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lemon creme x killer bee

K

kalerway2019

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the male is the lemon creme (lemonback x vanilla) female is killer bee (super pastel x spider) clutch size was 8 eggs and out of the 8 eggs only 1 hatched. we had a few problems with maternally incubating. my question is that i need help identifying what genes are in this beautiful combo. my guess is lemonback, vanilla, and pastel. please can anyone help?
 

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I haven't seen many lemonback combos, but I believe it's similar to the fire gene. To me it looks like lemonback, vanilla, pastel. Mabe super pastel. How much of a difference between the baby & father? Good luck!
Chris
B and S Pythons/Facebook
 
It can't be both lemonback and vanilla, it is one or the other. Lemonback and vanilla are allelic, meaning they are on the same locus. That means that if both genes are displayed in one parent, and the other parent has neither, all of the babies will be either lemonback or vanilla. None will be normal, none will be both. It is essentially the same as breeding a super pastel to a normal, in that no normals or super pastels will be produced, only pastels. In order to produce an animal that has both lemonback and vanilla, one gene needs to come from each parent, not both from one. I hope I have explained this well enough. That being said, your animal is definitely either a lemonback pastel or a vanilla pastel. Also, again, it can't be a super pastel, you need to have two parents carrying the pastel gene to produce that.
 
I don't see how that in any way disproves what I have just said. Yes, a lemon creme is a contains one copy each of the lemonback and vanilla genes. But it is not like a bumblebee, that can reproduce itself when bred to an animal without those genes. The genes are on the same locus. A single animal can only pass on one of those genes. I'm sorry if I'm not explaining this well enough, but the pairing you describe simply can not produce an animal with both the lemonback and vanilla genes. And, similarly, cannot produce a super pastel.
 
I'm not saying lemon cremes don't exist lol. I'm just saying you can't have produced one with the pairing you describe. I don't think you understand what I'm trying to say.
 
Sorry Guys, I'm new to using the IMG links. The posted pics are the father at about 4 months old and then around breeding age. And before you ask, he had a really nasty poop and required a rinse.
 
I think you make sense, however I am lost at what the actual baby is then, because it looks like nothing that I would have expected from the combo.

I did put it in the morph generator and it wasn't a match either. What do you see. Do you not feel that the father is a Lemonback Vanilla combo then?
 
elena said:
I'm not saying lemon cremes don't exist lol. I'm just saying you can't have produced one with the pairing you describe. I don't think you understand what I'm trying to say.
Click to expand...

I didn't say that I did lol. I asked what I DID produce because it is not anything I am familiar with ;)
 
Percent Fraction Genes
12.5 % 1/8 Pastel (Pastel Jungle)
12.5 % 1/8 Pastel Vanilla
12.5 % 1/8 Lemonfly (Lemonback Pastel)
12.5 % 1/8 Pastel Spider (Bumble Bee)
12.5 % 1/8 Lemonback (PE Fire line) Vanilla Pastel (Pastel Jungle)
12.5 % 1/8 Lemonback Bumble Bee (Lemonback Spider Pastel)
12.5 % 1/8 Bumble Bee Vanilla (Pastel Spider Vanilla)
12.5 % 1/8 Lemonback (PE Fire line) Vanilla Spider Pastel (Pastel Jungle)

would the Lemonback Vanilla Pastel be a pastel lemoncream?
 
Some possibilities that would explain the exceptional appearance of the hatchling:
1) One or both parents have additional genes that you don't know about.
2) The hatchling is "just" a vanilla pastel or lemonback pastel, but is outstanding in appearance.

The only real way to figure this out is to raise up the hatchling and breed it out. I'd suggest pairing it with a lemonback with no other genes and see what happens. You may also consider contacting the breeder(s) that produced the parents, to see if there was any possibility of additional genes being at work.
 
The male is LEMON BACK VANILLA and the female is a SUPER PASTEL SPIDER
put those in in the genetic wizard and walah! LEMON BACK VANILLA AND PASTEL is posible! All I would like to know is what other people think the genes are in this snake not to try and prove someone wrong
 
The percentage breakdown you showed is not accurate for this pairing. It would be if lemonback and vanilla are on seperate loci, but they are not. Most if not all morph calculators are not sophisticated enough to adjust their formula for compatible co-dominant genes.

Real breakdown:

25% pastel lemonback
25% pastel vanilla
25% pastel lemonback spider
25% pastel vanilla spider

As you see, no cremes.
 
No, I'm just saying that it is flawed. Most morph calculators were created before compatible co-doms came on the scene and have not been updated to accommodate for them.
 
Another way I know you're wrong because whenever I cut the eggs that were bad the pattern was there and some of the coloration and I had more than four different snakes I can prove that to if you would like
 
I give up, believe what you want. It's sad that you spent money on a morph without doing the research to understand how the genetics work. People like you are one of the reasons why it is so hard to trust what "breeders" say the genetics of their animals are. Just do me a favor, when you list your animal for sale, whatever you decide to call it, list the pairing too so people with more knowledge than you can make up their own minds about what your animal may or may not be.
 
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