mackleopardgeckos.com (Alex-no last name) very questionable even childish behaviour

[leaftail]

But thanks for the info about the new site. I'm going to go over there are register as a verified mack breeder this week. Bought my pair legitimately from Alex and Chris@TSE, so I should have no problems.

 

[shrap]

Dan,

You should really let a sleeping dog lie. If somone dont want you on their site then you dont need to be there. Crying about it aint going to help the situation and trying to use it as a chance to take a shot at someone is really sad and petty.

What were you thinking?

 

[jenn]

And why do you think you were black listed? Do you think that it might have something to do with YOUR childish behavoir. Say like openly bashing on big breeders like Alex, John Mack ect.... And i'm pretty sure that if Jodi would have known that before he started to talk to you about them that talk would have never happend.

As it was stated before this is what is called Karma. So again grow up and move on and just deal with the fact that you are not wanted on that site or any of Alex's sites. So just let it go already.

 

[Chris@TSE]

hell Dan, you're making this easier and easier for those looking to point a finger at you.

Marcia said it best, kudos girl

 

[Wilomn]

dan, you messed up big time. If you didn't, and I personally think you did, then you are getting the messy end of the stick. Stick happens. To avoid sticky sticks in the future be honest.

You need to give this lots of time. You have messed up pretty badly and are just making it worse.

YOU made yourself unwelcome at Alex's registry. He is under NO obligation to allow you in. Get over it, you just didn't think it through.

Take what you can get for your babies. As far as the rest, dude, suck it up. You keep whining and puling and moaning and you'll fast lose any respect anyone has left for you.

 

[groovygeckos]

Its not as much about being banned from the site as it is being banned from being 'verified' . Its BS , anyone can buy and become verified but not me and my mother ?

We are working with the line there is no doubt about that and noone can say otherwise .

Does it matter that Alex was very rude in his reponses to me ?

That is the only reason he was given any rude response in return .

And the ONLY reason he decided to screw me after allready investing in females . Besides the fact he was concerned about my signature on here 'top morphs for less ' .That is what he contacted me with and why he would not sell to me . I never had any intention of pricing any new morph for less than anyone else .

Shouldnt talk to poeple that way they typically get fed up with an attitude VERY quickly . And I let him know it wasnt the way to talk to me .

He could have had Geckos filled with gold and Id still have taken offense and put him in his place . Geckos or no geckos .

Noone was badmouthing Alex or John Mack . Im pretty sure it was posted John was selling for less , and I may have stated how Alex was taking control of the project and jacking up the price . Whos project is it ? Its called the 'Mack Snow' NOT 'Alex` Ego Trip'

 

[dragonflyreptiles]

Dan,

I did not ask you to email me privately and do NOT email me in private again bashing Alex, you are saying that no one badmouthed Alex but the email you sent me last night was full of nothing but a bash fest about Alex that I do not believe or want to read.

I also forwarded the email to Kelli since you made accusations about her and her Mack snow, so you may hear from her as well.

I am still debating on sending it to Alex and posting it here. I will most likely send it to Alex since thats my right but I know private emails being posted are frowned apon here so I am still thinking on that one.

You should have known not to send ME an email that said the things it says seeing that I always have and always will think great things of Alex.

 

[Jim O]

Go ahead and post it Wendy. Once he sends it out, it's no longer "private" and it's your right to publish it.

 

[dragonflyreptiles]

The main reason I didn't is because of the statement he made about Kelli. I have sent it to her.

Can I post it and just put xxxxxxx where he made a statement about Kelli?

 

[Chris@TSE]

Can I post it and just put xxxxxxx where he made a statement about Kelli?

I'd probably censor it if needed, but I do not see why protecting the truth of his actions and words would be needed...

Unless Dan has again shoved his foot too far into his mouth.

Dan, stop it. You're doing it again. It hurts to watch.

What part of "its his site, he can do what he wants" are you having a problem with? Hell, at this point, with your behavior, I'm about to take his side and agree I would not want you registered on our sites EITHER! Again, stop it. Grow up, and deal with the fact he can make his own decisions about the sites he owns. $H*T Happens bud......

 

[groovygeckos]

Nicolai ,

1) Did you know that alex hue didnt want you to have a mack snow??

Yes ,after he contacted me about my signature 'top morphs for less '

It was/is not up to Alex who buys a Mack . They were for sale openly before he ever got his hands on them . And they are for sale now from him and from others . I could have bought from John in person at a show .


