Here's a Craigslist question for you guys!

[WJS Herps]

Just for the hell of it I like to look under the pets forum on Craigslist once in a while. People are always complaining about getting flagged on there when they are trying to sell an animal.

News flash! It states in the TOS that you aren't allowed to sell animals, only adopt them out for a reasonable "rehoming" fee. Yet I constantly see people selling animals (to include reptiles) for at least market value and then whining when they get flagged. (By the way, I'm not a flagger - yet!)

My question is - what do you all consider a reasonable adoption fee? To me, an adoption fee would be to recoup some care and feeding expenses, as well as (if you had a dog or cat say) spaying and neutering or microchipping in the case of some reptiles.

Do you think an adoption fee should have anything to do with the monetary value of the animal? After all, it is being "rehomed" - presumably because the owner can no longer care for it - not "sold."

For instance - I know a macaw is an expensive bird, but is $500 really a rehoming fee?

I really love it when someone has an entire litter or clutch of something that they are trying to "rehome" at near retail prices.

I'm not sure why Craigslist doesn't just allow animals sales (maybe someone here can enlighten me) as this rule is constantly abused and in some areas outright scoffed at.

Some of the scumbags I see on Craigslist make the BOI baddies look like saints!

Anyhow, just wanted to see if anyone else on here has wondered about this...

Bill

 

[Lucille]

I can see charging something to recoup vet/spaying'neutering expenses.

Otherwise I think an 'adoption fee' should be just high enough to discourage bunchers, who acquire animals and then sell them to labs, and also those who 'flip' animals. Right now there seems to be a hot market for tiny dogs, so there are people who pose as adopters, ask for free or low cost little dogs, and then sell them for profit.

I don't think there are any easy answers here. I personally would not mind supporting a bona fide rescue with an adoption fee that reflects vet and other expenses; but there are casual 'rescue' groups that acquire animals and then charge high adoption fees without providing any vet care.

There are people on CL trying to make a buck off pets, and 'selling' rather than 'rehoming'. But the discussion should not only rest on the sellers; their actions are fueled by buyers also, as there seems to be a ready market for those who abuse the CL rules and sell animals.

 

[John E Dove]

Well I can't answer most of your questions about Craig's List since the only time I bother looking there is when one of these posts appears on a forum but I do have my opinions on these so called Adoption Fees and Rehoming Fees.

IMO, Adoption Fees and Rehoming Fees are bologna when asked for by anyone other than a 501c rescue. To me they fall into one of three catagories.
1. They are an attempt to capitalize on a down on its luck animal someone got for nothing and did not really want to begin with.
2. They are a selfish attempt to get money back for a "disposable pet" someone no longer wants. IMO there are no disposable pets btw.
3. These terms are used as a gimick to entice people into helping the poor wittle cwitter that someone is in truth selling.

 

[TrulyRare]

There are SOOO many flag Nazi's on Knoxvilles craigslist.
My friend lost her dog, posted to see if anyone had seen him, and they kept flaggin her for no reason..how messed up is that?

 

[WJS Herps]

I can't see flagging people for a lost dog type of post, that's just ridiculous.

I just see a lot of people outright selling under the guise of "re-homing" or "adopting out..."

I especially love it when people won't post the re-homing fee publicly. What does that tell you???

 

[Lucille]

Well I can't answer most of your questions about Craig's List since the only time I bother looking there is when one of these posts appears on a forum but I do have my opinions on these so called Adoption Fees and Rehoming Fees.

IMO, Adoption Fees and Rehoming Fees are bologna when asked for by anyone other than a 501c rescue. To me they fall into one of three catagories.
1. They are an attempt to capitalize on a down on its luck animal someone got for nothing and did not really want to begin with.
2. They are a selfish attempt to get money back for a "disposable pet" someone no longer wants. IMO there are no disposable pets btw.
3. These terms are used as a gimick to entice people into helping the poor wittle cwitter that someone is in truth selling.

I disagree.

