Can butterflies be posinous?

[neatochickens27]

Howdy..i should be getting my chameleon very soon and i was wondering if any buterflies can be posinous to chameleons.What about moths?Any info is appreciated..thanks a bunch.

 

[JGARR]

well i dont know about poisonous but some butterflies eat toxic plants as catipillars and in turn when adult butterflies they ward off some predators with bright colors that indicate that they are foul tasting.......

 

[Vince]

my cham loves moths

 

[neatochickens27]

i see..moths are safe though?

 

[Reptileking636]

monarchs can pack a nasty punch, and i would stay away from wild caught insects if I were you. But if wou want to go ahead, but stay away from the monarchs

 

[Vince]

I dont know I never feed them the moths, they eat them on their own. But better safe then sorry ya know.

 

[neatochickens27]

yep..thanks everyone.

 

[Chameleon Company]

Dave, there is no record of such

With regards to butterflies, moths, etc, being toxic. There certainly are the caterpillar stages of some that are exceedingly toxic, and capable of nasty stings via poisonous spines, to you or anything else. Chameleons show a remarkable ability to discriminate, usually avoiding the more brightly colored insects. There are few documented instances of any insect which is toxic being consumed by an unsuspecting lizard ... but a huge exception would be bearded dragons having no fear of consuming fireflies, with fatal results. It is a safe assumption that firefles are toxic to many lizards. I think you are OK with any moth or butterfly that your animal chooses to eat.

Jim Flaherty
The Chameleon Company, LLC

 

[COanimalhouse]

moth suppliers

Does anyone know of any companies that sell moths, or any other insects that are not crickets and suitable for sub-adult to adult chameleons? I was talking to a very well respected exotic veterinarian (Dr. Terry Campbell at CSU) and sees a fairly high caseload of chameleons. He said from his experience it seems very important to provide a wide variety of insects in their diet. All of the local pet stores here sell only crickets and meal or wax worms, which I have read are not terribly nutritious for chams.

-Julie

 

[Dave W.]

Howdy Julie,

http://www.mulberryfarms.com/
http://www.californiasilkworms.com/catalog/
http://www.silkwormwholesale.com/

http://www.blaberus.com/ try orange spotted or discoids
http://www.herpfood.com/
http://grubco.netstorekeeper.com/ get the big housefly larvae and hatch them.


There are a ton of places that sell feeders.

I use:
silkworms
superworms
orange spotted roaches (no smell no glass climbing)
madagascar hissing roaches (no smell but climb glass)
lobster roaches. ( full grown is still not too big. Cheap, climb glass, some tank odor but not bad.)
silkmoths
crickets


Once you get a roach colony established, you'll never have to buy another one again! Fort Collins is great weather to keep roaches under control. In the unlikely event that one should escape, the dry air or winter cold will finish them off. They're tropical...

 

[COanimalhouse]

Thanks

Dave,

Thanks for the info. I ordered some silk worms today and I plan to order some of the other insects you suggested as well. I think my chameleon will be very happy to have some variety in his diet.

-Julie

 

[Dave W.]

Howdy,

I hope you ordered some silkworm chow too. If not, got a Mulberry tree nearby? Those are the only things that silkworms will eat and survive. I finally found one a mile away. The owners were happy to let me trim it for them!

Here is a great site with a real good article on silkworms.

http://www.chameleonnews.com/weider.html

Besides the silkworm article, if you haven't already cruised this site, its chocked-full of tons of great info!! http://www.chameleonnews.com It's a chameleon keeper's dream.

 

[COanimalhouse]

silk worms

Dave,

I did order some silk worm chow with them. I agree that chameleonnews is a great site, but I don't think I've read the article about silk worms. Also, where do you get your house flies from? I found one place that sell "fly larvae," which I assume are maggots that become house flies, but they said that growing them into flies was a very complicated process. I remember reading somewhere that maggots are not good to feed to chameleons. I would assume this is because they could possibly be carriers of bacT given their diet. Do you know where to get adult house flies?

-Julie

 

[Dave W.]

Howdy,

Coincidently, I just ordered my first batch of flies (larvae) just a few hours ago! I ordered them from Grubco. I've heard mixed results with their larvae hatching. Some people said that they had batches that would never move past the larvae stage - then died. Others had pretty good success. I guess I be finding out soon enough. Some said that the recommended way to slow things down by keeping them in the frig only seemed to kill them - maybe too cold...

 

[Dave W.]

Dave,

... I remember reading somewhere that maggots are not good to feed to chameleons. I would assume this is because they could possibly be carriers of bacT given their diet. Do you know where to get adult house flies?

-Julie

Howdy,

Forgot to comment... I think the problem is that maggots are meat eaters and that chameleons may likely swallow them whole and they could do damage down in there (I think that was from Ardith Arbate's booklet on feeders.) I also read (Linda Davison's book on chameleons) that if you are going to use them as a feeder then you have to poke holes in their "skin" to aid in their digestion(?)

I don't know of anyone supplying full grown flies other than fruit flies. I think it's "grow your own time..."

Dave Weldon