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Ken of Exotic Pets in Las Vegas*BAD*

Bobby,
I think we are all wasting our time with you.
I guess you just don't get it.You should not of shipped those animals with out an insulated box and a ice pack.Also plastic containers hold the heat in.You should have used cloth bags.
It is sad when people wont admit when they make a mistake.


Chris Reimann

Gila Ranch
PO Box 307
Comfort,Tx.
78013

www.gilaranch.com
 
"WE WILL NEVER KNOW HOW MY SHIPPING IS SINCE KEN WASNT THERE IN THE MORNING TO GET THE BOX."

Bobby,

That stement above is not true. We will never know whether the snakes were alive at the first delivery attempt since Ken wasn't there to receive it, but we do know that your shipping was sub-standard on this deal. You cannot ship snakes anywhere in the continental US during the summer without styrofoam insulation and cold packs without running the risk of the animals getting fried during shipment.

Quite frankly, to say otherwise would merely make you look ignorant or uncaring. Neither characteristic is particularly appealing to would-be buyers. Therefore, I would not recommend your continuing to try to justify your packaging on this shipment.

You two may yet be able to work something out, but you really need to drop the "I bear no responsibility for this" routine, Bobby. It only makes you look silly when it is obvious to those who have ever shipped snakes that you did not ship these animals properly.
 
WE WILL NEVER KNOW HOW MY SHIPPING IS SINCE KEN WASNT THERE IN THE MORNING TO GET THE BOX.
Click to expand...

Bobby,

I don't know Ken nor you. Reptiles should be shipped in styrofoam-lined cardboard boxes, period. No matter what the outside temperature is. Even when there is no need for a heat or a cold pack. You need to avoid temperature fluctuations that could not only kill but get a reptile sick. Once they leave your place you have no control whatsoever on what might go wrong. Having said this, we know how your shipping was. Hope this experience serves at least the purpose of modifying your shipping practices.

Regards,
 
Now if Bobby would just grow up a bit and admit some guilt... Something he has thus far refused to do despite the common consensus and something he never did on the other threads where he was clearly at fault (The snow boa thread for example)... Perhaps approach Ken in a polite and apologetic manner... Then maybe he could work out something so that his loss is not as severe as his own actions have thus far made it.
Click to expand...

Perhaps if you knew about all the things you post we would all be better off. I admitted to stating the snow boa was light sensative and indeed it was blind. I took the snake back and return Randys boas PLUS an albino boa for his trouble. I was to get the vet report if youj read that far. I didnt and the snake ended up dieing from a flagel OD done by Randy or his vet which ever one injected the boa. Get your facts right before running your mouth please.
 
Gila Ranch said:
Bobby,
I think we are all wasting our time with you.
I guess you just don't get it.You should not of shipped those animals with out an insulated box and a ice pack.Also plastic containers hold the heat in.You should have used cloth bags.
It is sad when people wont admit when they make a mistake.


Chris Reimann

Gila Ranch
PO Box 307
Comfort,Tx.
78013

www.gilaranch.com
Click to expand...

It sure is including your friend of many years Ken for NOT being there to get them.
 
Am I a friend of Ken?

Yes, I openly admitted that as did Seamus.

Does this make me incapable of looking at this situation without bias?

Probably not, but I like to think I can evaluate a set of facts and come to some conclusions that are unbiased. So for you to simply dismiss all of our statements because some of us are friends of Ken is simply ducking the blame.


Lets turn this around and ask why you seem to refuse to ask the many questions that have been asked of your actions. Namely

1. Did you inform Ken that the snakes would be arriving so early in the day? If so, lets see the email.
2. Why did you not give Ken the opportunity to respond to your email to him asking how the situation was going to be resolved before coming here to start this thread?

There are many more questions other people have posted that you have conveniently skipped over without answering. Why is that? Do they paint your actions the wrong way?

Lastly, the logic you use to suggest that if the snakes had been alive at the first delivery attempt (impossible to know) shows that your shipping practices (no insulation) are in fact suitable is severely lacking in common sense. To continue to be obstinate about your correctness on this point is simply illogical and hard headed.
 
Bobby,

This is getting a little ridiculous. Are you going to admit partial fault on this, or not? Are you going to admit you did not package those animals properly, or not? Are you going to jump out of "finger pointing mode," or not?

If you do, I think Ken may be willing to work something out with you (based only upon his previous post . . .I don't know either or you, personally). If you don't, not only will Ken likely tell you to get lost, but you will have suffered a far greater loss in reputation value than the value of those two snakes could have ever been.
 
Is it just me?

I am getting confused and run down just following this conversation.

Each side has a good point and each side has mistakes...

Lets call it a truce and give it a few hours.. calm down and let the 2 talk it out between them. Adding fuel to the flame is not helping.

