KelliH and others Banned? Why?

[WebSlave]

What if I promise she will not use any profanity? I will teach her to use all the BIG words. She can be trained...

Promise? From Robin? Puhleeze... Like I have never been lied to by her before...... Probably just wants to post in Portuguese again and make me have to hire an interpreter....

 

[hill4803]

You hired an interpreter? The translation was off in some spots.

 

[WebSlave]

You hired an interpreter? The translation was off in some spots.

I was willing to hire him, but he did the translation for free. It was close enough to know what it really meant. And it DEFINITELY was NOT what Robin told me it meant. Not even close. So if you take a promise from her, well, all I can say is that I wouldn't take it too seriously.

But you are obviously familiar with that incident and you still take stock in her word?

Heck, didn't she just falsely use another account here to bypass the suspension? Not exactly the kind of indications I would expect from someone who I would expect the truth out of, in my opinion.

 

[hill4803]

Is Robin banned or just suspended? Is her account Robin S. banned?

 

[Golden Gate Geckos]

NO ONE HAS EVER HAD "RAMIFICATIONS" from speaking their mind here.

Whatever you say, Rich.

Are you TRULY a Minister? I'm having difficult resolving that datum with the stuff you posted in that Kelli thread. Don't you have to pass any sort of tests or something like that? Aren't there some sort of qualifications people have to possess in order to become a minister? Or is it just a job that anyone can hold? Just curious.

Yes. I am an Ordained Minister... I am not a Pastor, but I am a retired Hospital Chaplain. I perform weddings, baptisms, and memorial services. Being a Minister does not mean I am exempt from human failings.

 

[WebSlave]

Is Robin banned or just suspended? Is her account Robin S. banned?

Robin S. is suspended pending payment of the fine. If she was not aware of it directly, I know I mentioned this to Russ. And as I see she tried to log in today, she should have gotten a notice to that effect at that time.

 

[WebSlave]

Whatever you say, Rich.

You know how the search function works here. And I am certain that you have participated in, as well as observed, MANY instances of people taking all the pot shots at me they cared to. It was not until things got way out of hand and far beyond the point where anyone else would have put up with it that I finally had to take some action to end it. I seriously doubt anyone can dispute that fact.

Yes. I am an Ordained Minister... I am not a Pastor, but I am a retired Hospital Chaplain. I perform weddings, baptisms, and memorial services. Being a Minister does not mean I am exempt from human failings.

Hmm, I guess there must be a difference between a "pastor" and a "minister" then. Whatever it is that they call the people who were in charge of the churches I went to when I was younger, well I guess I would have been shocked to see those people displaying the "character" I saw in your posting in that thread on Kelli's site. Aren't you supposed to have some sort of leanings towards the Bible and it's teachings? I don't know, maybe it's just an anachronism in my perception of things that expects more from people of that station in life.

Doesn't being a Minister mean you should TRY to be above those feelings? Or does all it take is just a few minutes of repentance, say a couple of Hail Marys, and all is just swell again? Back to the real you until next time... I guess I never really understood that part of it.

So just ANYONE can become a Minister? Just apply for the job and if there is an opening, bang! you got it? Somehow I just never pictured it that way. Guess I've watched too many movies..

 

[Dennis Hultman]

What a bleeping mess.

Can't we go back to “this was all a misunderstanding” that caused most of this?

Kelli,
Would you agree, that for the most part, what Dr. Owens posted below is correct?


Perhaps, we could just have some dialog here that can set some of this aside. If not, all this will just continue to fester and nothing really will be solved.

Rich,
I spoke with Kelli at length last night, and it quite frankly it was the "fiasco comment" that started all of this. To make a long story short, she thought that you were referring to the Hayden auction as a fiasco...and it hurt her deeply (as the comment was taken out of context, i.e. misunderstood). I think that it's important to remember that Kelli has endured a hell over the past year that I wouldn't wish on any parent. IMO it's easy to understand how she could react emotionally to a perceived slight of an effort that was in memoriam of her son.

You and I both know that a certain amount of Chris' efforts were self "inflating," and Chris has certainly displayed his real character over the past several months. The important thing for everyone to recognize here is that the "fiasco" was between you and Chris...NOT between you and the efforts by many members of the reptile community to help Kelli and her family during their time of need. I know that you will agree with me that the efforts that people made to help Kelli and her family were NOT a fiasco.