Not only does a small rehoming fee discourage bunchers and resellers, but there are circumstances where a partial reimbursement might be fair. If I saw a dog that had been hit by a car, for instance, and paid a vet $500 in fees to help the dog get better, then a small adoption fee might be reasonable.

There is another reason to maybe charge $10 or so for small animals: while obviously snakes deserve to eat, totally free animals might mean that a pet becomes food. I suppose there is a whole philosophical discussion about why or why not that should happen, but I think if a person genuinely needs to rehome a pet for some valid reason, they might want it to stay a pet rather than a python dinner.

There is no question that there is too much rehoming going on, but that's another conversation.

 

[Dennis Hultman]

free animals might mean that a pet becomes food.

I will give all of your rodents a happy home until the end of their time. I promise.. J/K

Bill, we went through the same situation here when we had a small fee for the classifieds. People tried to bypass the classifieds fee by using the free adoption section. People want to advertise for free so they lie and call it adoption.

 

[WJS Herps]

Now that's the answer I was looking for!

 

[sschind]

I used to wonder about all the "adoption" and "rehoming" fees myself until I found out that Craigslist prohibits the selling of animals. Now I just look at terms like that for what they really are, thinly veiled ways to get around the system. Short and sweet, we know they are selling the animals, they know they are selling the animals, and craigslist knows they are selling the animals. When they set up their TOS the powers that be at craigslist decided that if they prohibited the selling of animals it would make their product look more respectable. Similarly, they decided that if the allowed "adoptions" and "rehoming" they would likewise gain a bit in respectability because after all, who wouldn't support someone who supports helping give animals a better life. So, the solution was to not allow people to sell animals but to allow them to Adopt them out and rehome them and allow them to charge "reasonable fees". Voila, they have the best of both worlds. They get people selling animals which provides them with traffic which is what they need to stick around, and they get the illusion of helping do a good thing. They also realized that someone might argue that $700.00 is a bit steep for the adoption price of a baby albino ball python so they put the flagging process in place. This had the added benefit of making them seem serious in their policy of not allowing the sale of live animals while at the same time allowing some do gooders the ability to thump their chest and say "look, I caught some scumbag who was trying to sell their snake on craigslist"

Its BS and we all know it.

And before some of you jump all over me, yes, I know that legitimate ads exist for animals for adoption on craigslist. I saw one once, about a year ago.

 

[WJS Herps]

Hi Steve -

In my area (Tampa Bay area when I'm home), I see plenty of legit adoption ads, actually more than in most of the other communities I look through. I just don't understand why they don't just go ahead and let people sell animals now that it has reached the point that the abuse is so blatant and for the most part unmonitored. Why set up rules for your forum, classifieds, etc. if you're not going to enforce them.

Turning users into anonymous flaggers is a cop out in my opinion. I shouldn't have to be a tattle-tail to enforce someone else's rules, but when I obey the rules and some dirtbag completely ignores them it turns me into an asshole real quick. What I really love are all the people "re-homing" (at retail prices) reptile species of special concern (giant pythons, nile monitors) without bothering to mention any of the new regs and responsibilities that come with them.

I guess Craigslist really doesn't have mods? Is that what it's all about?

 

[Wolfy-hound]

