Chuck Tornetta - Big trade deal gone south

[oneeyesnake]

Unbelievable

Deleted because of excessive profanity - WebSlave

 

[kim felts]

I think that if some think "Well, you got 150, and were only asking 100, stop whining" that they are wrong. A person who is set in their ways, and only wants to sell would not be tempted by the deal, otherwise they would have said that in the ad. Dallas was willing to trade, for the value of over 12,000,- quote dave

who has determined that the value of the trade was not 12000?.
and under what circumstances was it worth whatever ....
so often values have many variables..it is the responsibility of the buyer to decide what circumstances he or she is going to be determining its value for their own situation..if he or she must dump it asap then of course the value could be less then its value in another situation. dallas knowing his own situation alot more clearly then chuck needed to decide for himself what these snakes would be worth if he could not hold on to them long enough to test the market of that particular day..time of year..the economic situation going on in the world ..blah blah.
one day female x pounds could be worth this much based on the availability of other females that particular day and so forth.
the next day it could be worth double..the stock market plunges..
now its worth less..and so forth..is it chucks problem if within a few days circumstances change and his buyer hasent got time to hold onto the animals long enough for the market to recover?
im not saying that happened here but think about it..
thats the responsibility of the buyer and the risk and or gamble involved..
have you never noticed how much this market is controlled by the overall economy of the country at the time of purchase?
also a buyer must take into consideration his own ability to sell things..his experience and credibility with the general public.
if said buyer does not even attempt to recover the sellers estimated value but uses the same terms to advertise..
ie its a coral albino or perhaps its a coral and chuck places its value at x factor but ill discount this..ill being dallas..as if his experience is more vast then chucks is..especially when selling corals or albinos ..how many corals or albinos has dallas even seen let alone sold have we deteremined that point yet?
if he had problems posting the prices chuck did why didnt he post ads explaining that chuck placed this value on it and so then i will do so as well..if explanation of value was needed by dallas from potential buyer perhaps chuck could have helped dallas explain the price tag....blah blah blah.
to summarize..dallas took chucks word for something.
he decided to believe him and make a trade..took in the trade and began advertising the animals with reduced price tags..he went forward to sell the animals meanwhile..then turned around and accused chuck because he didnt collect what he had hoped for without even trying to do so..
then comes to boi to label chuck a scam artist..those were his own words..a scam artist..
does this seem remotely fair to you???
if you want to be fair in all accounts in this scenerio.

start with a decided party on both accounts..chuck and dallas to determine what exactly dallas has from chuck.
now..what the market value of that item is during a low time and high time of sales..or approx. value
now add the time alloted for the sale and a speculation of the economy at that time.
also add who the seller is going to be..his credibility..his knowledge and what the public thinkof him or her..
what he or she has proven to the buyers as far as experience with animals and his ability to keep them healthy.
how about the fact that chuck receives a sick animal from dallas...value is not that of a healthy one..that being the case..
the snake having just been shipped....yada yada..
does that not possibly change its value some in the eyes of the buyers? and so forth..my point is many variables..
so..how do we determine at this point whether or not dallas was taken advantage of..???
dallas seems to have a very high opinion of himself as a business person but doesnt have the confidence to price something as chuck would..who's fault is that??
he doesnt even attempt to try and carry if off...
then he blames chuck by using some wordage of gilbert thompson that perhaps jeremy stone might have said as if jeremys opinion on that matter is the word written in stone.
doesnt work for me as a viewer..

i have probably missed a few points as to why dallas changed his mind over several days as to his thought process on what he had in his possession from chuck but dont you think it might have been wise to consult others before making the trade versus after?
and add to that after some of the original snakes had been sold ?
not being able to then make a trade back with its original form?
furthermore..how do we know what dallas actually got paid for what he sold?? i have ended up paying more then the asking price on animals in a bid sort of situation because other buyers had offered more..would this count if dallas had been able to pull that off and received more then chuck had estimated on another snake as to the overall value of the trade?

 

[kim felts]

Grow up before someone calls your little bluffs kid.


i give the same advice to you billy ...
if you think your post sounds remotely mature think again.

give it a rest with the insinuated bleep comments..
do you have no other way to communicate?

 

[Gilbert Thompson]

Kim you are wrong on one thing!! Jeremy Stone emailed Dallas and gave him the scoop. I simply inquired and nothing more!!
Thanks,
Gilbert Thompson

 

[oneeyesnake]

Another Ritchie rider! This guy is the biggest problem of the whole site. Problems could probably be resolved WITHOUT his input.

