Let's Talk Pits...

[Rob Hill/Geckos Anonymous]

Pituophis that is

I am not a big-time Pituophis keeper(only have one right now, who is awesome), but since these snakes seem to be one of the most overlooked and underappreciated of the colubrids, I thought I would put up a poll to see which of these loud snakes are crowd favorites.

And I apologize in advance if I leave any species/subspecies out as I am not super familiar with all of the different ones.

Anyway, please vote and post some comments as to why that particular one is your favorite.

And oh yeah, my favorite is the Northern Pine. Nothing can beat a beautiful black and white Northern(of course I don't HAVE one yet, but if anyone knows where I might track one down ). But of course the Black Pines are just great in their own right.

 

[BrianB]

Loud snakes? That got my attention.

I don't have any. My only colubrid is Steve the passive-agressive apricot pueblan.

 

[Rob Hill/Geckos Anonymous]

Brian, they are probably the loudest and most "vocal" group of snakes out there. Big time bluff artists. They will raise up off the ground and emmit the loudest hiss you've ever heard. Mouths open the whole time. And when they strike is the coolest thing. Just before hitting you(most, but not ALL) will close their mouth and "punch" you. I know it sounds goofy, but trust me, I've gotten welts and bruises from large southerns and northerns before and it hurts. But of course there are those that will just flat out bite, and that hurts too. lol

 

[Charlie McCullough]

Loud snakes? That got my attention.

I don't have any. My only colubrid is Steve the passive-agressive apricot pueblan.

Yeah....they can be loud. And intimidating. An adult Bullsnake in full defensive mode can be a VERY intimidating animal. The wife calls one of my more "vocal" ones "Son of Satan" - I say he's just misunderstood, LOL.

But Bulls tend to calm pretty quickly/easily whether WC or CB. It's been a year since I've even gotten a tail buzz outta my biggest Bull.

I have a small collection (usually about 8-10 animals) and they're all Pits (Bulls and Sonoran Gophers) except for a solitary milk.

The Sonoran's, IMHO, tend to have a more varied temperment. Everything from laid back to extremely feisty/grumpy. I have some that I've never heard hiss and I have 1 that is just as quick to strike (and BITE - not "head-butt") as when I got him.

Dunno why Pits aren't as plentiful/popular as other colubrids in the trade....though I suspect some of it is due to their (largely undeserved) grumpy/nervous reputation. They're also not as blessed (cursed?) with color as the milks/kings/corns so they aren't as "eye catching" as the others when young (talking about "normals" here - not the albino's/amels/aneuy's/Hypo's/etc) and sittin' on the vendors tables at expos/shows/etc. That along with their larg(er) size tends to make 'em less appealing than the others.

A real shame (though perhaps a blessing in disguise as they tend to make dull/ugly looking hybrids so the "designer breeders" tend not to work with 'em). Wonderful, addictive animals. Easy to care for. And just enough of that "prickly" attitude to keep things from getting too dull........

 

[Charlie McCullough]

Anyway, please vote and post some comments as to why that particular one is your favorite.

And oh yeah, my favorite is the Northern Pine. Nothing can beat a beautiful black and white Northern.... But of course the Black Pines are just great in their own right.

I like the Pines. Unfortunately, in my state, Northern/Southern Pines are illegal to own/collect. I've been looking for just the right pair of Black Pines but haven't found EXACTLY what I'm looking for (I'll know when I see 'em).
But these pale (IMHO) compared to the "Red Bulls" that a few pit breeders have been coming up with lately. Not a hypo or other genetic variant but a screamin' red "normal" patterned Bull. Finding an outstanding pair (or even a single one) of these is my current interest.

 

[dave7739]

I just got my first pit this week. She is an incredible looking deppei deppei she is just starting to color up. She hisses a little but is pretty mellow when I pick her up

 

[Rob Hill/Geckos Anonymous]

Charlie, they are illegal here where I live too, probably just a few miles from you.lol However, I am working on getting my permits for indigenous non-venomous so I can keep a few of the nifty native snakes here in GA.