2) Did you try to buy one from him and get denied??

Yes , we allready had everything worked out including a shipping date , we allready purchased females for the project based on our e-mails that we were indeed receiving A PAIR of Macks the following week . Then Alex dropped the axe on our plans after we went out of our way to make the deal and to buy females .


3) Did you think Alex would be happy about you buying dan L's Mack snow

That is not my problem , the least of my concern after above mentioned screwing me out of the deal we were making him asking or telling others not to sell to me . None of his business or anyone elses for that matter .

Like I mentioned , do you not buy a car elsewhere if denied for some reason ? Is it professional/ethical/moral for one dealer to tell another not to sell the car to you ? Not up to Alex ,frankly I could care less what he wants ,and wouldnt hesitate to buy elsewhere had he not thought it was OK to tell them not to sell to me either .

Again I ask , should I not even think of buying from Albey if Alex told me no ? They are a seperate entity . So if Kelli has a CT I want and wont sell it , I should not look to buy a CT any longer from anywhere else ? Puh-leeez

If wallmart doesnt have what I want Ill go to another location or to Target .

Alex was not the only person with this line , In fact its not called the 'Hue Snow'



4) Did you honestly think Alex would let you on his site after what conspired?

Did not know it was Alex` site , it says MACK in huge letters . Isnt his name Hue ? Im sure John has alot more sence than to sweep under the rug one of the people working with the line . It does no good for them OR for the morph in general.

5) Do you think you helped yourself by posting this thread or do you think you put yourself right back on everyones bad side by bad mouthing alex who has a lot of friends here??

This is about letting the truth be told . Alex did nothing but lie 'he was denied from the start ' etc. and of course EVERYONE threw accusations around .

Did it look like Dan made purchase specifically for me ? It could have and it did appear that way , but that was not the case and everyone jumped on us and pointed fingers anyways ...prematurely if you ask me .

Chris made a BOI post on the matter ...again prematurely and made out of anger it seemed .


6) Can you think of anyway to redeem yourself from all this propaganda

No , I wish . We cant even be 'verified' and we DID aquire ours legit . So how can anything go forward ? How can this be put behind ? When Im in the middle of feeling the effects of all of this . Can hardly even sell a Gecko , a whole two breeders have even contacted me , noone will speak with me , respond to my posts etc .

You state you didnt know that the site was indeed alex hues site but the you say "i , Today I found this awesome new website linked to Alex Hue Reptiles` site". Why were you on his site if he did all these bad things to you. Why woould you think a Mack Snow site LINKED to his didnt somehow involve him??? Please forgive the questions I am just trying to get all this straight in my head.

Saw that Alex was posting there but that did not tell me it was his site .

I was on alexhuereptiles.com to see his "Jungle" Super Snow and came across the link . Same reason i guess , thought mackleopardgeckos.com was Johns site .

Was just trying to put it all in the past and join the site , didnt know whos it was . I did not expect even if it was Alex site to be banned . You all tell me to get over it , tell your 'buddy' Alex that . Ive been over it until this smack in the face yesterday brought it all back up and made it evident that until we produce Supers our stock is WORTHLESS . What can I do ?

Should Alex be making any of the Mack stock 'unverified' and virtually worthless ? Who does this help ? NOONE ,not even himself .

 

[groovygeckos]

Wendy I emailed you in private to respond to your post. I was suspended and fined at the time on this site .

I told you I could send the e-mails to proove what I was saying . I told you Alex was nothing but rude to me . And about the weight of the animal when recieved being less than was listed or told to Dan . Like I said IMO that animal had been breeding before it was sold to Dan . Alex told me in March he had allready produced over 100 Macks .

You can put two and two together on that one . Kelli also said she THOUGHT hers MAY have also been bred . No mystery here .

 

[Chris@TSE]

you are still avoiding the issue at hand. who cares about you and your mom not being verified. it does not really matter now does it? It is his site, his rules, his choice. Obviously he does not want you there. You could have probably talked to him privately and resolved this matter, but like always you made an ass of yourself and made DAMN sure you showed everyone just why he wont allow you there.

Without a single word here his case is proven. You were denied, big deal. And by doing this you have shown everyone that you'll resort to childish whining and crying rather than mature private conversation and you ultimately tried to pressure the public to side with you or force your acceptance.

Guess what........ yet again you have shot yourself in the foot. It seems with every post you are making it worse. Again Dan, I cannot stress this enough. Shut up. Stop it. Think First........

