Chelsea Richardson-SNAKE KILLER...

[DavidBeard]

Like I said before, Scott....I call it like I see it. Chelsea is trash. She lives in a trailor. Thus, she is "trailor trash." Are ALL people who live in trailors as bad as she is? Of course not. I am not making a blanket statement about all trailor dwellers.

I have contacted one person who sold several snakes to her in the hopes that they will attempt to purchase the animals back from her before they suffer the same fate as the Rainbow Boa.

 

[The BoidSmith]

Two weeks and no water will kill a BRB quicker than most any other species of snakes. I sold some babies to a pet shop and they were able to kill 2 babies also in about 2 weeks. I refuse business if the buyer does not convince me they will have the right caging and food supply. Always ask questions of the buyer, they may still lie to you but at least you will have made a attempt to insure the animals long/healthy life. Sorry for the loss.

I’m just going to focus on the husbandry issues that probably killed the snake. The poster above has obviously dealt with baby BRBs before. A 10 gallon tank with a screen top is not the proper environment for baby BRBs. They need a lot of moisture as they are easily prone to dehydration. They will do very well in sweater boxes (they retain moisture) with holes for proper ventilation. Of course, if you use potpourri as substrate in a closed sweater box, you will more than likely kill the snake faster than in a screen lid 10-gallon tank. As far as the body condition of the snake in the first picture it seems adequate to me. It’s obviously a young specimen judging by the proportion between the head and the rest of the body. Her body condition is fine for this stage in its life. Just remember this is not a ball python which can get quite “stocky” at a similar developmental stage.

Regards.

 

[kmurphy]

I would not report her to the authorities even if there were, since this sort of thing only brings more negative attention to our hobby.[/QUOTE

David, you made this comment in your own thread so I don't believe I am going off-topic by responding to it. This says to me "I really love reptiles but I would let them suffer rather than risk my right to keep them". I don't think this is the correct attitude. As a community, if we continually keep secret animal abuse amongst ourselves, we risk being perceived as not caring about the animals we keep. What better person to go to the local authorities than one that has true concern for the animal's well being. I know you brought the conditions up here, and at your local herp society, but that was only to warn others, not to correct the horrid conditions. You really don't have any authority to correct them anyway.
I am not saying we should run to the authorities every time we see a dirty cage but when the conditions warrant it we shouldn't turn a blind eye because we fear the reprocussions to ourselves.

 

[Wolfy-hound]

Like I said before, Scott....I call it like I see it. Chelsea is trash. She lives in a trailor. Thus, she is "trailor trash." Are ALL people who live in trailors as bad as she is? Of course not. I am not making a blanket statement about all trailor dwellers.

Thank you. Whether you MEANT to make a blanket statement or not, you did so. You stated it quite baldly. I accept that you didn't mean it the way it came across. I personalyl would just call her TRASH. Neglectful, uncaring owners are the bane of the reptile world.
I am appalled at the living conditions of her snakes, and doubly appalled at the death of a LOVELY animal. I tend to agree on the dehydration. 2 weeks is just not enough time to starve a snake. But the lack of water, porpourri and heat(if any) would quickly kill the poor thing.
I hope the other one is okay, and I also hope that you can get some people to talk to her reasonably(without screaming and ranting and pointing fingers) to see if she can be persueded to change her husbandry. It's hard to remain calm in the face of such a horrifieing situation, but it would be the only way to fix the situation.
Wolfy

 

[DavidBeard]

I would not report her to the authorities even if there were, since this sort of thing only brings more negative attention to our hobby.[/QUOTE

David, you made this comment in your own thread so I don't believe I am going off-topic by responding to it. This says to me "I really love reptiles but I would let them suffer rather than risk my right to keep them". I don't think this is the correct attitude. As a community, if we continually keep secret animal abuse amongst ourselves, we risk being perceived as not caring about the animals we keep. What better person to go to the local authorities than one that has true concern for the animal's well being. I know you brought the conditions up here, and at your local herp society, but that was only to warn others, not to correct the horrid conditions. You really don't have any authority to correct them anyway.
I am not saying we should run to the authorities every time we see a dirty cage but when the conditions warrant it we shouldn't turn a blind eye because we fear the reprocussions to ourselves.