But I will agree with you that the red bulls are pretty impressive, however I do have to say that outside of the northern and black pine, a nice light colored normal bull is hard to beat

 

[Charlie McCullough]

s... However, I am working on getting my permits for indigenous non-venomous
..... however I do have to say that outside of the northern and black pine, a nice light colored normal bull is hard to beat

Yep. Love the "normals". I have a long term breeding project with a trio of triple-het Sonorans (actually only a pair - the third is an unknown WC female). Hope to get maybe a nice Hypo out of 'em in a few years but any lbino/amels/anys I get out of 'em I'll 'prolly have a clearance sale/giveaway on 'em - the non-"normals" just don't hold my interest much. Would rather have a room full of plain 'ol brown/tan Bulls than a single outstanding genetic variant that's all the rage these days. Just weird that way I guess, LOL.

BTW, you aren't the "Rob" with the gecko's at the Ga Herp Soc meeting last month up at Lanier Museum are you? If you are, I was the audience you were talking to (big turnout). <G>

 

[Rob Hill/Geckos Anonymous]

Charlie,

LOL that's me. I'd like to thank everyone for attending, so thank you Charlie, aka everyone. lol

And I'll be perfectly honest, I think all albino Pits are butt ugly with the exception of albino San Diego gophers, that is. Those are nice, but otherwise the rest are not very inviting to me. I'll take the normal Pits anyday!

 

[Charlie McCullough]

I just got my first pit this week. She is an incredible looking deppei deppei she is just starting to color up. She hisses a little but is pretty mellow when I pick her up

The deppei are nice - both d. deppei and d. jani. I've thought about getting a d.jani one 'o these days - not real common in collections (or breeders).
'Prolly more color in the deppei than most of the other pits but a little harder to find than some. Where'd you get yours?

If you like some color, you should also look at Cape Gophers. Nice brilliant reds - but *warning* they have a rep for being one of the fiestier ssp of pits - real biters, not bluffers. But they sure are 'purdy.

 

[BrianB]

Re: Loud...

That sounds like a fun snake. =) The milk has head-butted me a couple times when I startled him, so I know what you're saying there. I've seen some really pretty pine and bull snakes on breeders' sites. I might have to put those on my "one of these days I'm going to figure out how to talk my girlfriend into getting one" list. So far, I've only got her sold on the boas, she's not a big fan of colubrids.

 

[HerpMasters Inc.]

bullsnakes

I think the bullsnakes are the best. I have a pair now that are awesome. The male is close to 7 foot and when out of the cage very tame. In the cage is another story. The female is close to 5 foot and I hope they will breed this year. He is a normal bull with normal coloring. She is a normal but has very light markings. Both will rattle their tales and get up and hiss at you if you approach their cage but once you get them out and *call their bluff* they settle down and like to roam around.

 

[PitFiend]

Pits are indeed a wonderful snake...

I currently only have one in my collection, a female Northern Pine... but my wife and I are planning on adding a Durango Mountain Gopher and Mexican Pine this year.

My female is 8 months old around 32 inches long and completely calm and mellow. I have taken 2 closed mouth hits from her in the past but she has mellowed nicely.

I seriuosly do not understand why Pits are not more popular... I know that the fancier morphs/phases of the Kings, Corns and Milks plays into it... and yes I own corns and a king

Unpopular or not my girl is definately cool...

Charles...
(Damn I ramble *lol*)

 

[Glenn Bartley]

I like em all but am very pfond of the Sonoran Gopher Snakes. My guess is that this poll is kind of slanted toward Pine Snakes since you listed so many of them and lumped Gophers all as one. Right now I sort of have two Gopher Snakes. BI say sort of because both are loose in the house for about a month or so now. It has been ay too cold for them to venture out and I am hoping the bigger one does not get hungry and go for my wife's mini Dachshund. I know it would not be able to eat it, but the snake is about 5 1/2 to 6 feet long and the dog would be a pretty easy kill for it unless our other dog got protective. Then again it may go for our cat, which would make the wife very happy. Oh well, I'll just have to keep an eye open but the wife is usually the one who finds them.

