Heavy parasite load found in ball python from Ed Clark

[hhmoore]

Ed stated that he has a vet which performs fecals on his animals, thus, he would have records.

Not necessarily, I have had numerous fecals run & never had anything to show for it, aside from an occasional notation on a bill that the tests were performed (when there was an "official" visit involved). Most of the time, I just got told what (if anything) was found. No paperwork, nothing to show.

 

[rabernet]

Not necessarily, I have had numerous fecals run & never had anything to show for it, aside from an occasional notation on a bill that the tests were performed (when there was an "official" visit involved). Most of the time, I just got told what (if anything) was found. No paperwork, nothing to show.

Maybe all vets don't keep records the same, but wouldn't your vet have records of what he did for you and the results? I know that my modest collection of 17 all have their own patient charts, and I can call him and get a medical history on any of them, whether my bill reflected a fecal test was performed or not.

Even in higher numbers, would there not be at least a chart kept under the owner's name and every visit and result recorded? For example, group of ball pythons, fecal smears, all negative on XXX date?

I don't know for sure, that's why I'm asking.

 

[rabernet]

I have a very good herp vet that I use and we do random fecals on my adult breeders and have not had any positive results yet for internal parasites...all negative!

To follow on my previous post (again, maybe not all vets do keep records) - would it not be reasonable to presume that Ed's vet would have records of having performed all these negative fecals, and all it would take would be a phone call from him to request a copy of his file?

And if they all test negative, why wouldn't he have done that in the early days of this thread, rather than refuse to defend himself?

 

[Wilomn]

I've got to go with harald on this one. I do occasionally get fecals done with no written report. Of course, that is ONLY if there is nothing found. IF something is found, then meds are prescribed and a record is started for future checks.

However, mr. clark said he HAD records, that he could PROVE his snakes were clean, then weenied out and ran away like the coward he is.

 

[rabernet]

(when there was an "official" visit involved).

Sorry Harald, I somehow missed this part of your post. I guess if the visit wasn't official, then I can see how it might not be recorded.

 

[JudyC]

I have a very good herp vet that I use and we do random fecals on my adult breeders and have not had any positive results yet for internal parasites...all negative!

Does this mean his imports don't necessarily get checked? Or the other animals he buys to flip? Is Ed making the same mistake that Emily has been so soundly chastised for?

 

[rabernet]

I've got to go with harald on this one. I do occasionally get fecals done with no written report. Of course, that is ONLY if there is nothing found. IF something is found, then meds are prescribed and a record is started for future checks.

Thank you Wes for helping explain. I will defer to your experience (and Harald's) on the subject. I wasn't intending to challenge Harald, I just couldn't fathom it (but admittedly, I only have a modest collection) - which is why I asked.

 

[crotalusadamanteus]

And what proof would you require that would satisfy you? I personally do random fecal testing of my animals but I have no way to prove it to you. It's not like I can scan a copy of a veterinarian's invoice/bill.

Actually, you paid for a service. If you want copies, you are entitle to them. Some may want a fee for copying them, but they are available. Need proof?

Ed said he has his tested randomly, I would like to see this for myself. Just one copy Ed, just one lousy copy.

It's about time the playing field gets leveled, folks. Ed, Bruce, and Bud have conspired to inflate their own karmas by bumping each other's points. The wind needs to be let out of their sails.

 

[Dr Owens]

I took another group of fecal samples in for testing yesterday, one of which was from one of the other females that came from Ed. That female tested positive for coccidia. The rest of the fecals were clear.

Emily,
Just to be clear about the facts, how many of the animals that you received from Ed have been tested at this point?

 

[ExoticsExpress]

Look dude, you agreed to the rules. You got warned for not following them. Get over it, quit the whining, and move on. Chasing people around the site telling them they have to "post there name with every post" is not going to be received very well as a whole. It's old already to me.

Fair warning. Let the Admin and Mods handle these things.

Wow bro, what on earth is your problem. All I was doing is asking a question to try to get a reasonable answer and your throwing a hissy fit. First of all, I am not arguing why I got warnings....it's just is weird. I say this because Rich wouldn't curse on the site, wouldn't put spamming posts everywhere, ding people for no reason, all because it seems to be against the rules, but yet the whole put your name is ignored, but everyone in sight can get warned. I am dropping it now was just wondering, so don't post unless you actually have something useful to say involving my question. If it was beat to death so much in the past why wouldn't he just put his name down to prevent future issues with it. I do apologize for not finding where it was explained before and bringing up an old "thing". Take care!

Anthony Allis
[email protected]

 

[Dr Owens]

Rich has a login (Rich Z) that he uses when he is posting on the BOI as a member (i.e. when he's posting info about someone, or when he's posting something in regards to the subject at hand.) Conversely, he posts using his Webslave title when making administrative posts, or when he's posting about things that do not concern the immediate topic of a BOI discussion.

Having said that, I would recommend refraining from trying to "call out" the admin of the site...especially when you aren't completely aware how things work.

 

[ExoticsExpress]

Rich has a login (Rich Z) that he uses when he is posting on the BOI as a member (i.e. when he's posting info about someone, or when he's posting something in regards to the subject at hand.) Conversely, he posts using his Webslave title when making administrative posts, or when he's posting about things that do not concern the immediate topic of a BOI discussion.

Having said that, I would recommend refraining from trying to "call out" the admin of the site...especially when you aren't completely aware how things work.

Thanks, thats all I was wondering about, wasn't calling anyone out. Was simply asking about it and up until that post, I still was unsure. Thanks.