In talking with Kelli, and explaining a little bit of the back story, and where you were coming from with your comment, she admitted that she had reacted emotionally to what you had said based on a misunderstanding of your intentions. Quite frankly, she was mad at you for things that you never really said (or meant to say)...she was hurt. I pointed out to Kelli that the main info that she had based her assumptions on was the info that Chris gave her when he called her almost a year ago and told her how you were trying to shut down the efforts of people trying to help her and her family. I also pointed out that I didn't believe for a second that what Chris told her wasn't extremely biased, and that Chris had every intention of painting you in a bad light to Kelli. So...here's poor Kelli, who has just suffered the most horrific loss that she could ever imagine, and Chris bombards her with this garbage. Do you think that she even had the capacity to objectively consider what Chris was telling her? No way...no one could have. She reacted emotionally, and was hurt and angry...just like any of us would have been. However, after everything was said and done, she chose to put those hurts aside and just "move on." She had already been through enough, and the last thing she needed was more drama, strife, or hurt in her life. However, it would have been impossible for her to forget it.

Now...fast forward almost a year, and you made the "fiasco" comment. Given the history, and the feelings that she had tried to put aside, it starts to become more clear as to why/how she could have taken what you said out of context. She was hurt, she was angry, she was in pain...a pain that few people could ever truly empathize with. Then, in what she thought was a private conversation, that pain came out...and you ended up being hurt by it.

As Kelli and I discussed everything, she made a very astute comment. She said that if Chris had truly been concerned for her well being, then he never would have made that call and told her the things that he did. Chris did what he did in an effort to hurt you, and in so doing he didn't just hurt you...he hurt Kelli. Chris only cared about making himself look good. Ultimately, Chris' action hurt you, Kelli, Fauna, Kelli's new forum, and the members of both.

Rich, Kelli does not hate you...she was hurt by you. There's a big difference. There is little doubt in my mind that if the two of you would just sit down and talk that you would realize that all of this drama is completely unnecessary. She doesn't want this, and I don't believe for a second that you do either...and neither one of you should fall prey to the people on both sides who are attempting to be self serving by trying to perpetuate the drama between the two or you.

Additionally, I know that Marcia regrets ever making the initial post as she has said so multiple times on the other forum. She is certainly not a hateful person. Rather she had a momentary lapse of judgment in which she vented her feelings of frustration in what she thought was a private conversation. Marcia regrets this, Kelli regrets this, and I am certain that you regret it. You are all three very intelligent, thoughtful people, and I hate to see your friendships torn apart by people who have nothing better to do than jump on board and fan the flames of the latest internet drama. None of this strife is necessary...how about picking up the phone? I know that Kelli would like to talk with you, and work this garbage out...she told me so.

 

[varnyard]

Can't we go back to “this was all a misunderstanding” that caused most of this?

Kelli,
Would you agree, that for the most part, what Dr. Owens posted below is correct?


Perhaps, we could just have some dialog here that can set some of this aside. If not, all this will just continue to fester and nothing really will be solved.

Well, we did I thought. But it seems that the ones that were reinstated are not wanting to go for that program, IMO. It looks to me like they are just wanting to be here to take away the things they put into this site. I do see the festering as well, but I do not see a instant cure.

I have been at work, but it looks like there has been tons of thoughts/feelings put on this issue. I have not been here to post on this thread, but I see that it has run three more pages since my last visit. I do have a few thoughts of my own.

First, this fight is not going to be a win for anyone. It is bound to hurt all of the ones involved. I could start pointing fingers, but I do not see where it would do much good. Everyone has their opinions. I have mine as well. As for this whole mess, it would have never started if the other thread in Kelli's test site had not happen.

As for my opinion, I have failed to see any of the members that started this mess come forward with any type of public apology to the ones that were hurt by their words. IMO, that shows poor charactor. It has been how long since this took place? The ones involved IMO, are trying to make it look like it is the members here that are to blame. Sorry, but it was not Rich, or the other members here that started this mess. It was Kelli, and the other ones that took it on their own to post that there. It was public, and in my opinion the need of a public apology would also be in order, to even start to clear this up. Not from just Kelli to Rich, but to all of the others that were slain in that discussion. Just my opinion on how it could be on the way to start healing that fester. So if they want to make their wrong doings right, heres their chance to show some sign of good faith.

