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Maybe I'm missing something.......

No, it's a rip off if he were to pass them off as proven morphs. This way, he's giving people the option of hedging their bets based on the appearance.
 
It is a rip-off if he is tryin to sell NORMALS at a morph price. What if somebody pays him 2 g's for some normal ball pythons?
 
What if someone pays him that amount, and the animals produce a heretofore unknown, simple recessive, morph in the ball python world? Those animals could be worth tens of thousands of dollars EACH!!


Uh . . .probably not.


All Terese was saying (and rightly so, I might add), was that since the seller does not claim that the animals are anything other than unusually colored normals, which "MIGHT" produce something else, he has not comitted a fraud on anyone. He has simply put the best light possible on the snakes he has for sale. Personally, I find it unethical to suggest that something "MIGHT" be there when the odds are astronomically against them being ANYTHING but normals, but he has worded his ad in such a way as to let him off the hook, legally speaking.

Nevertheless, it is for situations such as this that the Latin phrase, Caveat emptor! is remembered. Let the buyer beware! And, if he will not, let the buyer learn a good lesson from his mistake!

;)
 
They're honestly represented. He's being up front about the fact that he really has no idea if they'll prove out. Either someone will end up with very overpriced normals or someone will end up with very inexpensive pastels, and either way the buyer should know what he/she is paying for if they just read the ad.
 
I see your point(s), but I just got a bad feeling when I read the ad. It seems like he is just BSing to get more money out of them. With all the different morphs out there, especially with balls, I'm sure there are thousands of animals that are het for something (even if it is small) and still get sold at normal prices.
 
Well Mr. Beard,

If you were to take a look at the BOI and check up on me you will find that I am not a rip off by any means. I am not selling them at the Morph prices. The prices of True Pastels are $1000-$3000ea. I am selling this group for $2000 because I honestly think they are worth it. It seems to me that YOU don't even know the morph prices. If you were to see them in person you would not be gabbing as much as you are about them being nothing but normal. I as well as any other seller can price any animal that they have for sale at any price they feel it is worth and if a customer agrees then they can purchase them. It is nice to know that there are people out there like yourself that have nothing better to do than to try and nit pick at everything you see others doing. As I stated on the other thread earlier, if anyone would like to stop by and see them in person you are more than welcome. If I were trying to sell them as True Pastels or as genetic then that would be a rip off (which I am not) I am selling gorgeous snakes that appear to be like Pastels.
And to CyberFrog If you purchased one that looks like these for $15 that you got a great deal but mind you the pictures are not anywhere near what they look like in person.
 
I'm not saying they were falsely represented, just that I think it's rediculous to claim them having a chance to be something when everyone knows there isn't a snowballs chance in hell of them actually being some rare morph. Why, because I have a baby male that looks almost exactly like that. I paid $15 for him. Half of the other baby imports I saw with him looked like that. They will grow up, lose baby color, and be everyday BP's. Everyone knows it. I also think had that not been Rob from RK Reptiles, there would be more unhappiness being shown.
 
Well, I was pretty much gonna delete my last post because it seems a little more inflammatory than I meant to be. Also, it's not really my problem. I wouldn't buy them, but I'm not everyone. Unfortunately, I can't edit my own posts, so it'll stay there. Just trying to say that $2000 for an extreme long shot is a little silly. That's about it.
 
LOL!

Rob, I didn't even notice who's ad that was! Sorry if I impugned you in any way! I was just referring to the practice of some that want to advertise "wannabe this or that" ball pythons. Too often it is not even remotely possible that the animal is genetically different from a normal, but that's what causes the skepticism to be heaped on everyone, including reputable people such as yourself.

Anyway, Rob is well known for his honesty, and he did clearly set forth that what he has are uniquely colored normals that may, may not be genetic variants. Anyone that wants to roll the dice on possibilities would be better served by rolling those dice with a dealer that is reputable like Rob than on some fly-by-night person with no established credibility . . .that's for certain!

Sorry for my inattention, Rob!
 
Pricing

My father thinks it's insane to pay for any lizard. He's got tons of fence lizards in his back yard and to him their all the same. On the other hand I picked up an Ambilobe for $400 and was pleased with the price.

As long as the animals are honestly represented let the seller charge whatever he feels he can. The buyer can decide if the price warrants a purchase or not.
 
