldfish? Die. Hermit crabs? Die. Sometimes the animals just never have what it takes long-term for reasons unknown. In any case, my terms exist to prevent that common general result from being twisted beyond its reasonable limits of understanding.

If I did not hear back for months about an animal with the terms I clearly employ in my ads, *any* benevolence shown beyond my terms is solely at my discretion.

 

[nickolasanastasiou]

I think you missed the part that it was hatched in Sept and ONLY weighs 10 grams.... Plz do tell me how this new little baby already has MBD??????????

Are you addressing me or someone else?

If there is a congenital defect preventing utilization and incorporation of calcium, then MBD is in effect regardless of time. However, if you are indeed addressing my post, you will notice I did not state that the animal had or did not have MBD.

So I missed no part (unlike yourself and parroting a temporal error).

 

[nickolasanastasiou]

And the UNLESS the Vet actually ran tests on the turtle to make sure what it was... All John had to do is say this is whats wrong and they would have treated it for that. Not one time when I've my turtles to the vet has the vet done anything to disprove what I was saying and treated based on the info I gave.... So unless the vet was a turtle expert they probably just treated it based on the info given....

List the tests you would have the vet run.

Run through the test for MBD in a 10g Chelydra serpentina hatchling. I am curious to know. Serum cholecalciferol levels? Is that the standard approach? What are the reference ranges to compare against for the species at this age and can one draw an adequate sample volume for the examination? I do not know, but I am hoping you might be able to further this if you have additional technical insights.

The above is why the vet would administer D3 prophylactically. The D3 would not cause harm, so whether or not the animal actually has MBD or not would not meaningfully alter the application of the D3 portion of the therapy in the scenario presented.

 

[albinocollector]

Are you addressing me or someone else?

If there is a congenital defect preventing utilization and incorporation of calcium, then MBD is in effect regardless of time. However, if you are indeed addressing my post, you will notice I did not state that the animal had or did not have MBD.

So I missed no part (unlike yourself and parroting a temporal error).

JOHN told me over the phone the shell was complete MOOSH and almost dead on arrival and never eat really the way he described it was MBD I told him that MBD takes time to turna shell into complete MOOSH and fall apart like he described and Nick if you notice in VET papers nothing is mentioned on that issue !! when John called me that was his main Issue and said it was a lil sick to that it was stuffed up to be exact he didnt use the wor RI or anything .

 

[allesuberschildkroten]

Are you addressing me or someone else?

If there is a congenital defect preventing utilization and incorporation of calcium, then MBD is in effect regardless of time. However, if you are indeed addressing my post, you will notice I did not state that the animal had or did not have MBD.

So I missed no part (unlike yourself and parroting a temporal error).

Im addressing anyone that wants to answer the question... I bet money the vet did not do tests to prove it had MBD. The OP has not provided ANY PICS of the turtle to prove what he is saying... You stated it was treated for multiple reasons... Well who know if those things were really wrong with the turtle. As I said before the vet treated the animal based on what the OP told them and medicated it accordingly... They were not able to run tests on it etc bc of how small it is... I think maybe you did miss something, don't come at me like I did something wrong. Im just looking for facts and proof and not seeing ANY from the OP but a bunch of this and that bs that doesnt make sense. Where is a pic of the dead turtle.. Where is pics of the turtles shell falling apart like he said.... I dont see it... DO YOU????

 

[albinocollector]

If he came to me within a reasonable period of time, I would do what I might consider reasonable to make him whole. If inexpensive, a replacement. If expensive, a return for a full refund.

However, if I was not made aware of an issue until approximately two months after the transaction I was engaged in, I would wish my buyer well and offer him what guidance I could.

I have TOS which address such specifically. Contact within the hour for a DOA with clear photographic evidence. If there is a condition discrepancy, I need to be made aware within the day (and then I will work to give options ranging from assistance, discount, a wait-and-see approach, or refund for return). If I get no word back within the day, terms are then closed unless *I* decide otherwise.

People unintentionally kill these creatures (especially baby animals) often with well-meaning yet poor-ending husbandry errors. Those cute baby red ear sliders people buy? Most die. Anoles? Most die. Goldfish? Die. Hermit crabs? Die. Sometimes the animals just never have what it takes long-term for reasons unknown. In any case, my terms exist to prevent that common general result from being twisted beyond its reasonable limits of understanding.

If I did not hear back for months about an animal with the terms I clearly employ in my ads, *any* benevolence shown beyond my terms is solely at my discretion.

I agree as I told John over the phone I would replace it after I said sorry he has this problem but I cant be at fault for a 2 month and a week old deal just hearing about it for first time. I offered him a turtle shipped at 100.00 cheaper and he refused and got mad then I offered him it 1/2 off here on the post to help him out and end the BS here and he refused saying he wasnt in this for the $$ or turtle but to shame Me !! I still see no part that Im liable for so the proof is Hes just a bad man to sell to cause He can do this to anyone of us .

 

[nickolasanastasiou]

JOHN told me over the phone the shell was complete MOOSH and almost dead on arrival and never eat really the way he described it was MBD I told him that MBD takes time to turna shell into complete MOOSH and fall apart like he described and Nick if you notice in VET papers nothing is mentioned on that issue !! when John called me that was his main Issue and said it was a lil sick to that it was stuffed up to be exact he didnt use the wor RI or anything .