 

[Lucille]

As for my opinion, I have failed to see any of the members that started this mess come forward with any type of public apology to the ones that were hurt by their words. IMO, that shows poor charactor.

I also have not seen this.
However, for me at least, the window of opportunity has closed for them on this one.
They have burned their bridges to the ground. All I see them doing here is returning to this site trying mightily to further destroy whatever they can. They will, I suspect, not be proffering words of reason..

With what I have seen, I would doubt the sincerity of any such words, in any case.

 

[gmherps]

You were basically hosting a forum for people Rich. That they paid you to host, they dont want it anymore so take it down. Not doing so is just being spiteful and petty. The same thing applies to not letting people have access to remove any personal images they have uploaded here.

Geez, the amount of hatefulness and pettiness I see everywhere anymore just makes me sick. I use to get online to get away from that crap for a while and now it is just everywhere you look. Online, TV, out my front door..... get a damn grip people.

I could not have said it better!!

Especially take heart and re-read the very last line people.

 

[gmherps]

Good one, Wendy. The only post I have from that person was right on the money. Not a lie at all from what I could tell. Certainly didn't seem like scum to me, either. Nope, I don't feel ashamed to not join the betrayal crowd at all.
So, I'm curious, what is the criteria you are using for calling that person a liar and scum, hmmm?

Would the inconsistencies of THE Moderator(s) be considered betrayal?

Do I expect an honest answer to this question? Of course not, I post it because I see and obviously see as well as other members here the inconsistency being displayed in how the TOS are carried out in leisure and at will to and for certain people. Rather disgusting act to do from someone(s) (LOL) who try to create the facade of being "a higher entity" with their posts.

 

[Ken Harbart]

Well, I can see Robin has once again affirmed my assertions about her complete lack of class, character, or integrity. The community as a whole is definitely better off without her, as whatever positives there are about her are far outweighed by her negative aspects. Should she be allowed back, her nature simply cause her to

Over the years, she has duped many, including myself, into believing that she was actually someone worth associating with, despite her malicious and self-serving nature. Alas, even the rosiest-colored glasses can't disguise her undeveloped mentality for long.

Robin is the posterchild for the mental and emotional deficiencies that I discussed earlier. Stasis, or balance, makes her extremely uncomfortable. She thrives on conflict and strife. Where there is none, she must create it. Where it exists, but in a mild form, she must inflame.

This may be due, in part, to feelings of inadequacy and low self-esteem caused by her extremely poor vision. Robin feels better about herself when she's being malicious towards others. Likewise, when she acts out in her sophomoric manner, she diverts the attention to herself, thus giving her a feeling of relevancy that she otherwise lacks.

 

[Lucille]

. Aren't you supposed to have some sort of leanings towards the Bible and it's teachings? I don't know, maybe it's just an anachronism in my perception of things that expects more from people of that station in life.

I remember also, the people of God I knew. It is, I think, a position of trust and respect.

And Marcia is 100% correct, religious folks are not above human failings, there are those who abuse that trust given them by God and man.

Look at the stories about the priests sexually abusing the young children entrusted into their care. The news stories one sees of church notaries who steal and make off with the contributions that families, many times poor families, sacrifice and tithe to see the work of God done. Yes, such horrors exist; but joining this group I think, should be avoided.

That we all stumble and fall once in a while is a given. What I have seen lately is a degree of relish and glee in the descent that does not become those who hold a holy calling.

One would expect that those entrusted with such a calling would do their best to follow the teachings of the Bible, to be kind, to follow the commandment to 'treat thy neighbor as thyself'. I don't see that happening, here.

 

[Golden Gate Geckos]

As for my opinion, I have failed to see any of the members that started this mess come forward with any type of public apology to the ones that were hurt by their words. IMO, that shows poor charactor.

I posted a PUBLIC apology within 24 hours of the thread on GeckoForums.net! It was up, in public view, for 3 days. If you failed to see it, I really don't know what else to say. I apologized to Rich personally, and have had no reponse. I honestly don't think an apology is what any of you really want.

----- Original Message -----
From: "goldengategeckos" <[email protected]>
To: "serpenco" <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, June 03, 2006 5:54 PM
Subject: Re:


Rich,

I am deeply sorry that my sophomoric actions in posting the "Your Favorite Fauna Members" thread at Kelli's beta-test site has hurt you. The fact that it was never supposed to be seen by anyone other than the few of us participating in the testing hardly excuses the shock, disappointment, and pain is has caused.

