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Length of guarantees?

Ed Clark

Ed Clark

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Would like to hear from other breeders the length of guarantees they offer.

Especially the lenght of a correct sex guarantee, I guarantee correct sex for 30 days.

Do any of you guys guarantee correct sex past the 1 year mark?

Thanks for any input. :)
 
AFTERNOON ED WHEN YOU SAY PAST THE ONE YEAR MARK YOU MEAN THAT THE BUYER HAS HAD AND KEPT THE REPTILE FOR A YEAR OR LONGER CORRECT. SOMEONE BUYING A BEARDIE FOR A YEAR AND NOT NOTICING THAT THEIR HE IS A SHE OR THEIR SHE IS A HE WOULD BE KIND OF TUFF. i JUST HAD ONE THE OTHER DAY THAT I PURCHASED 6 WEEKS AGO. IT WAS SUPPOSED TO HAVE BEEN A HE AND TURNED OUT TO BE A SHE. SHE'S ABOUT 3 MONTH OLD NOW AND ITS CLEAR AS DAY SHE IS A SHE. PLUS AT THAT POINT WHAT WOULD YOU EXCHANGE IT WITH ANOTHER ADULT OR CASH WOULD BE IT. i THINK 3-4 MONTHS OF AGE IS MORE THEN ENOUGH.

AS FOR HEALTH GUARANTEE ITS ALWAYS TUFF TO MAKE A CALL. I HAD A SITUATION A FEW WEEKS BACK WHERE I ALSO POSTED ASKING FOR HELP. I HAD SOMEONE PURCHASE SEVERAL DRAGONS OF DIFFERENT MORPHS AND GENTICS. AND WITHIN 2 WEEKS HE CALLED ME SAYING ALL HAD DIED. i COULDN'T UNDERSTAND HOW ALL OF HIS DIED SO QUICKLY. AND YET I STILL HAVE 11 OF THOSE SAME CLUTCH MATES AT MY HOME ALL DOING GREAT EATING WELL AND ALL. HE COULDN'T EVEN SAY THAT I GAVE HIM SICKLINGS CAUSE I LET HIM PICK FROM EACH CLUTCH.
 
Talking about sexes of snakes, but this can be applied to any animal sold. I feel that a 30 day guarantee is more than enought time to give a buyer to double check or confirm that indeed they recieved the correct sex.

Should the correct sex guarantee be a life long guarantee to everyone that purchases that same snake down the line?
 
IF YOU DID SUCH A THING YOU WOULD BE SETTING YOUR SELF UP FOR A LONG LIFE TIME OF ADDITIONAL WORK. YOU WOULD HAVE TO KEEP TRACK OF SO MANY ANIMALS JUST TO KEEP AWAY FROM ANYONE ATTEMPTING TO COME UP WITH A FREE EXCHANGE OR MONEY BACK. 30 DAYS IS ENOUGH, OF COURSE IT WOULD VERY JUST A BIT WITH THE AGE OF A REPTILE EVEN SNAKES ( BY THE WAY SORRY FOR THAT I ALWAYS SEE YOU ON THE DRAGONS SIDE.) LOL BACK ON TOPIC. IF ITS A 3-6 MONTH OLD REPTILE, SEX SHOULD BE WELL DEFINED AND 30 DAYS IS JUST REASSURANCE FOR THEM.
 
I think that a 30 day guarantee to the original buyer is fair.

My thoughts are that someone wanting guarantees years after the sale are unreasonable especially them not being the original buyer.

I'm just kickin it around trying to be fair.
 
THEM NOT BEING THE ORIGINAL BUYER MAKES IT THAT MUCH WORSE. yOUR 30 DAY SEXING GUARANTEE IS FAIR AND I'V SEEN IT ON YOUR POSTS. IT ONLY TOOK ME 2 WEEKS TO NOTICE MINE WAS A SHE AND NOT A HE
 
IMO, guarantees are for the person that makes the purchase.
A gender guarantee can easily hold arguments on both sides (limited and unlimited time frame), simply because the gender of the animal is not going to change...however, numerous circumstances can make replacement a year (or more) down the road difficult; and trying to assess value for cash refunds can get downright ugly (most of us have seen cases on the BOI where people find out they've got a male & think they're entitled to full retail value of an adult female PLUS what they could have made from the babies that now aren't going to happen). Heck, a year later, a breeder might not even be working with a given species or morph,

I can't deny that I have occasionally neglected to confirm the gender of snakes I've received in a timely manner, and found out at some point in the future (usually during breeding season) that a mistake was made. I may have contacted the sellers to let them know, but I didn't seek any form of compensation...at that point, I just acknowledged that I was a dumbass for not checking sooner.
 
EXACTLY MY POINT I MADE THE SAME MISTAKE BUT WITH A DRAGON. i DIDN'T SEEK ANY KIND OF COMPANSATION EITHER, JUST REALIZED THAT I BETTER FIND THE ONE THAT I DID WANT AND SOON BEFORE I GET STUCK OUT OF LUCK LATER.
 
hhmoore said:
I can't deny that I have occasionally neglected to confirm the gender of snakes I've received in a timely manner, and found out at some point in the future (usually during breeding season) that a mistake was made. I may have contacted the sellers to let them know, but I didn't seek any form of compensation...at that point, I just acknowledged that I was a dumbass for not checking sooner.
Click to expand...