Darin,

No problem, I did not take offense to your post by any means. I can definitely understand how some people can be worried or concerned about someone selling an animal for a higher than normal price that is not proved out as we have seen people trying to pull rip off's like that just recently. I am lucky that I come across a few SPECIAL ball pythons as I import them direct. There is no body digging through mine before the general public gets there hands on them. I have had a few animals that were truly exceptional animals and sold for some large amounts of money. These animals were purchased because of pictures and descriptions, and when the customer received them was even happier than when they ordered them. I honestly feel these animals are something different and the only thing they are close to are Pastel Ball Pythons. I have tons of baby Balls here that are brightly colored like some others sell as pastelish or pastelike but these are by far the closest thing to a pastel that I have seen that was not a proven pastel. I would love to keep them and try to prove them out but I don't have the time nor facilities to keep everything I come across that I would like to raise up.
 
Sheesh!

So now where does this thread really belong?

Remain here on the BOI, because Rob's name has now been mentioned? Or to the General Business Discussions forum because this is a rather generic based question? Or to the Ball Python Morphs forum since it is mostly about ball pythons?

You guys are giving me a headache.....:nuts:
 
Rich. File 13 seems to be in order here.

It all sounds to me like someone read an advertisement and kinda jumped the gun a bit. Rob has an excellent track record not to mention great character and isn't remotely the type to pull a fast one. He laid out all the cards for any potential buyers to weigh out their decisions with NO misleading statements. Any possible buyer that is considering spending two thousand dollars on a group of snakes doesn't sound like the average 'impulse' customer to me. I know certainly if it were my two grand I would feel it better spent on geckos lol. But to a Ball python enthusiast with some extra change in their pockets it may seem a worthwile bet. Just my 2 cents..... Mike B.
 
First off, I want to say that I have heard nothing bad about Rob or his reptiles. Only positive stuff on the BOI that I can think of. I would trust him if I wanted to buy something of his and would not have a hard time sending out my money.
But as far as the add goes, I find it to be sort of misleading. It says Pastel? which says it might be a Pastel... Unless the pics are way off their is no way that I think that those can be Pastels. Even if their genetics did prove out, they just look like cool patterned normals. I tried hard to come to look at them with a Pastel coming to mind and I could not. I see nothing wrong with Pastelish, etc..., but once you give them the possiblity of genetics and just maybe they are, I think is misleading. When I first saw the add it reminded me of the thread in The General Business Discussion Forum entitled "To Jump or not to Jump?". It just barely irks by leaving the seller having no responsibility for selling what would be considered by most to be normal Ball Pythons as possible genetic mutation and possibiblty the chance of now owning 5 Pastels. They might not be priced as high as Pastels, but they are much higher than you generally would pay for strange looking ch normals. If they are truly something new then their is no need to associate them with another proven mutation, and I dont mean by saying pastelish, I mean by saying Pastel?. Their is also the possibility of them really looking extremely different than the pics, but from my experience, I've seen the "I think their Pastels" darken up quite a bit and be sold as normals at a later date. If their are 5 that does not take up too much space to find out in a few months if you really do think their pastels and then can sell them at market value. I'm pretty sure that Pastels would appear quite differently even with not the best photos though. Just my opinion on the use of morph names to sell normals.
Thanks, Tom Baker
 
I have changed the ad's title to PASTELISH? Looking. Tom The ad states it as well as some of my post on this thread. The pics are AWFUL and show none of the color. As I said before and in the ad IN person these animals look identical to pastel's I have seen both online and at shows.
 
Rob, you still cannot justify putting mid-morph price on nice normal babies that will eventually turn out to be regular ball pythons. Just because you think they're worth it?? I'm sure you do, considering the price they are. If everybody went around pricing things based on what they like/don't like, we'd be upside down and a$$ backwards. Are the snakes even het for ANYTHING? Oh well they MIGHT be het for piebald so you better jack it up to 10 grand. They are overpriced unjustifiably.......no way around it.
 
David,

It is obvious that you have no clue to buisness. You can not sit there and say that they will turn out to be nothing just as I can not say they will turn out to be something. I can and did (and have done it in the past and will again in the future) price an animal at what ever price I feel the animal is worth. I understand you don't think they are worth the price and that is your prerogative. What is ridiculous is how a person such as yourself can sit there and presume that he can tell me (a buisness that has been in buisness for a while) what and how to price my product. You don't like the prices fine don't buy them but don't sit there and tell me how to run my buisness nor price my animals. Do you even understand how buisness works. An item is sold for the highest amount that the market can fair on that item. I have these animals priced at what I think they are worth. Maybe someone else will think so and maybe not but it is not hurting anyone at what I price them at. Do you really think you can change how GM, Ford, (or any other company for that matter) price their cars and products? HELL no you can't just as you can change mine. I don't agree with the prices on certain items but I don't go complaining about it to the seller I just look for another source that can sell it to me cheaper or don't get it or break down and spend the money. You can keep posting your thoughts that I should abide by what you think but that is not going to happen.
 
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