Kim,

Jeremy stone got with Dallas and gave him the scoop on the deal. I'm not taking sides but DAMN, this thread is long!!!!!! Get the facts Kim, and then clear your throat before you come here with your 2 cents.

 

[kim felts]

gilbert..i know you and i think the way i said what i did didnt come out right..what i was trying to get across was more to the effect that jeremy stone is not the last word on anything.
not that you did anything wrong.
forgive me that i worded that wrong..its so early here..lmao.
sorry gilbert..not intended the way it sounded.
forgive me

 

[Gilbert Thompson]

No problem Kim Your still my buddy
Thanks,
Gilbert Thompson

 

[kim felts]

billy

ill re read and rethink what i wrote..perhaps i might too find jeremy stone is the overall expert of all corals.
meanwhile perhaps you might try opening the other eye.
it generally adds to depth perception.

 

[kim felts]

billy

a friend of mine just happened to bring something to my attention
can you please enlighten me here.
you and dallas just happened to register for fauna on the same day..10-21..
billy has so far only written two posts ever..2..
and only to this thread..
is this a coincidence?
amazing if it is..just amazing too me.
can you imagine the likelyhood of all of that?
i love it billy..clear your throat and add your two cents.
how did that happen billly ??

 

[HerpVenue]

I agree with the person who said that there should only be a few people involved here, and maybe a couple of eyewitnesses!!
I understand what you are saying......so what are you doing here?
I've been watching this thread since its conception and was very reluctant to register, but WOW, everyone has got an opinion about everything.
Everyone does have an opinion......I am sure you will not spare us yours.
After going back through a few other posts that Ritchie Luna has made inquiry on it's very clear that this SOB likes to start s***.
I would like to see the inquiries I started just to start "s**T" go ahead and start a thread on me.
Are you some F***'in century saint who is completely perfect?
I don't know.....you tell me.... Go ahead and start an inquiry on me.
I know for a fact that if there were problems.....then I also know that I tried to fix them. so i guess my answer is I am not a saint. I have botched a couple deals .....but I also tried to do the right thing after "botching" them. so go ahead and make an inquiry. I am interested to see what people who have bought from me really think.

If this problem was so HORRIBLE to you, you would've called Dallas and helped him with the situation. But NO!!! You can't do that because there's no record of what will/was said. What a PUNKA** PU**Y!!
The BOI does not work that way. it will end up being a he said she said thing. i want to make sure everything is out in the public. Nothing to hide. Lies and truths are exposed.


So. what have you got to hide? I came to this thread to ask question.....
you came just to chastise me and take the attention away from the questions I asked. then you sit there and call me kid. WOW....like your responses are any more mature than mine. I do not have the right tools here at work. But I will be home soon enough to figure out just who you really are. see ya.......KID
keep thumpin your chest

 

[HerpVenue]

I wonder who loves me in Texas.....

Waco?

 

[Darin Chappell]

Here we go again. It only happens about ever six weeks or so. I really shouldn't be surprised, and I REALLY shouldn't let it aggrivate me. However, the tendancy for some to come into an established community of people who have been working well together for YEARS and tell them that they're doing it all wrong is just ARROGANT!

Dallas' problems arose when he accused Chuck of misrepresenting the animals, then used the same terms to try to sell them on KS. He can whimper around about everything else all he wants, he knows he did this, and that makes him a hypocrite at best.

As to the vaules of the trade, I agree with one point. If you trade for a certain value, you ought to get that value. It doesn't matter that you still get a good deal; if you were trading for a GREAT deal, that's what you ought to get. However, Dallas has not shown that he was given anything other than that which he was promised. He can't, because to do so would mean that he is a lying sack of snot for intentionally misrepresenting those animals in his KS ads. He says "I've been told by ________ that these animals are not what Chuck claimed them to be," but were is the evidence of that? So far, no one has proven anything about Chuck having lied to Dallas in ANY way.

The one aspect of the good deal vs. GREAT deal that does enter into this discussion is when we ask the following question: "If Dallas was so upset about the trade from the very beginning, why didn't he just demand a trade reversal?" I'll tell you why, he made out like a bandit on this deal, and he knows it. He didn't make as much as he thought he would, and blames Chuck for that. However, if he had actually sold the animals for a total of $14,000, do any of you think he would have refunded Chuck the extra $1,500? Of course not! It would be his money due to his selling capacity, and the loss is now his due to the same determining factor.