Should the box have been better packed.. I think so..

Should there have been someone there to get the box.. I think so

Should the shipper tell the buyer when to expect the box.. I think so..

I would also think the buyer would be as responsible to use the tracking number to verify if all is well and on timeand be there or make arrangements for proper pickup. How can the shipper control the buyers whereabouts? That is a good trick...


There are many things that could have or should have etc.. We are grown ups here and we should let this be a grown up conversatoin. Let them work it out and then update us as to what has happened. I believe they both know partial blame should fall on them.. how much.. that I dont know. But very rarely is a deal perfect.. this time the things that may not have been a problem in the past, caught up to both of them and the unfortunate happened. Each side has a few things that could be better next time.. lets all take it for what it is worth and let them handle it between them.

Oh yea.. was this entire thread started too soon? I think maybe it was, time for a good dinner and a relaxing hour and then try the meeting of the minds again.

Thanks all....

Shawn Morelan
www.SouthernBoids.com

P.S. what do I have to do with any of this? I dont know.. I was just reading and felt like you all may need a ref.. I dont know either of them nor have I purchased from them. Why am I hear again.. ?
 
well?well?

just ftr i dont know nor have ever done business w/ken,or seamus so get that outta your head bobbypruett,as i stated in my first post it is my opinion your idiocy caused those snakes deaths,and this board has again served its purpose in that"give them the rope"and folks like you will hang themselves,,,pretty sad really,,,, thomas davis T&S reptile farm
 
P.S.

Just so all involved knows I have never met nor dealt with Ken or Bobby before. What amazes me is that the facts I stated are truly simple, ( Refer to my previous post on page 4 ) Bobby, you are largely at fault here, and its not just Kens "friends" who are telling you this. Why cant you just admit ( to yourself at the very least ) That the way you shipped them could have played a large part in their deaths? And then move on to coming to a mutual agreement with Ken. And hopefuly learn a lesson as to the way you ship in the future. It seems to me that would be a much more beneficial way to proceed at this point. I truly think if you just take a minute to consider everything involved, then realize the facts, then talk with Ken with the knowledge that he is not the one mostly at fault here then I think this could be resolved as Ken seems to be more than willing to work this out. If you think about it, you will see that is a much better way to go than what is happening right now. I do not know you nor Ken, and I do not necesarily belive either of you are "bad guys". But I would think with all the feedback that agrees with what I have said you would be a bit more willing to realize the facts we have stated. I am looking at this from a unbiased outside view and everything I have stated is just MY opinion. Thank you
 
Bobby-Ive read all the posts and come up with one simple question.
Can I stuff you inside a plastic barrel within a refrigerator box and have you shipped to New Mexco with nothing to help keep you cool?

The longer I thought about this problem the more pissed I became at how unethical, inhumane, ignorant, arrogant and downright childish your "Business practices" are. For simple fact you put those animals in a portable oven and had the ordasity to blame someone else shows your character. You're lucky those animals werent sent to me, had I found unprotected dead animals in that box youd have been turned in to the humane society, ESPCA and PETA.

Not only did you torture those animals prior to baking them you brag about having done it for ten years! You may like animals and may even love the reptile business but one things for sure you dont have a single concern for their well being. Youre more concerned with gouging Ken for your ignorance than stepping back to look at your own inhumane practice.

Every single breeder, dealer and reptile enthusiast uses styrofoam boxes...why do you think that is?

As soon as you taped that box closed without foam or cold pack and shipped living creatures in that heat you sealed your fate as a vendor.

Someone posted a warning "Bobby Pruett bad business" all over Kingsnake several weeks ago, with advertising like that and you rushing here to whine and end up screwing yourself....youll be lucky to peddle hamsters at Super Petz.
 
I am curious if an early delivery time was requested since I've never had a package delivered before 9 am unless I specifically requested early am delivery (not saying it's impossible just has not happened to me). If a specific request for Early AM delivery was done then the receiver should have been notified specifically of that fact.
 
The reason, and therefore the blame, that these snakes arrived dead hinges on two points

1. Were they properly packaged
2. was the receiver made aware they were to arrive before 9 am.

Obviously they were not packaged properly, but you might be able to argue that they were still alive at the first delivery attempt. If, however, Ken was not made aware that they were going to be delivered early I do not see how he can be blamed for any part of this mess. No you cannot force someone to be there to receive a package, but you also cannot expect him to be there when he does not know the package is coming. His only culpability would be that he had a tracking number that he did not use. IMO this is a weak arguement though since to expect the receiver to call ahead of time just in case something is late or to update himself on the status of a package he expects to receive at a later time is ridiculous.