O yea, have had that same thing happen from a few of the biggest names in the BP and Boa world. usually at that point I just start thinking what can I breed the boy to that I thought was a girl. :)
 
I do NOT have a cap on the length of time someone can claim their guarantee for correct sexing. However, they are entitled to a full refund, or an available animal of the correct sex, after returning the animal at our expense. I will probably clarify this to "an available animal of the same price as the one purchased". I would not accept trying to produce the current value of an animal they have kept for several years, but I would certainly give them back what they paid, if they wish it. I don't think there is an expiration date on miss-sexing an animal, but at the same time, they will bear some of the liability if they don't confirm the sex when they receive it, or mis-sex it themselves when they receive it. So far, I have not miss-sexed any animals I have sold, knock on wood.
 
Per my guarantee, if they return the snake to me, they will get their money back, or they can choose an available snake of the correct gender, age and morph--if none are available, their only option is money back. Not current market value, but what was originally paid for the animal.
I'll gladly take the animal back 3 years later, under those terms, yes. Even 20 years later. I made a mistake, after all. It's a pretty big mistake. <lol>
I'm registering my animals in the iHerp database now, so gender is on record publically.
 
Donna, heres another twist.

How about if that snake was injured so badly it had to go to a vet and be sewed up?
 
how long ago did it get injured. You have 2 problems one the original owner no longer has it, so they aren't even the ones making the claim anymore. Second being the animal now has sever injuries.
 
ace9916 said:
how long ago did it get injured. You have 2 problems one the original owner no longer has it, so they aren't even the ones making the claim anymore. Second being the animal now has sever injuries.
Click to expand...

Injury happened with the second owner, seems to be not so long ago that happened. I have asked for more information.
 
I realize sex never changes, but there comes a point when a buyer must assume some responsibility of their own. I would try to work with one of my customers even a year down the road to make them happy, but I don't feel I'm ethically required to after that length of time.
The buyer should take steps to ensure the sex of the animal is correct within a reasonable amount of time. We're not talking about a genetics guarantee where it requires two to three years before it can be known.

Once my customer sells the animal however, I consider my obligations fulfilled period. You can't even guarantee fully that it's the same snake at this point.
The injuries further enforce the situation.

I will make this disclaimer about my statements though. We are only hearing parts of the story as you decide to add them, a tid bit here, a what if there. We do not know the entire situation so my comments are based only on what has been said so far and the way I interpret those semi vague aspects of a hypothetical deal.
I know this isn't the BOI, so you don't want to name names here, but you could have just laid out the situation in full from the start so others could make a real assessment and comment accordingly.
 
Clay Davenport said:
We are only hearing parts of the story as you decide to add them, a tid bit here, a what if there. We do not know the entire situation so my comments are based only on what has been said so far and the way I interpret those semi vague aspects of a hypothetical deal.
I know this isn't the BOI, so you don't want to name names here, but you could have just laid out the situation in full from the start so others could make a real assessment and comment accordingly.
Click to expand...

No I do not want to name names.

I was recently contacted by someone I had sold a BP to years ago, he said it was 3 years ago. he recently sold the BP to someone else.

There was a mishap and the BP had to go to a vet to be sutured for an injury by the new owner of the BP. while there the new owner asked to have the BP sexed, the vet thought female at first then said the hemipenes were folded over and said it was a male.

The new owner was understandably upset finding out his girl was a boy.he called me making demands for another female the same age and size of what he just bought from someone else. he also suggested how many other morphs he would accept.

This thread was posted to try to get a feel of what others would do in a situation like this.

My concerns about this is someone asking me to guarantee something that he purchased from someone else and of course an injured BP.
 
You make a great point we do only know bits and peaces. But Ed has the time and injury issues on his side. If the snake was severly injured, and its been 3 years since it was first sold, and the original owner no longer owns it. How can you give a guarranty on that anymore. When did they file their claim before or after the injury, and what caused it.
 
Well, you are giving me ideas on how to amend my guarantees. <lol> To answer, no--they would have to return the animal in GOOD HEALTH to receive a refund/exchange. I'll be adding that part in today.

I also require photographic proof of the correct gender, and if I get it back and it turns out to be the gender I said it was, they don't get their refund, and they have to pay the shipping expenses. That part's already in there.
 
Ed Clark said:
No I do not want to name names.

I was recently contacted by someone I had sold a BP to years ago, he said it was 3 years ago. he recently sold the BP to someone else.

There was a mishap and the BP had to go to a vet to be sutured for an injury by the new owner of the BP. while there the new owner asked to have the BP sexed, the vet thought female at first then said the hemipenes were folded over and said it was a male.

The new owner was understandably upset finding out his girl was a boy.he called me making demands for another female the same age and size of what he just bought from someone else. he also suggested how many other morphs he would accept.

This thread was posted to try to get a feel of what others would do in a situation like this.

My concerns about this is someone asking me to guarantee something that he purchased from someone else and of course an injured BP.
Click to expand...

I'll tell it like it is Ed. I'm not a fan of yours, that's no secret. However, I take the side of what is right and fair to me regardless of who is involved.
If this situation occurred the way you have outlined here, then I say you have no obligation whatsoever to this second hand owner and if it was brought to the BOI, I would say exactly that.
If you sold a missexed snake, then yes, you made a mistake. However, after three years the buyer has had ample opportunity to verify the sex before selling it. The seller in any transaction takes on the responsibility of any guarantees in my opinion.

I've been in a similar situation due to my own negligence in verifying the sex of a snake I bought. When the person I sold it to told me of the mistake, my only action was to offer a full refund myself, not to send them to the person I bought the snake from. To do that is just ridiculous.
 
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