Bad Guy MEL KRUGER - CROOK

[Black Adder]

Let's not be given incorrect advice. I know that feelings are running high here, but you can't just make stuff up.
In my opinion, publicity is the best way to handle this matter, get lots of folks especially in AZ, looking at this thread, Kruger, and his 'family' business.

You are probably correct however at this point Mr kruger is certainly considered in breach of contract and while my comment may have been hasty there is no guarantee a court would not find that to be the case.
His refusal to return property that is not his or pay for said property or send agreed upon trade items does not bode well in any eyes

 

[Lucille]

there is no guarantee a court would not find that to be the case.

On the contrary, if you look up the definition of 'possession of stolen property' it is completely inapplicable.

 

[Black Adder]

Lol, not going to argue this point Lucille, we are getting off the topic a little.
But it seems Mr. Kruger in his last few posts has made it abundantly clear he is going to do nothing to fulfill any part of his side of the deal (s).
While I agree that publicity in a negative form for Mr.Kruger will help make sure nobody else gets ripped off by him in the same fashion, I do not see it helping Alex at all right now to regain possession of HIS snakes or any previously agreed upon trade item.

 

[Black Adder]

I HATE TO BE BRUTAL AND RUDE HERE BUT....
ARE YOU INSANE?
YOU CAN HONESTLY STATE THAT ALEX IS RIPPING YOU OFF????????????
YOU HAVE ALL THE SNAKES, HE DID NOT "GIVE" THEM YOU, THEY WERE A TRADE, YOU HAVE FULFILLED "NO" PART OF YOUR END OF THE TRADE SO LEGALLY AT THE MOMENT YOU ARE CONSIDERED IN POSSESSION OF STOLEN GOODS!

Just to correct myself ( and this will be my last comment on this subject)
My statement was incorrect as possession of stolen property is a different matter entirely as correctly pointed out by Lucille.

 

[Pasodama]

Unfortunately, since neither person wishes to pay for shipping, or for a shipping label, it seems that one of Alex's only recourses left is a lawsuit.
Especially since it appears that Mel is not willing to do anything that does not gain him an extreme bonanza (or free animals). Even if that means selling someone else's property and keeping all proceeds for himself.

....

 

[Thenotoriousdud]

At this point, the best remaining solution for the OP is to suck it up and pay for the shipping. Some safeguards need to be put in place though because I firmly believe that there is no way that this guy will be able to send the animals back intact. To the OP, I get that you really don't want the snakes back, hell that is shown by the crazy deal you're willing to give this guy in the first place, but as it stands you have nothing. Get your animals back at the least, I'm sure someone that has seen this thread can assist you in finding a buyer for them. Then you will at least have something in hand toward the possible purchase of you firearms. I've never commented on a BOI thread before but this one just rubs me the wrong way. What a piece of work. I used to behave this way, but then I completed third grade.

 

[Black Adder]

Hmm, seems to me that we are missing a few salient points here at this stage
Mr Kruger has now had the snakes in his possession for what 4 weeks or so?
WHO KNOWS what state they may be in by now!
Given his attitude and stubborness displayed on here who is to say his husbandry is any better?
If I was the op I am not sure I would WANT them returning at this stage because they could have any number of issues by now!

And then it seems we have all forgotten about the poor snakes welfare in all of this, if Mr.Kruger has not taken care of them then correctly then we possibly have a case where they could be suffering right now.
AND THAT IS UNACCEPTABLE!

 

[juliasara]

Even if the op is willing to take them back, what about the 4 snakes Mel has admitted to selling? He obviously can't return those.

 

[Pasodama]

And then it seems we have all forgotten about the poor snakes welfare in all of this, if Mr.Kruger has not taken care of them then correctly then we possibly have a case where they could be suffering right now.
AND THAT IS UNACCEPTABLE!

There is no evidence/proof that any mistreatment, or poor husbandry, has occurred, or is occurring, with these particular snakes.
I understand the risk aspect, of reptiles that have been at another location/facility, and not wishing the return of those reptiles.
However, care should be taken with assumptions, accusations, etc., where there is a complete lack of evidence.

....

 

[Black Adder]

Even if the op is willing to take them back, what about the 4 snakes Mel has admitted to selling? He obviously can't return those.

Unfortunately mr. Kruger seems to contradict himself every other post on whether he still has them all or has indeed sold any?

 

[Mistyck]

Hmm, seems to me that we are missing a few salient points here at this stage
Mr Kruger has now had the snakes in his possession for what 4 weeks or so?
WHO KNOWS what state they may be in by now!
Given his attitude and stubborness displayed on here who is to say his husbandry is any better?
If I was the op I am not sure I would WANT them returning at this stage because they could have any number of issues by now!

And then it seems we have all forgotten about the poor snakes welfare in all of this, if Mr.Kruger has not taken care of them then correctly then we possibly have a case where they could be suffering right now.
AND THAT IS UNACCEPTABLE!

Correct, he has also admitted that he has sold some, (and he apparently pocketed the profits from those sales.) Yet he still wants the OP to pay shipping to get his (OP's) snakes back that the OP sent in a trade, but the OP never received his end of the trade from Mr. Kruger.

So it's perfectly acceptable to Mr. Kruger for him to pocket all money made from sales, keep the gun(s), demand that the OP send the last remaining snake from the original deal (which is null and void since they struck up a second deal which excluded that snake), then further make demands that OP will pay for shipping of the snakes back to home, and has since been "advised" that the OP is trying to "RIP HIM OFF." Yet the only one I see making out in this deal is Mr. Kruger.

