CarolinaClassicDragons
New member
I will start by stating that I don't even know if this snake breeder from NC is a member, or is active here on Fauna but hopefully this will help someone that may be considering purchasing a snake from him. I checked on here before I purchased and didn't see anything written about him. On with the situation... I saw an ad he had posted for a baby Eastern Indigo in a group on Facebook. Apparently, he has bred them for a few years along with lots of other colubrids. We had lots of messages back and forth and he sounded like a good guy. He was kind enough to work with me on a payment plan since the snake was $900. I made the first two payments of $300 each within a month and for the third payment of $300 we agreed to just meet locally and he would have the snake and I could make the remaining payment. We met in a parking lot the Friday after Thanksgiving, the 28th. It was a convenient place for us both as he was headed to visit family for the Thanksgiving holiday and could meet about an hour away from my house. He had the indigo in a large, 7 " clear plastic deli container inside an insulated box. He stated right away that the snake was in shed but there was nothing he could do about that. I took the snake out of the box and gave it a good look through the plastic container. It was the first indigo that I had ever seen in person so I was excited. With the snake being "milked up", I decided to leave it alone and get it into my warm vehicle and out of the cold air. No reason not to trust Eddy. He had stated the snake wasn't in the perfect condition in our earlier discussions. Stupid mistake on my part! I get the snake home and have a custom cage all ready and take him out of the plastic cup and check him out a little. Beautiful snake! I place him in his cage. I have some damp spaghnum moss in a hidebox set up and he quickly finds it. I check on him everyday but since he is in shed, I don't handle him as I wanted to reduce the stress and let him acclimate. Fast forward to this past Friday the 5th. I come home from work and was excited to see that the snake had a perfect shed. Eddy had informed me to carefully check the eye caps since sometimes indigos can have issues shedding. The snake shed completely and I felt like I could now try to feed him. I tried a scented fuzzy but didn't have any luck. I sent Eddy a message and he immediately responded with some ideas. I decided to go buy beef heart the next day and try again. So that is what I did. No luck. Eddy then told me not to try to feed him for a couple of days. I was fine with that. So I decided that I finally had a good time to handle my new indigo now. As I sat at my desk running my hands down the length of the snake, I was startled to feel two "bumps" a few inches from the length of its tail. 
I couldn't believe it. I was devasted that my lifelong dream snake had these kinks or bumps or whatever they were. No issues with the scales at all. He had just shed and the scales above and around the bumps looked fine. This was obviously something that wouldn't just jump out at you unless you were carefully observing the tail area. In fact, I had to feel them first before I saw them. I immediately reach out to Eddy to call me to discuss. He was busy with work but we ended up discussing this around 5:00 that afternoon. I told him I would email pics. At that point in time, I hadn't requested anything from Eddy. Eddy texts me his email address and I take the pics and email them right away. I don't hear any response. Given that it was a Sat. evening, I didn't bother him with this again. I thought for sure I would hear something back during the day on Sunday. Nope. So at 6:00PM I decided to text him stating that I hated to bother him on a Sunday but that I was surprised that I hadn't heard a response from him yet. Again, crickets. So, for whatever reason, Eddy seems to prefer to communicate via Facebook messaging(I don't). This morning, I send him a message that I am losing patience and need to hear something. Over the weekend I did more research and found quite a few discussions in a variety of forums about "bumps" showing up in indigos on the dorsal side of the backbone near the tail. The exact same problem that this snake has. There is discussions about whether it is due to inbreeding or a development issue in the egg. No one really knows for sure. All I want is to return the snake and get my $900 back. As you can see from the messages that I finally got back this morning, Eddy is refusing to work with me on a refund. His stance is that it happened in my possession. Something like this isn't a result from a recent injury like getting pinched, etc. This was there early on. Now, I don't think Eddy intentionally misrepresented this indigo. I think he didn't notice it. I did. Do I wish that I would have inspected the snake a lot more closely right when I got it, yes. Hindsight 20/20. Lesson learned. Eddy's lack of concern over this and his refusal to work with me on a return of this snake is a red flag and concerning. He wants to put the blame on me but you really can't. TWO clear deformities (see the pics) on the dorsal side with no damage to any scales around them. Not something that happens from a "pinch" from a container like Eddy claims in his FB message. You can read all of this and make your own decisions on whether or not you would do business with him. I will post the pics in a separate message. Here are the text messages....
