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Bad Guy Daniel Nutwell

NeoReptiliac

NeoReptiliac

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I decided to post this badguy thread tonight based on a person me and my wife just recently bought from. My wife was wanting a Water Monitor and searched the threads here on the Fauna site. She eventually found one that Daniel Nutwell was selling here. http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/forums/showthread.php?t=159334
We asked him to email us some photos. He had some blurry photos but the monitor appeared healthy from what we could tell in those photos. ( I don't have the photos any more sorry. )
We went ahead and sent him the money for the water monitor after checking his record out on the BOI (where we found no information on him at all.)
He sent it to us after having some issues shipping. (He said his local UPS office wouldn't ship due to it being close the holidays.)
When we got the monitor it was smaller then we had expected but didnt complain. We put it in its new cage, and left it alone for a while so it could settle down. A day later my wife got it out and decided to admire it, but she noticed that something was off. This was to be our first Water monitor but she noticed something right away and asked a friend of her's before she accused Daniel of anything. The friend (Chuck Hurd) wasnt quite sure so he made a thread on facebook with the photos she sent him of this monitor that she herself took. Meanwhile she looked up information herself as well. They both quickly came to the conclusion that this was NOT a water monitor but infact a Nile monitor.
Ok so my wife contacted Daniel to tell him this. He claimed that it was a Water and was sold to him as a water monitor. He even told her that it was illegal in Florida where he lives to have Nile monitors. She showed him the differences and asked for a partial refund. Not only had he charged her more for a Nile, but he also charged her $20 extra shipping and handling that she soon noticed. So she asked for half back of what he had charged her. Which was fair since it was only covering the extra cost of a water monitor and the extra shipping. He said he would have to ask his mother. Which was a huge redlight for us. He claimed to be an adult. But why would he have to ask his mother if he was? We asked that and he said cause it was her paypal email address that he used to get our payment through. But we didnt believe that since the email address had his ignitials. (DN)
He then refused to send any refund, and swore that his friends all told him that it is a Water monitor despite the obvious difference between the two and the one he sent us. Here is some photos of the one he sent us.
moody006.jpg

moody008.jpg


For those unaware of the differences, a Nile's nostrils are farther back and to the sides. A water's is more to the front and towards the top simular to a Croc's. And also Water monitors have some bold black markings on the shoulder/neck area while Niles do not. Here is a photo of a Water monitor to compare.
DSC00460.jpg


I lost some of the emails between us, but here is the ones I do have. They start at the top with the most recent and end with the least recent.(Communication was done using my wife's email.)



----- Original Message -----
From: Daniel Nutwell
To: Stephanie Jordan
Sent: Sunday, December 27, 2009 4:41 AM
Subject: Re: monitor


everyone i've showed the pictures to tells me it's for sure a water monitor. can you take picture's of it's arms? cuz it doesn't look like circle on them in the photo's i have


From: Stephanie Jordan
Subject: Re: monitor
To: "Daniel Nutwell"
Date: Saturday, December 26, 2009, 9:19 PM


Well for one you overpriced me on shipping. I ship geckos in those containers. I did a check on Shipyourreptiles.com which you used to ship to me and it came up as $30 not $50. And since the monitor is only worth around $19 at the most. Then that would total $49. Totaling $51 refunded. I think that's totaly fair.
Stephanie Jordan
www.neoreptiliac.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Daniel Nutwell
To: Stephanie Jordan
Sent: Saturday, December 26, 2009 4:02 PM
Subject: Re: monitor


i'm talking to my mom about refunding some money, but she's saying no, so let me get back to you. how much are you wanting refunding?

--- On Sat, 12/26/09, Stephanie Jordan wrote:


From: Stephanie Jordan
Subject: Re: monitor
To: "Daniel Nutwell"
Date: Saturday, December 26, 2009, 7:58 PM


Hi if you replied I might have missed it. My pc glitched yesterday when I was checking my mail, and I lost about 4 new emails cause of it.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Stephanie Jordan
www.neoreptiliac.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Daniel Nutwell
To: Stephanie Jordan
Sent: Friday, December 25, 2009 1:44 PM
Subject: Re: monitor


i'm sorry, i didn't know that.


From: Stephanie Jordan
Subject: Re: monitor
To: "Daniel Nutwell"
Date: Friday, December 25, 2009, 6:05 PM


It's a Nile. You realize that Niles are a lot cheaper then water monitors right? I can usually find them for $19 all day long. Here's two photos to show you the difference between the two. Water monitors have a few bold black markings in front of the front legs. Niles do not. I didnt notice this myself till after my friend pointed it out to me.He's the Tristate Reptile Association president for my area. Chuck Hurd

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Stephanie Jordan
www.neoreptiliac.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Daniel Nutwell
To: Stephanie Jordan
Sent: Friday, December 25, 2009 12:52 PM
Subject: Re: monitor


the people i got it from said it was a water, and i asked them quite a few times. nile's are illegal here in florida. and they're usually wider than that one

--- On Fri, 12/25/09, Stephanie Jordan wrote:


From: Stephanie Jordan
Subject: Re: monitor
To: "Daniel Nutwell"
Date: Friday, December 25, 2009, 5:46 PM


I have to ask. Is it really a water monitor you sent me or a nile monitor? I was looking at some photos of the two and honestly it looks like a Nile not a Water like you said it was.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Stephanie Jordan
www.neoreptiliac.com



Another email with photos was sent as he asked but he never returned a reply.
 