He could have traded back, if he was truly upset with the animals' quality, but he cannot come back and gripe after he has sold them for less than he thought they were worth, especially since he admits he does not know enough about the animals and their phases to make the sales he could have. I'm sorry, but Dallas has no one to blame but himself for selling those animals at a lower price than he anticipated in the trade.

 

[HerpVenue]

hey billy

I know who writes like you do.
I know who writes like you do when they lose their temper.
I know who is in Texas like you.
I know who says I hide behind my computer like you do.
I know who curses like you.
Right now all I have is circumstancial evidence.
but I am getting closer to finding the one thing that will clearly nail who you really are.

someone in waco Texas is Loving me.

someone who knows first hand that jeremy stone got with Dallas and gave him the scoop

 

[HerpVenue]

on my way home to really get into finding who you really are billy the kid crowder

 

[Classic Dum's]

While I had a hard time following Kims long post(drink some coffee KimLOL) one point I thuoght was valid how do any of us know what these animals were really sold for. He may have somehow gotten 3g's each for the corals. I mean come on the ONLY thing Dallas has proven here beyond a reasonable doubt is he lives by a double standard. Here on the BOI says Chuck is a con for advertising the snow as a possible blizzard then 3hrs later on ksnake places an ad advertising it as a possible blizzard. Then tells everyone here it none of our buisness what he pplaces within his ads.

One of the most interesting points I found in this WHOLE thread is how Dallas deleted pictues and emails I.E. proof to back his claims. Come on if it were me and I wasnt happy first I would have never listed them for sale. I would have called Chuck IMEDIATLY and said "dude were reversing this deal". I would have taken pictures of everything and saved pics and emails to my hard drive and disk(in case). Does dallas do that NO he claims to have deleted anything of solid proof to his case. I mean come on whats wrong with this picture???? Cant anyone else see it.

Also what jermy has to say regaurdless carries LITTLE(actually no) weight here. No one to date has produced a definite 100%. Chucks is the closet animal to date. So Jermy is not the be all end all word in what is a blizzard. He hasnt produce a blizzard(nor anyone else) and Jermy may very well be working with a differant anery line and prove it blizzard. Chuck may very well be working with the same anery line as Jermy. All I know of Chucks anery lines is that it is a wild caught line, very dark no yellow, similar to the type two anerys. Does chuck have the imported animal I have no idea. Did someone else bred this animal send some babies to jermy and to Chuck, then jermy calls them type twos and Chuck just calls them anerys who knows. Will Chucks anery line produce whiter blizzards then Jermys who knows. The fact is that animal does not have any yellow in it and until such a day it yellows up if it does is a, or the closet thing to a blizzard out there now. IMO it is a blizzard(per its coloration now) at some point in time if it changes and yellows up then it will just be a really nice snow. But Chuck has never offered a gaurentee that it will definitly be a blizzard as an adult, only a potential. jermy knows little to nothing about the linage of this animal and how reduce the yellow is in the anery or albino lines it comes from and how these to genes will react with one and other. So jermys opnion on this matter is just that an opinion. We all know the old saying, everyone has one bla bla bla.

Also I spoke with Chuck this am about this whole deal. According to him Jermy never once told either of these knuckleheads(dallas, gilbert) that hiself and Chuck didnt have a deal going for $6500 in value towards a snow. What he told them is there was no cash deal for $6500 in value. Noone ever asked about a trade deal and there is still to date a trade deal in the works for a snow Chuck has, at the value of $6500 in trade between Jermy and Chuck. So is jermy paying $6500 in cash for the snow NO. Is he giving $6500 in trade YES. When asked by Gilbert and Dallas if he was paying $6500 in cash for the snow he said no which is true. According to Chuck him a Jermy spoke last night and Jermy never once told either of these two clowns that "Chuck is full of it and leing" Theve taken his words and twisted them. Chuck and jermy still have some deals in the works and are friends. I hope above can shed some light on why Jermys opnion means little concerning this issue and we can all drop his name he really has nothing to do with any of this. And shouldnt have been drug into this in the first place by two deperate fools who have absolutly nothing to back their claims, so they throw his name in as leverage.

