• Responding to email notices you receive.
    **************************************************
    In short, DON'T! Email notices are to ONLY alert you of a reply to your private message or your ad on this site. Replying to the email just wastes your time as it goes NOWHERE, and probably pisses off the person you thought you replied to when they think you just ignored them. So instead of complaining to me about your messages not being replied to from this site via email, please READ that email notice that plainly states what you need to do in order to reply to who you are trying to converse with.

  • IMPORTANT! PLEASE READ!! About the Google Adsense ads being displayed

    =====================
    Posted 08/15/2025
    =====================


    Yeah, I know. They are a pain in the butt. But they pay the bills to keep my server running. Just a fact of life, I am afraid.

    Want to get rid of them? Simple. Just become a Contributor level member or above and they will be gone. -> Please click HERE."

    Is that too much for me to ask of you to keep this site running? Well, sorry about that. I too wish I could get everything for free. But alas.....

    =====================
    Addendum: 01/10/2026
    =====================


    Google Adsense ad revenue for December, 2025 was just $30 over the cost of the lease for the server running this site. So, in effect, the money providing the incentive for me to continue running this site is coming SOLELY from the paid memberships and sponsorships here. Which honestly ain't much....

Five babies, five deformities... :(

ragnew

ragnew

Pede-a-Freak
Joined
Oct 13, 2003
Messages
331
Reaction score
1
Points
0
Age
47
Location
Denver
Well guys, this is officially starting to suck. In the last three days I've had five, little ones hatch out, and each and everyone of them have some sort of deformites...

Two of the little guys have some sort of leg deformation, the front right leg on both of them is quite a bit smaller then the left one, and the right legs (on both again) only have 3 - 4 toes. Besides that everything seems okay, all eating fine and growing, but deformities none the less.

Three of the babies have minor eye deformities (eye lids are there, however they seem to be smaller and sort of slit). I've checked that each of them could close both eyes, and all of them have been able to close both completely. Good news, sure, but still very disheartening to say the least.

All of my females are fed daily, and each feeding is supplimented with Herptivite and Rep-Cal with D3 (coated lightly, however coated every single time the girls eat).

My incubator's are checked daily, sometimes 3 times a day if I'm expecting a new arrival to be showing up. The lid is only lifted and never completely removed (lifted for maybe 1 minute tops). Temperature is set for 78 - 80 degrees on this incubator, however it is a Hovabator (circulated air model with fan as well).

I didn't have any of these problems the first few years... This is a real drag, a real drag indeed. Please, any ideas are more then welcome.
 
Rich-

I am really sorry you are going through this. It is a drag, to put it mildly.

Everyone seems to have an opinion about what causes deformities like this. And there are, I am sure, various reasons why this happens.

My personal opinion: Either too much D3 or lack of Vitamin A. Here's why I think this:

Since I stopped using Rep Cal with D3 this season, I have had a total of 3 hatchlings with deformities (this is out of around 250-275 hatchlings). I used to supplement like you do, at every feeding dusting with Rep Cal w/ D3. My females also had a dish of Rep Cal w/ D3 in their enclosures at all times. I supplemented 2-3 times a month with Herptivite. I hatched deformed leos on a fairly regular basis. I know it was not genetic as they hatched from not only related animals but also completely unrelated animals from totally different lines. I know it was not my incubation temps (I think this plays much less a role in deformities as some choose to believe actually).

Now I use Rep Cal WITHOUT D3, and Vionate. My females have a dish (not their feeding dish) containing Rep Cal with no D3 in the enclosure at all times. I dust their food about every other feeding with same. Once a week I replace the Rep Cal with Vionate and leave it for a day or two. And then I put the Rep al back in and take the Vionate out, etc.

It has been a fantastic season for me so far, and I credit it to the supplementation change. Totally has to be, as that is the only thing I have changed.

Good luck with your little ones, and don't despair. Things WILL get better.
 
Thanks for all the info Kelli, I do appreciate it. I'm going to stop with the Rep Cal that's got the D3 in it to see what happens. I was kind of wondering if that was one of the problems (if not the whole problem). I'm going to go ahead and pick up some of the Rep-Cal without Vitamin D3 and see what happens with that... Does Vionate have the D3 in it, or do you not use it at all?

Vince, alot of the babies I'm having problems with are ones that came from animals I'd hatched out a few years back. This is the only year that they've ever given me any kind of trouble, so I'm almost postive it's not my adults. I've also got a few Tangerines that are from the Brant line, as well as a GREAT male from Kelli (still waiting for his to hatch, really excited about them too).

Then I've got some Tremper Albinos that I purchased from local shows, and hatched out on my own.

Thanks guys!
 
Rich that is a bummer man...... I agree 100% with Kelli about the D3 and I have been saying it for a while now..... It should not be used all the time...... It is not a good idea to cut the D3 out totally though..... I use the repcal w/D3 once maybe twice a month.....

Rich, I wish you luck with the rest of your hatchlings..... I got my fingers crossed over here man....
 
Does Vionate have the D3 in it, or do you not use it at all?
Click to expand...

Richie- Yes, Vionate contains some D3 but not near as much as Rep Cal. Rep Cal contains 20 times the amount of D3 that Vionate does.

You have to be careful not to overdo it with Vionate also though. 2-3 times a month is probably sufficient. It does containa lot of Vitamin A, which is a fat soluable vitamin (as is Vitamin D3). Fat-soluble vitamins may be stored in the body (usuallt the liver) and can cause toxicity when taken in excess.