OP, it's clear that you're not going to get your snakes back that you sent him. You're also not going to see any firearm, nor any money. This seems to me that he has used a good farce and scammed you out of snakes. He obviously doesn't care that he doesn't look good dealing with this whole ordeal, nor does he care that you are on the losing end of things. He got what he wanted, and now he's going to do everything in his power to remain as "dense" as he can about everything, all while selling the snakes, making a profit and trying to scam other people out of things.

It's very apparent that Mr. Kruger from Kruger's Kritter is one to be avoided at all costs! From anyone; buyers, sellers, traders! I think everyone will have cruddy dealings if they try to deal with this person.

 

[Black Adder]

I apologise to fellow Fauna members if I am coming on a little strong here but this particular BOI has made my blood boil!
Both the actions and the attitude displayed by Mr Kruger
I have few polite words left to sum up the injustice perpetrated here.

 

[juliasara]

Unfortunately mr. Kruger seems to contradict himself every other post on whether he still has them all or has indeed sold any?

Yes he has contradicted himself many times in this thread but going by the date on the text he admitted to selling the 4 snakes weeks before this thread was started. It's definitely more proof that Mel has a problem telling the truth.

 

[bcr229]

There is no evidence/proof that any mistreatment, or poor husbandry, has occurred, or is occurring, with these particular snakes.
I understand the risk aspect, of reptiles that have been at another location/facility, and not wishing the return of those reptiles.
However, care should be taken with assumptions, accusations, etc., where there is a complete lack of evidence.

^^^^^^^^^^^^ This.

The boas would have to be quarantined if/when they were shipped back. Hopefully the OP is in a position where he could do that; logistically I can only do one at a time.

OP also has to consider how quickly he could resell them, as shipping season is ending for much of the country as winter approaches.

 

[juliasara]

Mel has a few ads posted for snakes, guns and spiders but they are all closed so no one can post on them. I was going to post a link to this thread on all of his ads but it can't be done. I really hope others search the boi before doing any business with him.

 

[Pasodama]

I apologise to fellow Fauna members if I am coming on a little strong here but this particular BOI has made my blood boil!
Both the actions and the attitude displayed by Mr Kruger
I have few polite words left to sum up the injustice perpetrated here.

It is quite understandable why you feel as you do.
It is difficult to fathom Mel's thought processes and certain actions.
We just have to have a bit of self possession and not get too carried away. Level heads prosper.

....

 

[bcr229]

Bronx Boa (BB) in his first post said he shipped:

5.1 Ghosts het moonglow ‘15
1.1 Hypo Het Moonglow ‘15
1.1 Trip Het Snowglows ‘14
1.0 Hypo Het Anery ‘10
0.1 Pastel Het Anery ‘08

So that's 12 snakes not 11, or am I counting wrong?

In the screen shot from post #213 Kruger's Kritters (KK) stated:

...I sold the two hypos the one male ghost and one female ghost so if you want me to ship back the rest...

So, the female hypo that sold should have been the 2015 0.1 Hypo Het Moonglow based on the list, along with 1.1 2015 Ghost Het Moonglows being sold.

The final male hypo that KK sold, was that the 2015 Hypo Het Moonglow or the 2010 Hypo Het Anery proven breeder? I'm assuming that the "sick" snake with the odd-looking head was the older male, as none of the other males are old enough to be breeding yet. Did someone buy it?

 

[Mistyck]

I think the Anery is the one that wasn't sent and that Mr. Kruger is ticked off about not getting yet. That's the "expensive" one that he keeps griping about.

So if you take that one away, that would leave you with 11 snakes...

 

[bcr229]

I think the Anery is the one that wasn't sent and that Mr. Kruger is ticked off about not getting yet. That's the "expensive" one that he keeps griping about.

So if you take that one away, that would leave you with 11 snakes...

No, I found it, KK got the two adult boas in the OP's list. From post #43:

The original deal was for A Kel-tek Sub 2000 that they only made 5000 of them and a 10 22 Ruger that I built with all kinds of extras for 4 female baby ghost One male baby ghost 2 triple het hypos one male hypo breeders1 female pastel breeder and the one that did not come was a Jaguar ANERY breeder

BB is that jaguar a CA, or is it from the line that Mark at BoaMaster and Frank Martin were playing with? If the latter then yes I can understand why KK would be upset that he has no chance of getting it now, that would not be a cheap animal.

 

[AaronSerio]

Then the only thing else I can offer you is for you to get your snakes back you have to do is pay for the shipping you don't even have to send me any money you can set it up all by yourself and I will ship them back to you as long as you going to pay for what I have spent which would be about $130 I have had them for 4 weeks I feed once a week but you need to make up your mind soon and believe me I am being nice of doing this because the snakes are already mine you have gave them all to me you can say whatever you want to say it does not matter I know the truth and you know the truth

So according to the picture below you sold 4 snakes. Why not use that money to ship him the snakes? You're still not out anything from your pocket.

Since these are apparently "your" snakes right now how come Alex again has to pay for feeding them? Weird how everything is up to him.

Yes he has contradicted himself many times in this thread but going by the date on the text he admitted to selling the 4 snakes weeks before this thread was started. It's definitely more proof that Mel has a problem telling the truth.