12/6, 2:29pm
David Freeman
Please call me at 919-628-9405
.
...
Today
David Freeman
7:23am
David Freeman
Eddy, I would appreciate hearing back from you on this kinked tail indigo. I want to return it ASAP for a full refund.
.
...
Eddy Wilson
7:55am
Eddy Wilson
David, after careful consideration and going back and looking at pics of this snake, a refund is out of the question. All pictures I have show no kink, you had the snake for 8 days before mentioning anything about a kink. I think the kink or bump happened while the snake was in your posession. I have inspected every hatchling carefully for any flaws before selling them and your's was perfect when it left my hands.
.
...
David Freeman
8:29am
David Freeman
How exactly would the kink or bump happen in my possession Eddy? That is the most ridiculous thing I have heard in all of my years in the business. After I discovered these two kinks, or bumps that rise from the top of the spine, I started to research it and found many discussions in several forums describing this exact condition. We both know that the snake was blue when I purchased him from you. Therefore, I took every precaution with this being my first indigo and just put him straight into the cage and let him be until he shed. I wanted to make sure he had time to shed first and then acclimate to his new environment before handling. In hindsight, I also put way too much faith and trust in you as an indigo breeder and should have inspected the snake more thoroughly. It was after he shed that I discovered this outright flaw in this $900 animal. So here is the deal, if I was you, I would research my reputation in the reptile world. David Freeman, Carolina Classic Dragons, LLC It is impeccable both as a breeder that has sold thousands of reptiles and as a buyer. I will take this public by noon today if we can't reach a resolution. I will drive this snake to you and you can pay via Paypal or credit card. I don't care. I will try to contain my emotions here but you really don't want this to go public.
.
...
Eddy Wilson
8:45am
Eddy Wilson
Take it public if you feel it to be necessary David. The kinks look to me like it possibly got pinched while closing a container. I cant truly say since the snake has been in your posession for well over a week now. As I said, I inspected every hatchling carefully and as a buyer I expected you to do the same. I mean come on, like you said, its a $900 animal, why would you not inspect it immediately? Then 8 full days later you want a refund. Not gonna happen. So if you feel the need to take it public then go for it, you're still not getting a refund.
.
...
David Freeman
8:59am
David Freeman
Suit yourself.
.
...
David Freeman
9:16am
David Freeman
As a FYI, it will be posted in the BOI on Fauna Classifieds. They like to make sure the person being labeled as "Bad Guy" gets notification to defend themselves. Obviously I will be posting the pics and discussion of the bumps/growths/kinks (whatever you want to call them) on multiple forums as well.
.
...
Eddy Wilson
9:17am
Eddy Wilson
.