Anthony Allis
[email protected]

 

[hhmoore]

Running off topic for a moment - Anthony, the BOI is not the place for this discussion. Questions of this nature belong in the Feedback Forum (unless you are going to somehow tie this in to Ed Clark, ball pythons, parasites, or something related to the topic at hand.

Now, on to the vet issue. I don't have what I consider to be a "large" collection...but I do have a good relationship with my vet. It would not surprise me in the least to find that others, especially those doing this on a large scale, have some kind of arrangements for vet services. Now, I don't know how Ed does things, so this is merely speculation...but maybe the vet (or one of the techs) stops by occasionally and does a few fecals. No office visit, no paperwork, no patient chart, no official bill - just some remuneration for the time and supplies. Maybe he pays a periodic fee for services (say, quarterly), and has chosen to bypass some of the specific paperwork since he deals with animals in quantity. Perhaps, he has never had a single fecal done, and his statements to the contrary were just . Not for me to say.

 

[crotalusadamanteus]

Wow bro, what on earth is your problem. All I was doing is asking a question to try to get a reasonable answer and your throwing a hissy fit. First of all, I am not arguing why I got warnings....it's just is weird. I say this because Rich wouldn't curse on the site, wouldn't put spamming posts everywhere, ding people for no reason, all because it seems to be against the rules, but yet the whole put your name is ignored, but everyone in sight can get warned. I am dropping it now was just wondering, so don't post unless you actually have something useful to say involving my question. If it was beat to death so much in the past why wouldn't he just put his name down to prevent future issues with it. I do apologize for not finding where it was explained before and bringing up an old "thing". Take care!

Anthony Allis
[email protected]

Seeing as the only thing that prompted a response from you was the fact you got dinged for it, made it seem like simple whining to me. Add to that the fact you humped Toms leg twice over in the Boa forum about it, and it makes it seem more like whining. More to it than just the one simple question and you know it.

I still say get over it. It's a warning, nothing more. Not the end of the world. Let the Mods and Admin do their job.

Sorry if you take offense to my directness, but, that's how I am sometimes.

 

[Wraith]

Actually, you paid for a service. If you want copies, you are entitle to them. Some may want a fee for copying them, but they are available. Need proof?

You misread. I said I do my OWN fecals checks. I personally have the supplies/equipment needed to conduct standard fecal checks on my animals. I hardly can go to a vet and ask for a copy of an invoice or client record for a service they never performed... so how would I be able to prove to anyone sufficiently to satisfy that the animals have indeed had regular/semi-regular/random checks done on them.

 

[crotalusadamanteus]

You misread. I said I do my OWN fecals checks. I personally have the supplies/equipment needed to conduct standard fecal checks on my animals. I hardly can go to a vet and ask for a copy of an invoice or client record for a service they never performed... so how would I be able to prove to anyone sufficiently to satisfy that the animals have indeed had regular/semi-regular/random checks done on them.

You are correct. I misread it. My bad.

Trying to learn more about doing that myself too. Could save a lot of money in the long run.

 

[cookreptiles]

Emily,
Just to be clear about the facts, how many of the animals that you received from Ed have been tested at this point?

I received 6 females from Ed. I took 3 to a show and sold them shortly after receiving them. Of the 3 I still have 2 have been tested. One tested positive for tapeworms, strongyloides and coccidia. One tested positive for coccidia.

My vet has encouraged me to go ahead and treat the third snake at the same time that I treat the one I just had tested (starting tonight) as opposed to waiting for a fecal. He feels that the probability of her testing positive for one or more of the same parasites is good since she came from the same source and exhibits the same symptoms as the others. For the sake of convenience and the health of the snakes I feel this may be the best plan, even though it means that I will not have complete proof that all three snakes that came from Ed have parasites while the rest of my collection does not.

 

[Mooing Tricycle]

I received 6 females from Ed. I took 3 to a show and sold them shortly after receiving them.

You may have noted on this somewhere else in the thread, maybe not. but did you ( if you can/could) alert the buyer to this potential problem as well?

 

[cookreptiles]

Unfortunately I have no idea who the person was. I sold all three to a guy in Columbia, SC last November (I didn't do any kind of receipt and he paid in cash) at a show there. I can't remember if I told him that they were produced by Ed, but I did tell him that I didn't produce them myself and that I received them in a trade deal. I gave business cards to people who purchased animals from me but I never heard anything from him after that.

 

[Dr Owens]

I received 6 females from Ed. I took 3 to a show and sold them shortly after receiving them. Of the 3 I still have 2 have been tested. One tested positive for tapeworms, strongyloides and coccidia. One tested positive for coccidia.

My vet has encouraged me to go ahead and treat the third snake at the same time that I treat the one I just had tested (starting tonight) as opposed to waiting for a fecal. He feels that the probability of her testing positive for one or more of the same parasites is good since she came from the same source and exhibits the same symptoms as the others. For the sake of convenience and the health of the snakes I feel this may be the best plan, even though it means that I will not have complete proof that all three snakes that came from Ed have parasites while the rest of my collection does not.

Thanks for answering Emily. So, when you said earlier that "the other fecals were clear," you were refering to all of the other snakes (i.e. the ones that you didn't get from Ed) in your collection that were clear. Is that correct?

Two more questions...
How many of your snakes (other than the ones that you got from Ed) have you had tested because of all of this? Also, how much has all of this hassle cost you?


One more thing, Ed has been less than forthcoming through all of this, but it's going to be a little harder for him now...he got suspended a few hours ago. (Of course, based on what has transpired up until this point, I doubt that it will have any affect on the course of this thread.)