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Bad Guy Josh from Kolorburst Chams no contact. Paid for male received female

C

chelms865

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I purchased a Blue Bar Ambilobe Panther Chameleon from Josh of Kolorburst Chams late last October. I paid extra for a male and recently found out that it was a female. This is my first reptile and have spent over $1000 on the setup, not counting the $$$ for the cham. I have been trying to contact him and I have received no response. I have read that this guy is bad news but too little too late. I wanted a male for all the obvious reasons and have no intentions to breed them. This really sucks!!!
 
Could you provide a few more details? Any emails you could post between you and Josh during the transaction?

How old was the cham when you purchased/received it? Babies are sometimes difficult to sex.

I'm not disputing your claim, and I've never purchased from Josh, but 9-10 months is a long time to pass not knowing what gender of chameleon you have. It should have been evident before now, I would think.

How did you come to learn it's a female? Do you have a recent photo you could post?
 
First of all, we are considering a lawyer. I don't want to divulge too much on this topic. This will cost $$$ but considering what we have already lost, what's another few thousand? Plus, I don't want others to get screwed over.

What I can say is that I am new to reptiles. Therefore, when I specified that I wanted a male and paid for a male, I had to assume it was a male. I still can't tell the difference other than the vivid colors. That is what got me questioning her gender. The reason I took several months to question, was that I read on post that some chameleons are "latebloomers" and sometimes it takes upwards of a year for a cham to show its full colors. So, I waited and looked around at others. When I saw others females that were close to ours in age, that was when the light went off. I posted pics of her on another forum, and everyone that chimed in, informed me he was a she.

Upon arrival, she was tiny but appeared to be in good health. Ate like a champ and seemed very healthy. Not much color other than what she is now. Although her bars were more noticeable then. I think she is about to shed again.

Photos are posted. The thing is, if Kolorburst Chams can't tell the difference between male and female, he should not be selling them as such. If it is hard to tell, the seller should wait until they can tell. No answer from this guy tells me alot about what is going on.
 

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Yep ... he's a she. And looks like she's ready to drop a clutch of eggs. If you haven't already, get a laying bin in her enclosure asap.
 
LauraB said:
Yep ... he's a she. And looks like she's ready to drop a clutch of eggs. If you haven't already, get a laying bin in her enclosure asap.
Click to expand...

Yeah def looks like she can drop a clutch of infertile eggs if she has been solo.

I would get a egg laying bin as Laura said.

Is the guy still in business?
 
I am also on the Cham Forum and many members have been helping me with the he/she egg laying thing. This is not at all what I wanted and/or paid for. Anyway, I am trying to give her what she needs but am having to learn on the fly.

As for this #@!^%& still being in buisiness, I hope like hell not. He hasn't replied to any of my emails or phone calls since I found out he is a she. This is why we are considering the legal direction. It would be great if I could get some of the money back, though that is about as likely as winning the lottery. I just hope to make enough noise that he doesn't do this to anyone else. I also fear for the level of care the chameleons receive from someone with this type of dishonest character .

We are still trying to decide what our long term plans are with her at this point.
 
chelms865 said:
I am also on the Cham Forum and many members have been helping me with the he/she egg laying thing. This is not at all what I wanted and/or paid for. Anyway, I am trying to give her what she needs but am having to learn on the fly.

As for this #@!^%& still being in buisiness, I hope like hell not. He hasn't replied to any of my emails or phone calls since I found out he is a she. This is why we are considering the legal direction. It would be great if I could get some of the money back, though that is about as likely as winning the lottery. I just hope to make enough noise that he doesn't do this to anyone else. I also fear for the level of care the chameleons receive from someone with this type of dishonest character .

We are still trying to decide what our long term plans are with her at this point.
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there are other threads with him on it where he fails with consumer relations http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/forums/showthread.php?t=363419

that being said i would ask people who have delt with him and ask them for further info such as contact or address to write a formal letter of complaint.
 
Hi to all. Just letting you all know that Moose passed away yesterday at the Vet. We are deeply saddened to have her life cut so short. I have contacted Josh Coppins from [email protected], and nothing. This guy should not be dealing with animals period. I am hoping that this message reaches anyone attempting to do business with this guy. Stay as far away from Josh Coppins or Joshua Aaron or [email protected] at all cost.
 
