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Hypo variation?

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Hello -

I have a question about the variation in the hypo gene. I just received a dragon that was sold to me as a hypo trans leatherback. The trans leatherback part is easy to tell, however, when I looked at his nails there is a bit of color to them. Does this make him a non-hypo dragon? Or is there a fair amount of variation in the degree of nail "clearness" in bearded dragons? I know many genetic traits have quite a bit of variation about them such as leatherbacks and trans. I have attached two pictures 1) is a dragon that I already have which is a hypo trans and 2) this new dragon that is supposedly a hypo trans. What you you guys think?

Thanks in advance for your opinions,

Kyle
 

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Dragon 1 IS a hypo.

Dragon 2 is NOT a hypo.


All clear nails= hypo
Dark nails= not hypo

And if you have a dragon that has 1 dark nail and 19 clear nails, it's not a true hypo. Maybe het for hypo, but not hypo.. (maybe there's such a thing as "partial" hypo? I don't know.)
 
bliss said:
Dragon 1 IS a hypo.

Dragon 2 is NOT a hypo.


All clear nails= hypo
Dark nails= not hypo

And if you have a dragon that has 1 dark nail and 19 clear nails, it's not a true hypo. Maybe het for hypo, but not hypo.. (maybe there's such a thing as "partial" hypo? I don't know.)
Click to expand...


Some will argue that point as i am going to do now. I do not know how to classify them BUT, i bought a hypo trans from dragon whispers 3 years back. Actually still have her. One of the few that has made it that long. Anyway she was a "true" hypo trans as a 6-7 inch baby. As time went on she developed some kind of "bleeding pigment" and the nails had this gray color to them. Well at a year and a half she has a smoke gray maybe charcoal color. BUT not a solid black. This dragon could not be sold as a hypo trans to anyone and them NOT complain about it.
I think what it comes down to is the "percentage" of how many "hypo's" are produced to make the call if there a true hypo...
I bred my hypo trans to a double het leatherback and got almost as many hypo's as i did trans, or it may have been the same amount. It was like 7 hypo trans 3 hypo trans leathers a hypo leather and some trans. If i breed her to a hypo het trans and get all hypos I will know for sure. But she is about to go into brumation. So it may take awhile
 
dragonluver83 said:
Some will argue that point as i am going to do now. I do not know how to classify them BUT, i bought a hypo trans from dragon whispers 3 years back. Actually still have her. One of the few that has made it that long. Anyway she was a "true" hypo trans as a 6-7 inch baby. As time went on she developed some kind of "bleeding pigment" and the nails had this gray color to them. Well at a year and a half she has a smoke gray maybe charcoal color. BUT not a solid black. This dragon could not be sold as a hypo trans to anyone and them NOT complain about it.
I think what it comes down to is the "percentage" of how many "hypo's" are produced to make the call if there a true hypo...
I bred my hypo trans to a double het leatherback and got almost as many hypo's as i did trans, or it may have been the same amount. It was like 7 hypo trans 3 hypo trans leathers a hypo leather and some trans. If i breed her to a hypo het trans and get all hypos I will know for sure. But she is about to go into brumation. So it may take awhile
Click to expand...

So, do you think it can be "partial" hypo, like some trans can be partial tans?
 
bliss said:
So, do you think it can be "partial" hypo, like some trans can be partial tans?
Click to expand...

:uhh::uhh::uhh:

I wouldnt want to say "partial hypo" Why call it a partial hypo if bred to another hypo and 100% are hypo babies. What makes it "partial"?

Also when you say "partial trans". there can be multiple reasons its a "partial trans"

It can have "white patches"... it can also have "solid black eyes" but not translucent scales.... Or it can have "translucent scales" and not have the "solid black eyes."

When discussed in the past with other breeders when just reffered to it as the "pigment bled out" in the nails.

I attached pics of a white hypo and her nails. In the pics it doesnt quite express how much "pigment" bled out but you can see that there NOT totally clear. and in person there alittle darker.

You made me wonder about the nails so i checked another adult hypo I have and she has produced 100% hypo baby clutches in the past. And she has pigment bled out in her nails.
 

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dragonluver83 said:
:uhh::uhh::uhh:

I wouldnt want to say "partial hypo" Why call it a partial hypo if bred to another hypo and 100% are hypo babies. What makes it "partial"?
Click to expand...

I was just meaning physically...

As a phenotype, the nails aren't completely clear, but as a genotype she is pure hypo because offspring are 100%.
 
bliss said:
As a phenotype, the nails aren't completely clear, but as a genotype she is pure hypo because offspring are 100%.
Click to expand...

I think this a GREAT point! I wonder this exact thing with many of the genes that have been found (not just in dragons but in reptiles in general). I do wonder how many genetically hypo dragons end up with some color in their nails. Although, the color that Tom is talking about is different, in my opinion, than the color of the nails that I posted.

Kyle
 
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