I couldn't believe it. I was devasted that my lifelong dream snake had these kinks or bumps or whatever they were. No issues with the scales at all. He had just shed and the scales above and around the bumps looked fine. This was obviously something that wouldn't just jump out at you unless you were carefully observing the tail area. In fact, I had to feel them first before I saw them. I immediately reach out to Eddy to call me to discuss. He was busy with work but we ended up discussing this around 5:00 that afternoon. I told him I would email pics. At that point in time, I hadn't requested anything from Eddy. Eddy texts me his email address and I take the pics and email them right away. I don't hear any response. Given that it was a Sat. evening, I didn't bother him with this again. I thought for sure I would hear something back during the day on Sunday. Nope. So at 6:00PM I decided to text him stating that I hated to bother him on a Sunday but that I was surprised that I hadn't heard a response from him yet. Again, crickets. So, for whatever reason, Eddy seems to prefer to communicate via Facebook messaging(I don't). This morning, I send him a message that I am losing patience and need to hear something. Over the weekend I did more research and found quite a few discussions in a variety of forums about "bumps" showing up in indigos on the dorsal side of the backbone near the tail. The exact same problem that this snake has. There is discussions about whether it is due to inbreeding or a development issue in the egg. No one really knows for sure. All I want is to return the snake and get my $900 back. As you can see from the messages that I finally got back this morning, Eddy is refusing to work with me on a refund. His stance is that it happened in my possession. Something like this isn't a result from a recent injury like getting pinched, etc. This was there early on. Now, I don't think Eddy intentionally misrepresented this indigo. I think he didn't notice it. I did. Do I wish that I would have inspected the snake a lot more closely right when I got it, yes. Hindsight 20/20. Lesson learned. Eddy's lack of concern over this and his refusal to work with me on a return of this snake is a red flag and concerning. He wants to put the blame on me but you really can't. TWO clear deformities (see the pics) on the dorsal side with no damage to any scales around them. Not something that happens from a "pinch" from a container like Eddy claims in his FB message. You can read all of this and make your own decisions on whether or not you would do business with him. I will post the pics in a separate message. Here are the text messages....12/6, 2:29pm
David Freeman
Please call me at 919-628-9405
.
...
Today
David Freeman
7:23am
David Freeman
Eddy, I would appreciate hearing back from you on this kinked tail indigo. I want to return it ASAP for a full refund.
.
...
Eddy Wilson
7:55am
Eddy Wilson
David, after careful consideration and going back and looking at pics of this snake, a refund is out of the question. All pictures I have show no kink, you had the snake for 8 days before mentioning anything about a kink. I think the kink or bump happened while the snake was in your posession. I have inspected every hatchling carefully for any flaws before selling them and your's was perfect when it left my hands.
.
...
David Freeman
8:29am
David Freeman
How exactly would the kink or bump happen in my possession Eddy? That is the most ridiculous thing I have heard in all of my years in the business. After I discovered these two kinks, or bumps that rise from the top of the spine, I started to research it and found many discussions in several forums describing this exact condition. We both know that the snake was blue when I purchased him from you. Therefore, I took every precaution with this being my first indigo and just put him straight into the cage and let him be until he shed. I wanted to make sure he had time to shed first and then acclimate to his new environment before handling. In hindsight, I also put way too much faith and trust in you as an indigo breeder and should have inspected the snake more thoroughly. It was after he shed that I discovered this outright flaw in this $900 animal. So here is the deal, if I was you, I would research my reputation in the reptile world. David Freeman, Carolina Classic Dragons, LLC It is impeccable both as a breeder that has sold thousands of reptiles and as a buyer. I will take this public by noon today if we can't reach a resolution. I will drive this snake to you and you can pay via Paypal or credit card. I don't care. I will try to contain my emotions here but you really don't want this to go public.
.
...
Eddy Wilson
8:45am
Eddy Wilson
Take it public if you feel it to be necessary David. The kinks look to me like it possibly got pinched while closing a container. I cant truly say since the snake has been in your posession for well over a week now. As I said, I inspected every hatchling carefully and as a buyer I expected you to do the same. I mean come on, like you said, its a $900 animal, why would you not inspect it immediately? Then 8 full days later you want a refund. Not gonna happen. So if you feel the need to take it public then go for it, you're still not getting a refund.
.
...
David Freeman
8:59am
David Freeman
Suit yourself.
.
...
David Freeman
9:16am
David Freeman
As a FYI, it will be posted in the BOI on Fauna Classifieds. They like to make sure the person being labeled as "Bad Guy" gets notification to defend themselves. Obviously I will be posting the pics and discussion of the bumps/growths/kinks (whatever you want to call them) on multiple forums as well.
.
...
Eddy Wilson
9:17am
Eddy Wilson
.