Kevin, you bring up some very valid and intriguing points. If going to the authorities would bring any positive results, I would do so. The simple truth is that there are no laws protecting herps in this state and the situation would be brushed off as nothing. The only way I can hope to prevent this from happening in the future is to make the situation public amongst the herp community. Unfortunately, Johnny Law doesn't give a crap about snakes!

 

[Chameleon Company]

David,

Hmmmmm ...

Like I said before, Scott....I call it like I see it. Chelsea is trash. She lives in a trailor. Thus, she is "trailor trash." Are ALL people who live in trailors as bad as she is? Of course not. I am not making a blanket statement about all trailor dwellers.

Amazing that the random occurances that you view this person as "trash", and she happens to live in a "trailer", that linking the two just coincidentally forms the term otherwise known as "trailer trash", a derogatory term used to slur those who live in such dwellings, ususlly implying lower intelligence, poverty, lack of sophistication (BTW, its spelled trailer trash, not trailor trash ) !! To say that you intended no slur to any but her is as absurd as Chelsea saying that "she knows what she's doing", and in fact, I would judge her more honest in her statement, misguided as it was. Making it public is one thing. Doing it with the added "gusto" is something else.

Hopefully, reading these threads if she does, and some time, will compel her to seek more information. Maybe she will have to lose a few more animals before she either quits the hobby or gets it right, as poor husbandry has its own built in pressures to change. While her neglect and ignorance would seem greater than many, a whole lot less ignorance will still kill a reptile, and how many of us have lost reptiles in the course of mastering their care ? While there is nothing about Chelsea as described to root for, I cannot label her as intending malice towards her animals, or unfit to learn. Just ignorant.

 

[FunkyRes]

Like I said before, Scott....I call it like I see it. Chelsea is trash. She lives in a trailor. Thus, she is "trailor trash." Are ALL people who live in trailors as bad as she is? Of course not. I am not making a blanket statement about all trailor dwellers.

I'm sorry - but you would not have referred to her as "suburb trash" if she lived in the suburbs. Using trailor as an adjective to describe what kind of trash she is was lumping her into a category of "trailor trash".

 

[christopher66]

I'm sorry - but you would not have referred to her as "suburb trash" if she lived in the suburbs. Using trailor as an adjective to describe what kind of trash she is was lumping her into a category of "trailor trash".

Did you read the post above yours??

 

[CurtisF]

Everyone, wouldn't it be best to give up arguing about a word and focus on the bigger problem?

 

[DavidBeard]

I agree, Curtis. Judging from most of the posts in this thread, you'd think we were on TrailerClassifieds.com instead of FaunaClassifieds.com.

 

[Chameleon Company]

And the bigger problem is ??????

 

[CurtisF]

I agree, Curtis. Judging from most of the posts in this thread, you'd think we were on TrailerClassifieds.com instead of FaunaClassifieds.com.

I was talking to you too. You're putting less focus on Chelsea by using a stupid phrase that is offending people.

And the bigger problem is ??????

The dead snake and thread maker's claims?

 

[DavidBeard]

Understood. In reality though, which is more offensive....a crude phrase (however applicable or truthful) or the senseless disregard for life? I rest my case on this pseudo-debate.

 

[Chameleon Company]

David B. states:
Understood. In reality though, which is more offensive....a crude phrase (however applicable or truthful) or the senseless disregard for life? I rest my case on this pseudo-debate.

So you have now determined that this is a "senseless disregard for life" ? BTW, others here do not see your phrase as either "applicable or truthful", but rather just a reflection on you being a bit challenged .

Curtis states:
The dead snake and thread maker's claims?

Is there a debate about whether or not the snake is dead ? The thread has warned people that David does not think others should sell to Chelsea. The thread maker claimed Chelsea was "trailer trash" ...... so could you be more specific about what you feel the purpose of the discussion now is ?

 

[kmurphy]

C'mon Jim you've got Curtis by 37 years of experience.

I believe he wants to get back to the discussion of the condition of the cages, why the snake died and what can be done now. I think it's great that younger people actually get involved in threads like this. They can learn a lot about what not to do, or say.

 

[Chameleon Company]

C'mon Jim you've got Curtis by 37 years of experience.