Best regards,
Glenn

 

[PitFiend]

LMAO

Hate to laugh but the humor is there

As for Gophers... I for one intend on getting atleast one. John at cherryville farms said he should be producing some Striped Durango Moutain Gophers this year and I am definately interested in those as well as normal Durangos...

I have not looked much into sonoran gophers... mayhap something for me to look at

Charles

 

[Charlie McCullough]

BI say sort of because both are loose in the house for about a month or so now. .......Oh well, I'll just have to keep an eye open but the wife is usually the one who finds them.
Best regards,
Glenn

Hehehe.....

I too currently have a Sonoran that's made a bid for freedom. Been loose now since about Christmas. Little hard to find since she's a yearling (approx 24"). Hoping she's found by me and not by the dog. Or the cat. In my case, it was the wife who set her loose - improper closing of cage one evening after a handling session.
Wife no longer allowed near snake cages.........Fortunately still have a 1.1 het pair so breeding project still intact - though this female (being a WC) is/was to help as a cross out for genetic diversity).

 

[DISCERN]

Cool post!!!!!

I was very glad to see this pit site here on Fauna!

Pits are my fave and have been for about 5 years. Here is what I have and who I purchased them from:

1 orange cape and 1 red cape-Vivid
1 Stillwater hypo bull, 1 rusty hypo sonoran, -John Ginter
1 albino northern pine-Wesley Chapel Repiles
1 snow Southern pine-Mark Bell
1 hypo Northern pine ( Alabama locale )-John Meltzer
1 Jersey black and white Northern pine-John Melzter
1 Albino Sonoran
1 White bull
1 Tx Bull het for albino ( large bloodline )-John Cherry
1 Applegate Gopher-Dave Jaques

These snakes have made my hobby much more enjoyable!
I have heard about pits giving attitude, but I have had about 90% success in mine not putting on displays.

What I love about pits is that for me, they have been much more into being handled than other snakes. Most of mine, I can hold for hours in one hand as I relax, chilling out on the couch, etc.

Take care guys!

Billy Fraser

 

[Charlie McCullough]

Re: Cool post!!!!!

Pits are my fave and have been for about 5 years. Here is what I have and who I purchased them from:
<snip>

I have heard about pits giving attitude, but I have had about 90% success in mine not putting on displays.

Nice collection! Ginter and Cherry both seem to produce really nice animals.
For gophers (particularly Sonorans) Jason Nelson at Envy seems to have really nice stock (that's where my 3 came from).

Success NOT putting on display? I think their "grumpiness" sometimes is part of the charm of the species I'm gradually getting a yearling male calmed down though I hope he never completely loses his display (real lovable little prick!) - though I may feel different about it should he get up in the 6-7 ft range as an adult, LOL.......

 

[Glenn Bartley]

As long as it is all display and no teeth sunken into you hand it is usually pretty neat.m They surely can hiss up a storm, I guess that with their fairly impressive size made them a favorite of many a side show snake handler.

 

[Rob Hill/Geckos Anonymous]

Just wanted to let you guys know that I have NO problem with Gophers at all. lol

There are two reasons I lumped the Gophers all together.
1. There are alot of subspecies of Gopher snakes out west. The poll option only has room for 10 choices, so I figured it would be easier to just put the Gophers together. Sorry if anyone thinks I was trying to slight them in any way, as that was totally not the case.
2. Growing up in the southeast, I know Pines MUCH better than I know Gophers. lol As I said, I know there are alot of Gophers out there, but honestly, I don't know them all. lol So instead of REALLY offending someone who might be a big fan of one of the subspecies I have no knowledge of, I figured that lumping them all together would be kind of all inclusive and that discussion would pick up on the ones you guys like. I'm glad to see that it has