:(

Just wanted to say I'm so sorry for your loss. Did she become eggbound? We have veileds and that is always a huge concern with us and our girl. I just can't imagine :( So sorry again and hope you find the guy.
 
chelms865 said:
I purchased a Blue Bar Ambilobe Panther Chameleon from Josh of Kolorburst Chams late last October. I paid extra for a male and recently found out that it was a female. This is my first reptile and have spent over $1000 on the setup, not counting the $$$ for the cham. I have been trying to contact him and I have received no response. I have read that this guy is bad news but too little too late. I wanted a male for all the obvious reasons and have no intentions to breed them. This really sucks!!!
Click to expand...

How did you manage to spend over a thousand on a setup for a chameleon?
Seriously, was it dipped in gold? Why would you get a lawyer since your only going to get what you paid for the chameleon and that would be in small claims court.
I know your pissed and with good reason but don't throw more money away.
File a small claims case should you prevail you may feel better.
The chances of recovery are slim to none with bad guys but at least you let everyone know.
Good Luck
 
jusmebabee said:
How did you manage to spend over a thousand on a setup for a chameleon?
Seriously, was it dipped in gold? Why would you get a lawyer since your only going to get what you paid for the chameleon and that would be in small claims court.
I know your pissed and with good reason but don't throw more money away.
File a small claims case should you prevail you may feel better.
The chances of recovery are slim to none with bad guys but at least you let everyone know.
Good Luck
Click to expand...

I was thinking the same thing on both your points. About a court case, be aware it will cost about what you paid for the Chameleon to file it. You then will have to pay to get someone to serve him papers. And finally, you will end up take at least half a day off work to go to court. All this to probably only get the difference in cost between a male and female in the end. You maybe better off just spending your money on another lizard.

On a side note, if you are new to reptiles, A Chameleon is not a good choice. Many experienced keepers don't consider themselves qualified to keep them. Good luck!
 
I agree with the above 2 posts, there a re a bunch of male chameleons on the forum now, all for around $300, to spend any more $$ on this guy would be foolish, just hope his rep gets your money's worth. Do some research and find someone that will completely acclimate an import or better yet find one that is a CB, though they will still be a challenge if you don't have experience. Ask lots of questions, most experienced folks understand they need to help out their customers in the way of advice on husbandry.
 
Thanks to all the replies. I received an email over the weekend from this guy(Josh Coppens). I am going to post the actual email conversation. As for the $$$, I am not interrested in getting my money back. I am interrested in stopping him from doing this again or with other animals. He has stopped the Chameleon gig but I want to stop him from ever making any $$$ off the back of another victim.

Sorry for your loss. Out of hundreds of customers I've sold to I've only had one other issue with a lady that is a breeder and thought the cham was dehydrated. I now longer deal in chams so u do whatever makes u happy it will affect me in no way


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Clark Helms <[email protected]> wrote:


Josh, I have attempted to contact you several times and you have not replied. You sold me a MALE blue bar panther chameleon last October. We recently found out he was a she. I found out too late as she was egg bound and died yesterday at the Vet. We are sad that her life ended so sudden. Our issue with you is that we purchased a MALE not a FEMALE. This resulted in her premature death. If you can't tell the difference between male and female, you should not be selling them as such. Personally, and from what I've read on forums, you shouldn't be dealing with animals period. I am going to persue several avenues to make sure you don't do this to anyone else and put more animals in harms way.

As for $1,000 on setup, I made most of it and it is desinged to look as though it is a piece of furniture or show case. Everything is automated and all pipes and cables are builtin with misting and drainage. Just add water 1 time per week and empty drain container and feed the cham.
 
To be fair, I saw a photo of the OP's enclosure at another forum. It was a beautifully designed and crafted furniture-type piece, with the screened cham cage inside. Obviously much time, effort and expense went into his project.

However, with chams, generally less is better, and research before purchasing any animal one is not familiar with or has kept is paramount.

That said, the OP wanted a male, paid the usual expected extra amount for a male cham and got a female instead.

The seller absolutely should not advertise or make guarantees on gender or ship until he/she can guarantee the gender the customer has requested and paid for.

And the buyer should have done more research on chameleons prior to the purchase, IMO.
 
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