I believe he wants to get back to the discussion of the condition of the cages, why the snake died and what can be done now. I think it's great that younger people actually get involved in threads like this. They can learn a lot about what not to do, or say.

I'm with you here Kevin, but I also think it important to hear it from those who claim a better purpose here. I am all for involvement, and will support it in a positive way so long as I feel its positive involvement. Doesn't have to agree with me, but I have seen suggestions here that hinted, if not stated more overtly, that Chelsea is "trash", shouldn't be allowed to have her animals, "has no respect for life", etc. Challenging David on the above was very apropos. No doubt there is a problem here, but I saw more antagonism than I did solutions (a few notable exceptions, such as Dan). That's basically my point. If Curtis did not think that questioning David about his pathetic slur, and underlying intent and direction with the thread, which was to take it more from being a tool to being a weapon, was relevant, then c'mon down Curtis and explain your criticism.

 

[CurtisF]

Don't get my wrong, I don't like trailer trash (the slur) anymore than the next person. It is infinitely stupid to assume someone is trash because they live in a mobile home. I also find it stupid though that the slur is detracting from the thread's focus (Chelsea Richardson's treatment of snakes). The comment in general was probably worded bad and more aimed at David. I just figure it'd be easier to say "Sorry, I was mad." Then to made a page long discussion on why it is stupid to say something like that. I understand what you are saying though, Jim. I was just more interested basically in terms of what Kevin said.

 

[Chameleon Company]

Curtis and others:

I also find it stupid though that the slur is detracting from the thread's focus (Chelsea Richardson's treatment of snakes).

Again, while it is highly likely that the snake died, all we have to go on here are the words of David. David is the accuser. That he has shown himself to be ____________ (malicious, stupid, biased .... etc ..... etc ...... choose your own), beyond valid contempt as pointed out by several , is not significant ? To question the credibility of the accuser is stupid ? Think again Curtis, as it is quite appropriate.

The girl's name is being trashed here. She may deserve some of it, lots of it, etc. What's your solution Curtis ?

Might I suggest that someone from the KY Herp Society, etc (other than David) attempt to contact Chelsea, and try to at least steer her towards husbandry info ? Maybe some knowledge would convince her that its not her cup of tea ? Seems a better expenditure of effort than belittling her here for another 10-20 posts (or pages). I doubt she truly wants to spend her good money on snakes, only to end up seeing them die quickly. David labeled her a "snake killer". Well, I've killed quite a few myself. Lizards and turtles too. In time, I learned better. I lived in a trailer once too !

 

[CurtisF]

Another one bites the dust

Curtis and others:


Again, while it is highly likely that the snake died, all we have to go on here are the words of David. David is the accuser. That he has shown himself to be ____________ (malicious, stupid, biased .... etc ..... etc ...... choose your own), beyond valid contempt as pointed out by several , is not significant ? To question the credibility of the accuser is stupid ? Think again Curtis, as it is quite appropriate.

The girl's name is being trashed here. She may deserve some of it, lots of it, etc. What's your solution Curtis ?

Agreed. My mistake.

 

[Wilomn]

David is an easily baitable idiot, it's been proven time and again on many different forums.

However, it's pretty damn hard to kill a healthy brb in two weeks UNLESS you are not taking proper care of it. They can live far longer than two weeks without food. They can live far longer than two weeks at suboptimal temps. They will EASILY die in two weeks at subpar humidty.

David's accusations are right on the mark. The girl screwed up and killed that snake. Trailor trash may have been a dumb thing to say, but look honestly at the origins of that moniker. There are plenty out there to whom trailor trash is fitting as a description and she may well be one of them. Who are all of YOU to tell david he's wrong for calling it as he sees it? Have any of YOU seen the trailor this snake killing girl lives in? Before you say he's wrong, make sure YOU are right.

Profiling works, not everytime but often enough that it will never go away.

I see, by quotes as I have him on ignore, which I HIGHLY recommend, that chumpco has chosen yet again to champion one who doesn't seem deserving of such. Although, when you stop and think about what an abosolute doofus he is, I suppose it is fitting that he is defending this killer of baby snakes. Who else would have him champion their cause? Besides someone already in jail, I mean.