Bad Guy Metal Monkey Exotics

[Quaint]

When I requested info on an available 2014 female, he admitted to starving it since April (over 5 months!) because he did not have rats the right size. In this time, it lost almost 20% of its body weight. He claims that there is nothing wrong with this and that its still healthy, but forced starvation is not okay.

-Kelsey Goldman

 

[Lucille]

Kelsey can you do a screen print of the ad and show a picture please?

 

[m00kfu]

How about the full chain of emails?

MorphMarket Inquiry re: Black Pastel Orange Dream Pinstripe (#25718) from Quaint
Inbox
x

MorphMarket <[email protected]>
Sep 2 (2 days ago)

to me
Hi Metal Monkey Exotics, you have received the inquiry below about one of your MorphMarket ads.
Please reply to this email to communicate directly to the buyer as soon as possible.

Posting: http://www.morphmarket.com/c/reptiles/pythons/ball-pythons/25718
Buyer: [email protected]
Message:

"I am interested in purchasing this snake. Could I please have an updated weight, what it is eating, and any health history information? Thank you."

--
MorphMarket
The Modern Reptile Marketplace.
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Questions or concerns about MorphMarket or how to unsubscribe should be sent to [email protected].


Chris Schantz <[email protected]>
Sep 2 (2 days ago)

to Quaint
Unfortunately she went off feed just before I posted her for sale back in April and she's under 700 grams now. She was on live rats and may be ready to start eating again but I'm unsure at the moment because I switched to using a rat supplier this year and he ended up bailing on me a couple of months ago and my personal colony is just now starting to produce again.

Best Regards,
Chris
____________________________________
Metal Monkey Exotics
Chris Schantz
Phone: 989-213-1921
Mon-Fri 5pm - 9pm, Sat/Sun 11am - 9pm
www.metalmonkeyexotics.com


Kelsey Goldman
4:12 PM (1 hour ago)

to me
Has she seen a vet? Thats an awful lot of weight to lose, has she had a single meal since then? Is it an issue of her not wanting to eat or you not having any rats to feed her? I’ll be honest, I’m still interested but there’s no way I could sink that much money into a sick snake and then have to handle vet bills on top of it.


Chris Schantz <[email protected]>
4:45 PM (1 hour ago)

to Kelsey
No she's still a healthy weight to size ratio, definitely not sick. The majority of that weight would have been waste. The past couple of months would be me not having any rats small enough to feed her, I really didn't expect getting the rat colony back up and running to take as long as it has.
If you wanted to try to produce one like her yourself I've actually got the same animals that produced her up for sale also, the male od pin and the female black pastel.


Kelsey Goldman
4:56 PM (1 hour ago)

to me
Losing more than 15% of her body weight due to starvation isn’t cool. I’ll take her on as a rescue at this point, but wouldn’t spend more than $500 on her because of this situation.


Chris Schantz <[email protected]>
5:08 PM (1 hour ago)

to Kelsey
No, starvation has nothing to do with it. Any ball python that is well fed will lose 10% of it's body weight just in waste when it goes off feed for a couple of months.


Kelsey Goldman
5:37 PM (33 minutes ago)

to me
But she didn’t go off feed, you have starved her for 5 months, or roughly a fifth of her life? That’s just unacceptable.


Chris Schantz <[email protected]>
Attachments6:06 PM (3 minutes ago)

to Quaint
No, you apparently misread what I wrote. She went off feed just before I posted that ad, 5 months ago, and it's been two months since I've had rats small enough for her. Does this look like a starving snake to you? Taken just now with my cell phone.

 

[Lucille]

When I requested info on an available 2014 female, he admitted to starving it since April (over 5 months!) because he did not have rats the right size.

I saw what you posted, but it doesn't say what you posted above.

First he said that she snake went off feed right before April. Then he said he did not have appropriate size rats the last couple of months since his supplier did not send rats.
That does not translate into starving her for 5 months because her going off feed in April was not related to whether he had rats on hand, she simply was not eating.

 

[m00kfu]

And here's the picture of the snake in question, literally taken minutes ago with my phone.

 

[Lucille]

_________________
Metal Monkey Exotics
Chris Schantz
Phone: 989-213-1921
Mon-Fri 5pm - 9pm, Sat/Sun 11am - 9pm
www.metalmonkeyexotics.com


Kelsey Goldman
I’ll take her on as a rescue at this point, but wouldn’t spend more than $500 on her because of this situation.