And to think I was actually beginning to give you the benifit of doubt in past months. You have shown me I was wrong to do so...........

 

[Chris@TSE]

Also, Nick, lets try to stay on topic. I'd rather not rehash the past BS dan entertained us with. This is about the aformentioned topic at hand, lets keep it that way folks.

 

[nicolai]

was trying to stay on subject..

Also, Nick, lets try to stay on topic. I'd rather not rehash the past BS dan entertained us with. This is about the aformentioned topic at hand, lets keep it that way folks.

I wanted to ask a few questions about what led up to this so that myself and others would understand. Also it was a way of making him look at himself and his actions while replying to the questions. The other thread was a very very long read and the question may save people that dont have the time from reading all three hours of it.
I think even after he produces the supers he will still havea hard time selling them due his name recognition around this now.Sadly he brought this on himself by rehashing it again. I dont think even Dan himself truly feels justified in what he has done again.

 

[shrap]

Dan,

Who really gives a crap if you are on someones "verified" list? If you live right, do business right, treat people right.... everything else will take care of itself. List or no list.

Me personally, I do not need or want on someones "verified" list. I dont need anyone but myself to verify who I am and what I am about. An honest mans pillow is his peace of mind. You dont get that from anyone but yourself.

 

[Chris@TSE]

amen brother

 

[dragonflyreptiles]

Well here it is, since he has already made the statement about himself:

Wendy , I cant post on fauna , i have been given fines and wasnt even told why .

It really disturbs me that ANYONE much less yourself would think i did anything wrong to anyone including Alex . What about what Alex and friends did to me and Dan ? Remove us from the market w/ all of the slander and accusations now i cant even sell a single animal ! .

All i did was buy an animal from a friend ! Its not up to Alex who gets a Mack now is it ? It wasnt up to Alex before who got a Mack , they were openly for sale before he got his greedy hands on them . What he did to me was wrong , we had a deal worked out finally , he told me to contact to make the payment , then rudely returned with my sig 'top morphs for less ' . He was nothing but a complete asshole to me in ALL but his first e-mail reply to me . I had worked out a deal with Jodi and Jodi turned around saying Alex has told him not to sell to me . He went out of his way to tell everyone not to sell to me . BLACKLISTED ! Thats his right ? I dont think so . He lied and said I was flat out denied from the start ! He lied and said that he was asking certain questions etc . only thing we talked about was size , price, payment option and shipping , then unexpectedly he returns with the most rude reply yet ' i will not sell you anything so you can sell for less and have let others know not to deal with you ' I could send you the email if you like . All i did was aske that bastard a few questions about the huge differences in prices for smaller/larger Macks and try to figure out which combination of Snow & Super I wanted .I was buying a pair and allready spent money on females ! yes he (and Jodi) were even going to sell me a Super at one point . Then for whatever reason Alex became a Super asshole to me . It takes alot to get up and 'invest' $3000 on a small handfull of geckos for a project , i went through alot of trouble to get the money and started buying females allready because there was never any doubt or talk of being denied . Then am slapped in the face !

Just because one car dealer doesnt sell to you , the one down the block should agree not to sell to you too ? You shouldnt get what you want elsewhere is what your saying ? Doesnt matter who had a Mack for sale and if Alex didnt want me to have one , thats not his business what the next guy I ask does . Doesnt make any sence , so your saying if Alex turned me down I shouldnt even consider asking Albey or John Mack ? Or consider buying what it is that I want when someone else offered it to me ? "Oh no Dan I cant buy your Mack cus` Alex said he wouldnt sell to me " LOL You cant be serious ? Bet If Albey wouldnt sell you a CT you wanted you would go buy from Kelli and so would anyone . Thats business , you wanna screw around with someone they will go elsewhere

And anyone that buys can be 'verified' to be working with the line . EXCEPT FOR ME or someone who buys from me ! I should be happy about this ? I didnt do anything wrong to anyone . What good does that do for the morph ? To have all of these breeders with 'value' to their stock while im not even 'known' to be working with them . On top of the continuing drama .

I didnt start any of this crap , blame Mr. Johnson for starting to throw accusations and everyone that followed .

So our stock is worthless if we are not verified , or noone will buy ,because the Mack 'drama' that was way out of hand is still going on . That is what the thread was about , not only about be banned from the site for just registering . Being 'verified' as a Mack breeder .

