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Fair Price for a male Spark?

hissnthatexotics

Hiss'n'That Exotics
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I have one I want to sell. I can't seem to find a price on them. I never worked with the morph so obviously never owned or researched before then. I've found prices between $200-$3500 which is a big gap. Most of them are between $800-$1000 so the question is what is fair market price for one of these guys.
 
I had a female puma around 400 grams on my table a narbc for $600. I have a proven breeder specter male for $200 and neither sold. Any sparks I produce will be around $100
 
Apparently Kevin at NERD sold one for $650
I'm really confused lol. I also found a Puma for $1500 ik you can ask whatever you want but at this point I think its worth at least $500
 
People can ask whatever they like. Anything in life is worth whatever someone is willing to pay for it. I am not dropping the price of my sparks, that's what I will sell them at. I see bananas for $450 and the some people still asking over a grand. If the person asking a grand can sell it good for them. I was replying to a thread that asked how much something is worth but I guess if it's honest, people don't like it? Please tell me where people are still spending top dollar and I will go there. I just picked up a snake for $300 that I see guys asking $1000 for them. Obviously the one for $300 sold and I bet at $1000 it will be for sale this time next year. I saw vpi axanthic spider females here for $550 shipped and the girl said she sold one. At a show I marked them at $400 and offered a couple people a axanthic spider, axanthic, and het axanthic females for $600 and none sold. Then I see them for sale for $300. Now my choice is drop the price to what someone is willing to pay or be ready to keep feeding hundreds of snakes. I have worlds firsts that people tell me are worth thousands, but they don't have the thousands to spend so? So back to the original question......I have seen multiple pumas (spark yellow bellies) and one pastel puma sell and not sell at $450-$600 so I think a spark male is worth $200-$3500, but I will ask $100 for any male and $200 for any female I may produce this year:D
 
Problem is a lot of people are going to expect to pay $100 as the "market price" on any other spark that is being sold. So that drops the price for everyone in turn crashing the market. Take it how you want thats fine and sell your animals at the price you want. There is a possibilty of sitting on snakes you produce for a year so when they dont sell in 3 months just go ahead and drop all the prices? Sounds like the money aspect is more important and if it is the fact of having to feed hundreds of snakes then maybe breed according to what the market wants at the time so your not stuck with animals. We hatched 6 male yellowbellies out this season and guess what aloy of people dont need a male yellowbelly but we finally sold one. Im positive there are 5 more people that want a male yellowbelly out there but if they dont sell in a few months im not going to drop the price to $20. I will have patience and at the same time start planning smarter for next season and yb should only be a by product of producing other genes so we dont get as many as we did this season. Not degrading you Randy im just calling how i see things man...
 
You know Mark you are correct that it drives the prices down. Unfortunately there are a couple guys that destroyed the market of balls with the banana.
 
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And if you think about the money aspect, one can argue that if you dont sell every snake for 20 bucks, your in it for the money. Single gene males are getting harder and harder to sell. And honestly, most of the single gene males I sell (like 80%) go to those looking for a cool pet for the same price as a normal at a pet shop. But in the eyes of a non herper, paying over 100 bucks for a snake is ridiculous. (A line I have heard many times)
 
Exactly Jessie! I think holding a pet until you get what you want for it and breeding for the market is more for the money. I have refused to make snakes that would earn me more money in order to make the snake I like. I will still make banana combos even though the market is gone down faster than any other........because they are beautiful. One of my prettiest snakes is my desert firefly that I could have sold for $10,000 when we produced it, but now they are worthless to most because they can't make money because of breeding issues. I have had this argument before with the same people that have a dozen snakes and been doing it for all of a year. I still own desert females because they are gorgeous snakes. My first desert male that we paid $6000 on went to a friends kids with complete enclosure for free because I knew it was getting a good home.......guess I made them not worth a penny and crashed that market:D
 
I've had sparks for a couple years now. The year and a half old spark male I have, I have listed at $400. I think that's reasonable because he's ready to breed. I'll be listing this year's males at $250. I see no reason to drop to $100. Sparks make some awesome combos, and tend to be quite overlooked.

I've wondered where prices on pumas would be, too. I have a 13 month old puma female. People have told me I'm crazy to think I can ask $1,200 for her. They say, as Randy pointed out, that they see them listed for $600 all the time. I tell them, "sure, but they're not a year old." The good thing about not getting her sold, is that I'll just be able to use her as a breeder when she's older.

Why is it that people expect to get a sub-adult at a baby's price? And if someone sold one spark male for $100, what is the reasoning behind anybody thinking that the market price was just set to that low? It's tough to understand some people's thinking...

The simple economics of supply and demand show that prices will come down as more are produced. When a genetic flaw is found, prices drop faster, as is the case with deserts. When someone becomes impatient and drops their price drastically, why do buyers then expect the rest of sellers to follow suit? That doesn't seem to fit an economic model. Market forces are market forces (supply and demand).
 