The '5 months of starvation' is a false accusation, IMHO.

I wonder if this was just an elaborate attempt to get a discount?

 

[Black Adder]

That is still one very healthy looking BP imho......

 

[Quaint]

There was apparently miscommunication of some sort here, and I still believe that not feeding for several months due to a lack of feeders is not proper care. I no longer want anything to do with this snake or breeder, I'm uninterested in a discount.

 

[Aeonic]

I've done lots of business with Chris, stand up guy and quality animals.... Your loss

 

[Black Adder]

There was apparently miscommunication of some sort here, and I still believe that not feeding for several months due to a lack of feeders is not proper care. I no longer want anything to do with this snake or breeder, I'm uninterested in a discount.

I would say there was too!
Not a good idea to start a bad guy BOI without all the correct information and facts
Did you bother to ask for a picture or anything before this?
BP,s are notorious for going off feed for months at a time tbh

 

[Mistyck]

There was apparently miscommunication of some sort here, and I still believe that not feeding for several months due to a lack of feeders is not proper care. I no longer want anything to do with this snake or breeder, I'm uninterested in a discount.

Apparently there was miscommunication from you, because you chose to only show what you thought would make you look good from the communications. Yet when Chris shows your replies and his other replies it makes you look like you're just trying to get him to "discount" the animal so you can get a great deal on it.

So I'm SURE that you no longer want anything to do with the snake or breeder since the breeder/owner showed that you were misleading or purposely being deceptive to everyone. Heaven forbid you look bad right?

BTW, some snakes are notorious for going off feed for a bit. Heck even my lizard goes off feed for a bit. But you just had to exaggerate on the time frame and it makes you look really shady.

 

[Mistyck]

I would say there was too!
Not a good idea to start a bad guy BOI without all the correct information and facts
Did you bother to ask for a picture or anything before this?
BP,s are notorious for going off feed for months at a time tbh

Haha , guess I should have read further down before commenting, but you're correct (on all accounts!)

 

[Quaint]

It wasn't about going off feed, he said he wasn't feeding it because he didn't have appropriately sized feeders. Even a snake off feed needs to be offered food so that it can go back on feed.

 

[Mistyck]

Just to touch on this as well:

I'm uninterested in a discount.

I doubt that the breeder would be interested in giving you a discount anyway with the way you decided to show yourself here. Good luck!

 

[Lucille]

It wasn't about going off feed, he said he wasn't feeding it because he didn't have appropriately sized feeders. Even a snake off feed needs to be offered food so that it can go back on feed.

Except you decided to turn the two months he didn't have feeders into 5 months of starvation, and then tried to finagle a discount.

 

[Mistyck]

It wasn't about going off feed, he said he wasn't feeding it because he didn't have appropriately sized feeders. Even a snake off feed needs to be offered food so that it can go back on feed.

It was, or you wouldn't have brought it up. You're still trying to defend the fact that you were exaggerating the whole thing in order to make yourself look good & to try to get a big discount on a snake so you could "rescue" it.

 

[Lucille]

Out of the 5 months, for the first 3 months he did have feeders to offer until his supplier bailed. If he offered at the 3 month mark, even if he had feeders he may very well not have offered for another couple weeks. So that leaves 6 weeks you are making an issue of. Should he have stopped by a pet store and got a rat? Maybe.
But it is your mention of a discount that makes this whole thread suspect, and has it smelling like a ploy to get this nice snake for pennies on the dollar.

 

[Chris Kennard]

I will defend no one here. But I will say this. I don't give a rat's ass who your "supplier" is. If they fail to deliver, get your lazy ass to a pet shop and buy food for your snakes!

 

[Quaint]

Once again, it was not made clear that she went off feed on her own. I asked whether she went off feed or he didn't have feeders, and he said he didn't have feeders. I still think it's unacceptable not to find feeders for your animals, especially ones you are trying to sell.

 

[Chris Kennard]

Once again, it was not made clear that she went off feed on her own. I asked whether she went off feed or he didn't have feeders, and he said he didn't have feeders. I still think it's unacceptable not to find feeders for your animals, especially ones you are trying to sell.

Couldn't agree more.