Now it is almost to say anyone not on the list is not working with the line . That screws us even more than the sixty something page bashing thread or the BOI post . This cant end because im still hurt by all of it emotionally and in a business sence . I didnt breed even 1/4-1/3 of my Geckos this year ,did not get all of my racks, a bigger place for all of the animals , did not get my site done proffesionally ,because i cant even sell what i did produce after all of that . So no it hasnt got any better , ive only become more bitter when faced with the effects of what they did to us . How do I tell my Mother that no matter what we do our business is dead ? Is this fair to her that Alex and Chris and everyone else have screwed us out of the business ?

He is nothing but a snake Wendy and is going to flood the market all by himself and try to blame others including me . Think , why does this big huge megalo breeder have to push me under the rug ? I have produced 12 or15 Macks only !!!! He said back in March he had allready produced over 100 ! What do you think he is doing with those right now ? IMO Breeding them too young like every other careless LARGE commercial breeder does .

Being helpful to you is a far cry from caring or caring for the animals . How do you make money if you dont help people out ? You dont , thats part of the business . He is a BROKER ! You think he cares when a shipment comes in dead of IMPORTED snakes ? Nope cus i bet he is ordering another and turns around and ships them off in a few days at the most ,right ?

The Mack he sent Dan I think had been breeding because he was not eating normally and was thin like he had been breeding . He also said it was about 70 g. when it was only 58 . Kelli told me hers was the same way last week on the phone . How do you think he produced so many ? Isnt there a chance any parasite came from his colony then ? He must have used all of those males only to resell them for even more than he paid for them . Yea great guy maybe but full of greed Why screw me even more now ,hasnt he done enough to destroy any chance we have to make this a business ?

Anyways sorry for all of this reading and sorry you cant understand I have every right to be complaining about the whole 'drama' since it is obviously far from over . I did nothing to deserve this and my Mother surely did nothing except hatch me .LOL

Have a good one
Dan

 

[dragonflyreptiles]

Dan, for 1 you do not need to prove anything to me, I have the proof I need. You were denied the purchase of the Mack by Alex, you went around Alex to get it plain and simple. That is the entire issue.

You see, we all make mistakes, it is how you handle them that makes a difference and I know this from pure experience. Chris J and Wes gave me a real beating on the BOI last year and it took me time to see the light. A friend told me to go back and read the thread and act as if it were not me but someone I didn't know. Once I did that it all made sense. I also read alot of other threads and realized why Chris and Wes gave me such a hard time.

I then PM'd them both and told them that I finally understood why they gave me such a beating and that I had my head out of my posterior region and would keep it out of that area. I then proceeded to do my best to become an active assest to this community and to fauna.

I learned from my mistake and am a better person for it.

Thing is that you don't even acknowledge your mistake, you keep blaming other people. Once you realize that what you did was wrong and you apologize to the appropriate people and work really hard to get past it, you will be a better person. But as long as you continue to debate a dead issue and blame so and so, you will always be where you are now.

Up until this thread, I had you on my "he's doing so much better" Ill have to check out what he has for sale in the spring, but I would not have purchased a mack from you, maybe a tang or something else. But seeing you still can't accept your mistake and thank those who have tried to show you the light and apologize, that sale will never happen.

 

[KelliH]

Geez, I wish people would learn how to mind their own business. Just goes to show me, again, don't trust anyone. What happened to private conversations? I guess anything I say in private to someone else can and will be used against me or others.

For the record, yes, my male Mack snow was a bit smaller than what I was told. I thought perhaps he had already been breeding with some females before I got him, because of the way he was acting. Was it a big huge deal? No, it was not. If it had been I would have complained about it to Alex immediately. I did mention the size difference to him, but just to let him know. Trust me, if it had mattered that much to me I would have complained about it (anyone that knows me realizes this). I was happy to have a male Mack Snow, and I am still happy I have one. I am glad to be working with the project.

My advice to Dan, like I said the other day, is let all this blow over for awhile. Take some time away from all this drama. It isn't helping to bring all this crap back up! You have some beautiful animals and I think you can do some neat stuff with your leo projects, but bringing all this back up in anger isn't helping anything or anyone. So what if you can't get on the MAck website. I told you and I will tell anyone else that if you had an animal I wanted for a project I would have no problems buying or trading for it. I can feel myself in the beginnings of an anxiety attack over this and it is ridiculous.

Can we (the leo community on Fauna) please get over this and move one? Not just Dan but all of us. In the big scheme of things it doesn't really matter, they're just geckos!