I also wonder why people have that thinking. People that are selling snakes base their prices off the lowest price. So if someone is selling a spark for $100 then probably a couple more people are going to follow suit because of competiton and do the same thinking thats the new should be price. Am I a money hungry person just because i think animals shouldnt be given away at such a low price when the supply isnt there? I can understand pastels,spiders, yellowbellies because they are plentiful! I will quote someone on this " dont piss in the pool, go behind the bushes where no one sees"
 
yes I agree that I am very disappointed in the puma prices. They are worth more than that, but they are a two gene animal with one being yellow belly. We knew they would.

for those reading but not sure on the market or topic, here goes:
As Clark said, supply and demand. When a gene is new it has a way inflated price because people don't have it. Lets say there is this new gene that everyone loves called an "unobtainium" male and I want $50,000 for it. So you have 3 females that are lets say normal. It gets to breeding size (too young, but of weight and producing sperm) so you breed it to them. Its young so you only get 4 eggs from each. 12 eggs total and half are "unobtainums." You keep 2 girls and sell the other one for $20,00 and all three males for $25,000. You just made $45,000 after your initial investment. Now 10 other people have males (the original seller made some as well and sold them). Next year there are 40 more males sold, and 100 the following. Now that 151 people have them, the general public really take notice and get interested. The price falls in the $10,000-$15,000 range. Next year 300 people have them and they are $5000-$7500. You get the picture. The people that make out are the ones that have the initial large investment. There is still some backdoor deals, but no undercutting. All snakes will fall to their resting place price wise. No matter how much the snake it, it still costs the same to keep.

Now for pricing and crashing the market.......when everyone is selling a snake for a certain amount and you follow suit, that's economics. I have managed a business for many years and sometimes you must even lose money to make money. If something is on your floor and it doesn't sell, discount it. Its paid for and your money is tied up there when it could buy something that sells five times over and you get a profit from each time. Now as far as snakes go.......those 3 or 4 snakes can be sold to help you buy one that you need for a project, traded to help your project, or help you with any supplies/food to help your collect thrive. If everyone is selling a snake for $500 and you ask $400, that's not crashing a market. If everyone wants to go to the others and demand $400 that's their option. I have budged, I have held out for twice the going rate and got it because of quality. Everyone had dollar menus, you choose where you eat. If I only have enough for the dollar menu than that's what I'm getting. If I have more and you cant convince me to spend the extra $100.....is yours really worth it?

Crashing a market......your never gonna see this coming.....the banana! Two and a half years ago Jon Levy had one listed on his site for $50,000 "male maker".......what are the prices today?! How did we go from $50,000 to $500 in not even 3 years? Read section above. Now know that at the time of his listing there were already close to 1000 bananas in a few collections. 6 months later I knew of someone who had 200 by himself. I knew the market would drop, but not like it did. I figured I would wait and get mine later once it leveled off around $3000 for awhile. Well last year I had a guy I done trades and purchases with drop his prices to $3000 while everyone else was at $4500-$5500. He got ahold of me and said he would hook me up and give me one for $2000 plus paypal fees and shipping. Figured we were there so I bought. The next week they were $2000 shipped. Week later $1200 and mojave banana was $2000. When I called him on it he said "I cannot predict the market!" The market was still up there and he advertised his prices everywhere because he had a good amount of them. That's crashing a market, and all the morphs have suffered. That's it in a nutshell, along with over production.
 
yes I agree that I am very disappointed in the puma prices. They are worth more than that, but they are a two gene animal with one being yellow belly. We knew they would.

for those reading but not sure on the market or topic, here goes:
As Clark said, supply and demand. When a gene is new it has a way inflated price because people don't have it. Lets say there is this new gene that everyone loves called an "unobtainium" male and I want $50,000 for it. So you have 3 females that are lets say normal. It gets to breeding size (too young, but of weight and producing sperm) so you breed it to them. Its young so you only get 4 eggs from each. 12 eggs total and half are "unobtainums." You keep 2 girls and sell the other one for $20,00 and all three males for $25,000. You just made $45,000 after your initial investment. Now 10 other people have males (the original seller made some as well and sold them). Next year there are 40 more males sold, and 100 the following. Now that 151 people have them, the general public really take notice and get interested. The price falls in the $10,000-$15,000 range. Next year 300 people have them and they are $5000-$7500. You get the picture. The people that make out are the ones that have the initial large investment. There is still some backdoor deals, but no undercutting. All snakes will fall to their resting place price wise. No matter how much the snake it, it still costs the same to keep.

Now for pricing and crashing the market.......when everyone is selling a snake for a certain amount and you follow suit, that's economics. I have managed a business for many years and sometimes you must even lose money to make money. If something is on your floor and it doesn't sell, discount it. Its paid for and your money is tied up there when it could buy something that sells five times over and you get a profit from each time. Now as far as snakes go.......those 3 or 4 snakes can be sold to help you buy one that you need for a project, traded to help your project, or help you with any supplies/food to help your collect thrive. If everyone is selling a snake for $500 and you ask $400, that's not crashing a market. If everyone wants to go to the others and demand $400 that's their option. I have budged, I have held out for twice the going rate and got it because of quality. Everyone had dollar menus, you choose where you eat. If I only have enough for the dollar menu than that's what I'm getting. If I have more and you cant convince me to spend the extra $100.....is yours really worth it?

Crashing a market......your never gonna see this coming.....the banana! Two and a half years ago Jon Levy had one listed on his site for $50,000 "male maker".......what are the prices today?! How did we go from $50,000 to $500 in not even 3 years? Read section above. Now know that at the time of his listing there were already close to 1000 bananas in a few collections. 6 months later I knew of someone who had 200 by himself. I knew the market would drop, but not like it did. I figured I would wait and get mine later once it leveled off around $3000 for awhile. Well last year I had a guy I done trades and purchases with drop his prices to $3000 while everyone else was at $4500-$5500. He got ahold of me and said he would hook me up and give me one for $2000 plus paypal fees and shipping. Figured we were there so I bought. The next week they were $2000 shipped. Week later $1200 and mojave banana was $2000. When I called him on it he said "I cannot predict the market!" The market was still up there and he advertised his prices everywhere because he had a good amount of them. That's crashing a market, and all the morphs have suffered. That's it in a nutshell, along with over production.

I honestly have nothing else to say... that's purty much it
 
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