 

[Classic Dum's]

While I had a hard time following Kims long post(drink some coffee KimLOL) one point I thuoght was valid how do any of us know what these animals were really sold for. He may have somehow gotten 3g's each for the corals. I mean come on the ONLY thing Dallas has proven here beyond a reasonable doubt is he lives by a double standard.

For all we know these animals were passed off to a freind at $5000 for the pair and these ads on ksnake are part of his scam. He may still have these animals in his possesion and claimaing he sold them at a loss. Only he knows and according him he deleted all the proof and provides NOTHING to back his claims. Just an after thought.

 

[Gilbert Thompson]

Ritchie,
I know what you are leading up to and that is not cool. Me and you have already mended our differences. I cannot help but beleive this due to your last comment in that one post.
However, I am not to concerned with it as I know you will appologize once you do your tracking thing
Gilbert Thompson

 

[HerpVenue]

I know you will appologize once you do your tracking thing

Well I was not going to say he was you.
All I say is a lot of his stuff reminds me of someone else.
But I was not going to say it was you unless I had CONCRETE proof.

I have nothing to apologize for. I NEVER said he was you.

I have run into a dead end. All I can say is he tracks down to Waco Texas. And he is either Unlisted or his name is not really Billy Crowder.


As aforementioned.
You and I HAVE mended our fences and I could not believe he was you. And since I do not have any CONCRETE proof. I was not going to say he is you.

You have that everyones internet service.
He has DSL.
Totally coming up with different IP

 

[chuck tornetta reptiles]

putting the corals to rest

Hello everyone,
I am asking anybody who has a picture of Dallases, coral albino female from me , to please send it to [email protected] .
I have an idea that can slam dunk this guys theory of it not being coral from his obviously ignorant picture taking skills.
I WOULD NEVER SEND SOMEONE - ANYONE - A CORAL THAT IS NOT A CORAL .
Thats not my style of business , nor did i lie or mis-represent anything.
i cannot guarentee that i have a pic of that exact female in question in my files or on my website under collection www.boadome.com click coral albinos . but i just might have that girl pictured . if so Wouldnt that just tickle some people pink,lol.
i have certain aspects of color and contrast that i look for when picking out coral from normal.
It is almost obvious if we were all standing around a coral litter , but much harder to explain in this situation, but a coral has color were a normal wouldnt ( varying degrees from powder light pinks and oranges to much deeper oranges and reds) it does very from individual to individual. but i assure you of 2 things here and now.
#1 Dallas got 1.1 coral phase albinos .
#2 The SO-CALLED EXPERT Who said my female wasnt a coral did not have a first name that started with a ( J ) OR END IN ( S ) , As for what i know about these Charictors this expert probubly never saw a real coral before in his life in person. And was this expert going by that white washed out flash photo.
And im not complaining with this next line , im a big boy and i realize things happen ! but why is nobody saying anything about the fact that dallas ABSOLUTLY MISREPRESENTED HIS SHARP FEMALE AS HEALTHY TO ME. i know i know waaaaaaa ,.lol
i guess it sounds like im crying about it even though i was just going to deal with it in private , considering he wouldnt return my calls about it. AHH But the fact remains , she has still not fed , and for an adult boa , any breeder will tell you ,if she is not gravid , thats a bad sighn. not to mention the resp that im helping greatly with higher than normal heat at this point ,
I Have been a member to this board for some time now . But i have never posted here because im a rather private person .
And i did not ask for this to happen, it was put upon me.
Some might say Chuck Tornetta should have came to the board right away when he recieved a sick snake he just paid over 11,000.00 in trade alone , ( adult het valued at 1,500.00)
Why not come here when Dallas was ignoreing your calls , your emails (unsaved) .
IT is because i would rather deal with it in private.
BUT I HAVE TO ADMIT , alot of people see strait through this bogas thread against me by dallas, and for that i am very greatful thank you to all who came to my defense , even though he really has no case at all. That whole value thing is just him and a friend or 2 spitting in the wind. I NEVER SAID ( HEY MAN SELL THESE ANIMALS FOR DIRT CHEAP RITE ).
BUT I WOULD REALLY LIKE TO GET MY HANDS ON A PICTURE OF THAT SNAKE , if anyone has that saved please send it to [email protected] thank you .
Chuck Tornetta Reptiles
www.boadome.com

 

[Gilbert Thompson]

Ritchie come on man!! You didn't use my name that's true but I think anyone that has followed this thread knows who you were referring too. It's cool if you don't want to appologize.
Take care,
Gilbert Thompson