It ia a nile water monitor.That is what they use to call them so you did get ripped sorry to hear that .On a side note those guys almost never tame down when older and there bite will require stitches.Be careful.Other wise it looks healthy
 
How can this person own, and sell them and not know the difference? Though my nile, and asian water look similar in color their body shape, and like mentioned above snout are different. Also the tail of the water monitor is more triangular than the round tail of a nile.


This guy obviousely shouldn't be dealing reptiles, nor owning potentially dangerous monitors if he can't tell the difference.
 
Paypal's probably not going to help you out on this but if you used a credit card through paypal your bank should credit your account back for the money without much hassle since you essentially received something different than what you purchased and then paypal can deal with him. get your money back and then when he requests his animal back have HIM pay for the shipping back. Additionally, document everything and once the animal is on it's way back contact Florida Fish & Game and have them deal with him on the issue of illegal wildlife.
 
I'm afraid I can not ship the animal back. Since there is laws against owning these with out certain permits. I could get in big trouble.
 
Owning them in Florida ( were Daniel lives ) that is. I wanted to make that clear. There is no laws like that here in my state thank god.
 
yeah you're right but you should still get your money back. if you feel bad about keeping both the money and the animal you could sell the animal once you get your money back and mail him whatever you obtained for the animal. Make sure you charge him a fee for taking the time to sell his animal since he doesn't know what he's doing. Or once you have your money back you can negotiate a price for it if you want to keep it. Either of these options should be fair I think.
 
No one should be selling animals that they cannot properly identify....that is definitely a Nile monitor. Also, I know Stephanie and she knows her stuff...she got ripped off in this deal and I hope Mr. Nutwell will decide to make things right.
 
Your right, and we could have asked for all of the money back since we was shipped the wrong thing. But instead asked for just the extras that we paid for the wrong type of monitor. Even though, if he refussed to send that back then I highly doubt he will send the whole refund back (even though he should) . I've considered selling it localy. I really don't want to ship this time of year. But even if I do sell it localy I will only gain $19 (which is what I would charge) of my money back.
 
Being that i'm new to the monitor scene, yes, i was wrong. after talking to actual trustworthy enthusiasts with current ROC permit's it's definitely a Nile. i just didn't think that a pet shop would sell me something identified wrong. if you ship it back i'll refund you completely, and i'll speak to the pet shop i obtained the animal from. Also, i'll be speaking to FWC about the incident.
 
I'm afraid I can not ship it to you. You broke the law by shipping it to me with out a permit. I will not do the same by shipping it back. Also I was told by the FWC not to send it back to you. The best advice I and anyone else can give to you at this point is to do the right thing and refund the money. Being accountable for your own mistakes is the most adult and most responsible course of action any business man can ever make when it comes to maintaining a good reputation. Anyone that comes to this thread and reads it that is interested in buying something from you, will care if you did the right thing or not, and it will indeed decide for them if you should be someone they buy from. So this is more for your good then it is mine.
 
Indeed, if you don't make the refund you may keep a few dollars, but otherwise anytime somebody wants to buy from you and searches this forum you'll end up losing way more money long term.
 
AtrociousOne said:
Being that i'm new to the monitor scene, yes, i was wrong. after talking to actual trustworthy enthusiasts with current ROC permit's it's definitely a Nile. i just didn't think that a pet shop would sell me something identified wrong. if you ship it back i'll refund you completely, and i'll speak to the pet shop i obtained the animal from. Also, i'll be speaking to FWC about the incident.
Click to expand...

Yes it's definitely varanus niloticus. Very nice looking animal to.

Due to the animal being sold in a pet shop possibly without the proper permits is probably selling illegally which is usually why they label the animal another species so they can sell it. This happens often. It also could have been an honest mistake on the pet shops part.

Do you have the receipt from when you bought the animal at the shop???
 
I would be speaking to the pet shop about a refund and reporting them.You should refund the money as well, you broke the law as did the supposid pet shop.And find the lizard a good home
 
shipping the animal out of the state is not breaking the law, where she lives the animal is legal. she has contacted FWC so when they contact me, i will inform them of the shop. i don't have a receipt though, i didn't get one cuz i've bought from them plenty, and trusted them. woops
 
i'm going to get things straightened out with the pet shop i purchased it from and with my laws. and FWC. i'm far more concerned with the repercussions of the state for having the Nile at this point in time.
 
i don't have a receipt though, i didn't get one cuz i've bought from them plenty, and trusted them
Click to expand...

Daniel, getting a receipt is not a matter of how many times you've made purchases or your level of trust. If they are indeed a business, a brick and mortar pet store as you claim, and you paid them, then they most likely provided a receipt just like another other retail store would.

If it is unlawful for YOU to possess the animal in your state, and Reeve knowingly ships it back to you, then Reeve could be in violation of the law.

Just refund the money now and educate yourself on animal identification so you will not be duped in the future.

You've taken positive steps already admitting that a mistake was made, so refunding Reeve's money now will only help you in your future endeavors. Good luck :)
 
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