I see no reason that people should not get a small rehoming fee when they are trying to find any animal a good home. It takes a lot of time and effort and money to keep animals until they go into a good home. And as pointed out above.. people VALUE something more when they have to pay at least a nominal fee.
I've seen so many people who just want a "free" pet.. because they will not put money into it, like for shots, spaying or nuetering, vet care if it gets ill.. and frankly.. I don't think they should get a pet at all if that's the attitude.
Some of the pets with higher "rehoming" fees like a macaw with $500 on it.. that's to try to keep people from "adopting and reselling" since macaws are not only expensive, but also very sensitive to changing homes. It's important to find a "forever" home for pets, not to send them off to whoever wants them that week. It's much easier to impulse snag a animal that's free, than to impulse pay out a decent fee to adopt it.
Yes.. I realize that interviewing the adopters can weed out those folks that are going to be irreponsible and resellers. It's much easier to post a fee, to weed out some if not all of those.. and then wave the fee if the potential owners are great people who might not have enough to adopt it, but DO have enough funds to take care of it.
I've rescued MANY dogs and cats(and the occasional odd animals), and rehomed them into new loving 'forever homes'(I hate that cutesy term, but it IS descriptive). I usually posted a fee to adopt, and many times waived the fee if I found the Right People to take that particular pet. Sometimes I did not waive the fee. After all, when I put money into food, shots, advertising the pet's availability, my own time in interviewing people, why shoul I not at least get enough money to cover the next pet that will come along? Even though THIS dog might come in healthy, and only need vaccines to be up to date on everything.. there's that next dog that might need $500 in vet bills, and what? You're gonna tell me that I should give the one away for free, but charge $500 to recoup my losses on the ill/injured one? That never works out somehow. The expensive poor little dog won't ever get adopted, and I won't be able to afford to help any others. So charge a small adoption fee for each.. to spread the cost so all have a good chance, and more can be helpd. It's the same principle as a animal shelter/business type adoption agency.
Yes.. we should ALL help the pets find new homes with NO compensation other than the love they give us.. but in reality at least *I* can't afford to continue to put out large vet bills without some help money-wise. I also can't afford to go opening a shelter, I have a job to pay my own bills. If someone else CAN afford to do all that, more power to them. I try to help out as much as I can, when and how I can. I like to think the pets I helped appreciate my efforts, but let's face it, they're all too happy enjoying thier new familys.

 

[WJS Herps]

Theresa, I completely agree that a reasonable fee is more than acceptable. I think in my first post I mentioned that neutering, spaying and chipping as well as feeding and general care cost money and there is every reason to try and recoup those costs.

I guess I just see so many that are BLATANT abuses that the rules might as well just go away.

I can see re-homing, interviewing, etc. Even posting that you might be willing to reduce the fee upon interview.

I guess I just don't like to see what I perceive as flaunting of (albeit impotent) rules.

As a side note: the other thing I love is when someone posts that they are destitute and can't afford to buy a dog and would someone give them one for free? If you can't afford to take care of yourself, how can you take proper care of a pet? LOL, I'm going off on a tangent now...

 

[Wolfy-hound]

I agree, just wanted to point out that not all the postings that ask for rehoming fees are people looking to 'make a buck off a free animal'.

There's a ton of folks that take free pets, and then 'rehome' those for fees, and do no vet work at all, since they only take pets that are ready for a new home. Even then.. I'm of the mind that if it offends you to pay the rehoming fee, then go elsewhere to get your pet.

What bugs me, is when it's a obvious price on a for sale pet.. those stay up, while trying to find homes for foundling kittens with a tiny fee to cover the vet work get flagged. And of course, people don't just flag, they'll spam you unmercifully off craigslist too. Just not so nice people, and a lot of keyboard commandos.

 

[sschind]

I do realize that there are legitimate rescues out there who may utilize Craigslist as a venue to help out otherwise unwanted animals. I also realize that some people (and it sounds like you may be one of these people Theresa) are simply trying to recoup some of the expenses incurred while holding animals to be adopted. I have no problem with that. After all, we don't seem to have a problem accepting that the humane society will charge upwards of $100.00 or more to adopt out a pet. And honestly, if a rescue is fortunate enough to receive an animal such as an albino ball python I don't have problem with them selling it at a fair market price. I also know that charging a fee can help discourage the lookey loos and those with less than honorable intentions. I guess my previous post stems from the fact that terms like "adoption fee" and "rehoming fee" are simply terms that have been deemed acceptable by Craigslist when they are simply euphemisms for "for sale. I can post that I have a puppy available for an adoption fee of $50.00 but I can't post that I have a puppy for sale for $50.00. Its just stupid.

 

[Wolfy-hound]

It's all PR. Appearances matter more than substance these days. Sigh.