Further, and correct me if I am wrong, but I do not think that when you look up a package by the tracking number that the information provided includes the intended delivery time. All it states is the points where the package has already been transported to in transit to the final destination. Therefore, whether or not Ken used the tracking number he still would not have known the package was arriving early.

IMO this whole thing boils down to one question; Did Bobby tell Ken that the package was going to arrive before 9 am? Well?
 
Seamus Haley, I noticed that Ken is a friend of yours. When I stated it was 8:14 that was his time, it was 11:14pm my time. Really no need for name calling. I understand alot of you have had good dealing with him. My shipping methods have worked for years so I know for a fact that would not have been a problem had the box been recieved when they tried to deliver it in the morning.
Click to expand...

Well, I personally have no stake in this, and I have to agree that you're dead wrong with your reasoning, Bobby. Your method of packing in this situation was nothing short of negligent. "This method has worked for me for years" is not a testament to its effectiveness, but rather to an extreme streak of good luck.

That being said, Ken also bears some fault here. Fed Ex, UPS, and Airborne do not guarantee the package to be delivered at a certain time, but rather by a certain time. That means that the possible window for delivery is several hours. If you're expecting a package, you need to ensure that someone is there to receive it, even if that means you have to take time off work.

Now then, there's no way of knowing when the snakes actually died, but I do feel that both parties should share culpability for this situation, as neither one is without fault. The actions of both Bobby and Ken could easily result in a DOA independant of one another.
 
Just so you know, with temps in the 60's and 70's here where I live I could have left them outside for 24hrs before pickup and they would have been fine.
Click to expand...
Hello! It's Las Vegas - in mid July - no insulator... Go figure!!!
If the box would have not been delivered until 1pm his time that would have been on me. BUT, it was there at 8am and he wasnt, so thats on him.
Click to expand...
Bobby, with your 13 years of experience, how many time that your order delivered before 9:00 a.m.? Be real, do you expect that your order will be there by 8:45 a.m.? If you do, why didn't you notify Ken in advance?
And just for clarification, I don't know and have not do business with Ken. However, after reading the post, I have add his name to my "buy" list, and your name to my "bad list."
 
There is one point that keeps getting repeated over and over again that I would like to address. Before Ii do however I would like to say that I do not know either party at all and am therefore completely unbiased.

Bobby, defending your shipping techniques by saying you have been using them successfully for 13 years is like saying you have played Russian Roullette dozens of times and not been shot.....It's just plain ridiculous. There is now way to defend it so quit trying. It was shoddy and substandard at the very least and criminally negligent by most shipper's standards

That said, the point I would like to address is that everyone keeps asking why Bobby did not warn Ken that the animals would arrive that early. I am guessing that most of you who are asking do not ship much or at all. The reason he did not warn him is because he didn't have any idea.

UPS next day guarantees delivery by 10:30 at the latest...Period. That means the animals can arrive anytime before that. I have had priority shipments arrive as early as 8:00 at residential addresses. If Ken does get even periodic shipments from UPS he knows that they deliver to businesses first and residential addresssees first. Someone should have been at whatever address the animals were going to to accept them, no ifs ands or buts. If the animals had arrived at 1:00 packaged properly but still dead from the heat, who would we be blaming this on?

My thoughts are that the blame is running about 75/25 on this one. I would say there was some possibility the animals were still alive at the first delivery attempt. If I were in Ken's shoes, I would probably offer Bobby a 25 or 30 percent discount on the animals if he wants to purchase them. More than that I think is above and beyond.

The only other comment I have is that posting like this before giving the other party a chance to respond on his own genuinely sucks. I think you (Bobby) have damaged yourself more by jumping the gun than by anything else
 
Styrofoam holds in heat??

The styrophome also holds heat in a box which is why I dont use it.
Click to expand...
I knew something was bothering me....

Bobby, you can't possibly believe that? Styrofoam holds the heat in? Heat from where? They make COOLERS out of styrofoam. It provides protection from the outside temperature. It will only "hold the heat in" if the box was hot to start with.
 
I don't get it

Why all the blah blah blah
The snakes were shipped improperly plain and simple, its also a good chance that they could have been dead at 8.45 , what did someone say the temp was at 9 am...?...90 something still to hot for some animals packaged that way...what would the temp be that night?? high 70's or low 80's??? stressed and thirsty snakes all ready...the chance of them making it there alive are not good.
Review your shipping methods Bobby, luck only lasted so far
Seamus ....make sure I never pi$$ you off at me:uzi:
 
Suncoast

I was saying 75 to 85% and 15 to 25% But I agree with you totally, If Ken offered a deal of 25% off I would have to say he is totally in the right in doing so and Bobby (should) gracefuly accept. Not to say that will happen but it sure would be nice if it did. Thank you
 
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