Good luck Rich! Oh, you should be able to find Vionate at your local feed store, if not you can order it here, where I get mine:
http://futurepets.com/cgi-bin/FULLPRES.exe?PARTNUM=GIM99440
 
I feel your pain Rich...and I'm also doing almost exactly what you are (were) doing. Thanks for posting and thank you Kelli and Gregg for the info! I've had a few deformities this year (2 out of 10 babies hatched so far)...so I'm gonna pull the D-3 Rep Cal. Hopefully I won't see many more deformities, but I wonder...I've been pushing the D-3 pretty strong on my breeder females!? :bawling: Hope you hatch some perfect little babies soon Rich...again thanks for helping us by sharing your situation
 
Quick question..

KelliH said:
Richie- Yes, Vionate contains some D3 but not near as much as Rep Cal. Rep Cal contains 20 times the amount of D3 that Vionate does.

You have to be careful not to overdo it with Vionate also though. 2-3 times a month is probably sufficient.
Click to expand...


I remember reading a while back that you said you leave a dish of calcium in thier enclosure for them to lick on thier own, do you put this in three times a month as well or do you only put it on the feeders 3 times a month and leave the other calcium in with them??
 
I agree totally about too much D3. Last year I used calcium with D3 and had like a 40% healthy baby hatch rate. This year, very little D3 and my healthy baby hatch rate so far is 40/41. I would say that there is a huge difference, unfortunately no one told me this for a year after I first started breeding. But that was before I started coming here.
 
So far Ive had all but 1 hatch Ok that were feritle and no D3, I just started using the D3 a few weeks ago and only plan to use it a couple of times a month.

Hope the rest of your babies hatch OK for you!
 
So is the consensus is that it is the D3 more then the vit. A? I am asking cause I need to buy more calcium and plan to get Rep-Cal with out D3. However, I just opened a new Herptivite 2 days ago and would prefer to finish it before buying Vionate.

Thanks,
Jeff C.
 
I remember reading a while back that you said you leave a dish of calcium in thier enclosure for them to lick on thier own, do you put this in three times a month as well or do you only put it on the feeders 3 times a month and leave the other calcium in with them??
Click to expand...

They always have a dish of Rep Cal without D3 in with them at all times, except for the few days a month when it is replaced with Vionate.

They have a seperate bowl for food with no supplement in it.

So is the consensus is that it is the D3 more then the vit. A? I am asking cause I need to buy more calcium and plan to get Rep-Cal with out D3. However, I just opened a new Herptivite 2 days ago and would prefer to finish it before buying Vionate.
Click to expand...

I personally think it is the D3, but it's possibly not enough Vit A. I am not sure, all I know for sure is my season is rocking and it is because I have changed my supplementation.
 
I think people go over board with calcium. Gut loading , dusting, dish in the wild I don't think they get an 1/8 of that in captivity. Then again some people use their geckos as egg factory's and have them produces 10+ clutches a season so all that extra is needed.
 
Vince said:
I think people go over board with calcium. Gut loading , dusting, dish in the wild I don't think they get an 1/8 of that in captivity. Then again some people use their geckos as egg factory's and have them produces 10+ clutches a season so all that extra is needed.
Click to expand...

I think they get a much better varied diet in nature that provides what we have to supplement for.

In captivity a normal diet would be a variety of: crickets, meal worms, super worms, wax worms, & pinks.

In the wild a normal diet would be a variety of scorpions, all types of beetles (& larve), spiders, pinks, Centipedes, Millipedes etc and we cannot or do not copy that in captivity.

So the supplements are what round out the restricted diet that is fed.
 
Hey guys, thanks for all the kind words and info I do appreciate it.

Gregg, thanks much buddy, I'm keeping my fingers crossed as well. Just been a real horrid start so far, and I'm pretty freaked out by the thought of more hatching out like this now that it's already happened five times already. Again, thanks much man!

I recently purchased T-Rex's Leopard Gecko Dust, I looked at it's D3 content and it's only 4,000 iu's, compared to Rep-Cal's 400,000 iu's. Now, I've not opened any of the containers of it yet, because I was hoping to see whether or not anyone has had any kind of luck with this stuff. The directions say to use it at every feeding.

I also picked up some pure calcium carbonate that has nothing else in it. I was going to use that on occasion as well.

What do you guys and gals think?
 
Hey Vince,

I actually got my plain cal from a reptile shop here in Denver, Scales & Tails. I've found several from them as well (Rep-Cal no D3, Bone Aid by T-Rex, and one that was recently put out by Jurrassi-Pet, can't remember name for that one though).
 
I use the T-Rex Leo Dust for my babies and now breeders,

Pure Cal on breeders

would love to hear of experience with T-Rex on breeders would be nice to use just one!

ragnew said:
Hey guys, thanks for all the kind words and info I do appreciate it.

Gregg, thanks much buddy, I'm keeping my fingers crossed as well. Just been a real horrid start so far, and I'm pretty freaked out by the thought of more hatching out like this now that it's already happened five times already. Again, thanks much man!

I recently purchased T-Rex's Leopard Gecko Dust, I looked at it's D3 content and it's only 4,000 iu's, compared to Rep-Cal's 400,000 iu's. Now, I've not opened any of the containers of it yet, because I was hoping to see whether or not anyone has had any kind of luck with this stuff. The directions say to use it at every feeding.

I also picked up some pure calcium carbonate that has nothing else in it. I was going to use that on occasion as well.

What do you guys and gals think?
Click to expand...
 
Back
Top