I can understand why you felt you needed to ban us... after all, we were "Mods Behaving Badly". Please try to understand that I would have never shown such disrespect on Fauna... one reason being that it IS your site, and another is that I would never have felt I could truly express my feelings there. You have made it very clear that Fauna is NOT a democracy, and your word is the rule. I don't think it is too much of a surprise how I feel about Lucille, and I have my reasons.

For what it's worth, there was NEVER any intention other than to have a Forum. I cannot speak for Kelli, but I can say that it was my plan to offer to step in as moderator for the Fauna Leopard Gecko Forum to help the transition of Kelli's resignation, and I had asked Brian Sibinski if he would be willing to take the Geckos Forum when that happened. I was not going anywhere!

I hope that when the raw feelings have had some time to diminish and the dust settles, we will be able to work out our issues to everyone's mutual benefit.

Sincerely,
Marcia



> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "serpenco" <[email protected]>
> To: "goldengategeckos" <[email protected]>
> Sent: Saturday, June 03, 2006 3:05 PM
> Subject: Re:
>
>
>> Marcia,
>>
>> The only thing I have sent you recently was a refund from PayPal for your advertising on FaunaClassifieds. But that was yesterday, not today.
>>
>> But in any event I will take this opportunity to tell you I am sorry you feel that way about me. I'm trying to do the best I can, which obviously is just not good enough for everyone.

 

[varnyard]

Marcia, I did not see that you had done this. But Rich was not the only one you were slamming that day, was he?

As for my post above;

It was public, and in my opinion the need of a public apology would also be in order, to even start to clear this up. Not from just Kelli to Rich, but to all of the others that were slain in that discussion. Just my opinion on how it could be on the way to start healing that fester. So if they want to make their wrong doings right, heres their chance to show some sign of good faith.

I never said it would fix it. There have been a bunch of people here that have been hurt by this. I can not, nor will not, speak for them. All I stated was this COULD be a way.

Kelli, I also noticed how the original link that to that discussion about the bashing now leads to a nice thread. Yes, this is the link that went to that thread. One would think it would be a dead link. How nice!!
http://www.geckoforums.net/showthread.php?t=73

 

[shrap]

Lets look at the FACTS Bobby Hill and others. Kelli and PAUL came back and POLITELY and RESPECTFULLY asked that their personal forums be removed. If Rich would have shown some class and simply deleted them like he did him Jim O's personal forum we wouldnt be in this ugly situation now.

I asked this of Rich earlier and did not get a reply so I will ask again.... Honestly, lets say me or lucille or John Doe had a forum of their own here and decided they didnt want it up anymore. Would you HONESTLY tell us that it HAS to stay up? HONESTLY?

 

[shrap]

Also Bobby Hill and others who seem to think that they are owed an apology because people said how they HONESTLY felt..... give me a break and grow up. Not everyone in the world is going to like one another and I will be damned if I will ever apologize for saying how I HONESTLY feel about anyone or anything.

 

[varnyard]

Lets look at the FACTS Bobby Hill and others. Kelli and PAUL came back and POLITELY and RESPECTFULLY asked that their personal forums be removed. If Rich would have shown some class and simply deleted them like he did him Jim O's personal forum we wouldnt be in this ugly situation now.

I asked this of Rich earlier and did not get a reply so I will ask again.... Honestly, lets say me or lucille or John Doe had a forum of their own here and decided they didnt want it up anymore. Would you HONESTLY tell us that it HAS to stay up? HONESTLY?

Facts? Sammy, the fact of the matter is they asked for them forums, well they got them. Now they want them removed, I might add with all of thier attachments on this site. It is Rich's choice if he wants to do that. Thier actions IMO, show they are not worthy of any requests. If it is given, it would be a gift.

As for lack of class, thats funny, looking back on that screen shot of Kelli's old site. Yes, Kelli and Paul showed all kind of class on that one.

 

[varnyard]

Also Bobby Hill and others who seem to think that they are owed an apology because people said how they HONESTLY felt..... give me a break and grow up. Not everyone in the world is going to like one another and I will be damned if I will ever apologize for saying how I HONESTLY feel about anyone or anything.

Your right Sammy, It was HONEST, Honest back biting. Well at least we see were you are going with this, as well as were you stand.