I already addressed the specifics of the veterinary document screenshots and the rationale behind a vet's actions.

What John says is going on is not something I am defending or attacking. I am going by the fragments of data available from a professional source that has no emotional investment in this situation.

 

[allesuberschildkroten]

And I doubt the turtle would have stayed alive for over a month with RI

 

[nickolasanastasiou]

Im addressing anyone that wants to answer the question... I bet money the vet did not do tests to prove it had MBD. The OP has not provided ANY PICS of the turtle to prove what he is saying... You stated it was treated for multiple reasons... Well who know if those things were really wrong with the turtle. As I said before the vet treated the animal based on what the OP told them and medicated it accordingly... They were not able to run tests on it etc bc of how small it is... I think maybe you did miss something, don't come at me like I did something wrong. Im just looking for facts and proof and not seeing ANY from the OP but a bunch of this and that bs that doesnt make sense. Where is a pic of the dead turtle.. Where is pics of the turtles shell falling apart like he said.... I dont see it... DO YOU????

I am still waiting for the missed part. I do not think you have done something wrong.

Vets are not slaves to patients.

I have addressed what I have chosen to or subsequently been asked to.

1) The date.

2) The therapeutic rationale. If a test could not be performed, then what is the clinical outcome of not treating if it is the case as potentially suspected? Not positive. That is the why the what was done by the vet.

3) How I would operate in a scenario like this.

 

[albinocollector]

And I doubt the turtle would have stayed alive for over a month with RI

It wouldnt there for it didnt have it when I shiped it cause from OCT 9th to NOV 16th when it seen the vet it wouldve Clearly been dead !! JOHN IS A LIAR

 

[nickolasanastasiou]

I agree as I told John over the phone I would replace it after I said sorry he has this problem but I cant be at fault for a 2 month and a week old deal just hearing about it for first time. I offered him a turtle shipped at 100.00 cheaper and he refused and got mad then I offered him it 1/2 off here on the post to help him out and end the BS here and he refused saying he wasnt in this for the $$ or turtle but to shame Me !! I still see no part that Im liable for so the proof is Hes just a bad man to sell to cause He can do this to anyone of us .

I understand. I am only speaking to the date because assertions were made in error, the technical rationale because it is relevant, and what I would do because you asked for this latter piece.

 

[nickolasanastasiou]

And I doubt the turtle would have stayed alive for over a month with RI

Depends, but unlikely if severe, yes.

 

[albinocollector]

I am still waiting for the missed part. I do not think you have done something wrong.

Vets are not slaves to patients.

I have addressed what I have chosen to or subsequently been asked to.

1) The date.

2) The therapeutic rationale. If a test could not be performed, then what is the clinical outcome of not treating if it is the case as potentially suspected? Not positive. That is the why the what was done by the vet.

3) How I would operate in a scenario like this.

Nickolas I know you have a good Opinion if you recieved this turtle OCT 9th and it was sick from RI do you believe without treatment it would be alive still on NOV 16th ?? at only 1 month of age ??

 

[nickolasanastasiou]

As I already posted, it would depend, but it would be unlikely.

 

[allesuberschildkroten]

I am still waiting for the missed part. I do not think you have done something wrong.

Vets are not slaves to patients.

I have addressed what I have chosen to or subsequently been asked to.

1) The date.

2) The therapeutic rationale. If a test could not be performed, then what is the clinical outcome of not treating if it is the case as potentially suspected? Not positive. That is the why the what was done by the vet.

3) How I would operate in a scenario like this.

You're correct... I understand why the vet would treat it with no test being done bc thats what the OP said. So would it have lived for over a month with RI, to my knowledge once turtles get RI and you dont treat it soon enough the ending comes all to quickly. I've never personally experienced this with mine just what I've read. Is that correct?? Bc if so the seller can't be blamed for the turtle getting RI.. The OP stated the shell was falling apart etc on the turtle bc of MBD. I just want to see a pic of this as proof. Not just a vet bill where they treated it based on what the OP told them..

 

[albinocollector]

As I already posted, it would depend, but it would be unlikely.

Thanks thats been My hole point here to prove that its next to impossible that this turtle was in fact sick when I sent it to him like he claimed I know it wasnt and he knows it wasnt but wanted to point it out to everyone . and this EXPLAINS JOHN why you didnt call me till 2 months and 5 days later !! Im not the BAD GUY JOHN YOU ARE here !! I raise quality healthy animals and many people know that .

 

[nickolasanastasiou]

You're correct... I understand why the vet would treat it with no test being done bc thats what the OP said. So would it have lived for over a month with RI, to my knowledge once turtles get RI and you dont treat it soon enough the ending comes all to quickly. I've never personally experienced this with mine just what I've read. Is that correct?? Bc if so the seller can't be blamed for the turtle getting RI.. The OP stated the shell was falling apart etc on the turtle bc of MBD. I just want to see a pic of this as proof. Not just a vet bill where they treated it based on what the OP told them..

I am in no disagreement with this. I would have liked more evidence as well.