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michael taylor boas etc BAD GUY

bennetts

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This my experience with Mike Taylor of Boas Etc. I purchased 2 jungle boas,
one female hypo jungle and a male jungle normal. When both arrived I sent an
email that they both looked fine, but I was unhappy about the patterning of
the male. Within the next week or so, the male looked more and more dried out
and dehydrated. It took a month to get him to eat. I called Michael instead of
emailing and he told me keep him posted about his condition. Finally he ate
but was still very dry and skinny. He ate a second meal and went into a shed.
He had a very bad shed and shed in pieces and the top third of him did not
even shed at this point.

I called Michael, several times throughout and he kept putting me off etc.
Finally after 45 days or so he went into a shed cycle again and now started to
develope mouth rot due to not having the old shed gone yet. Michael told me he
stands behind his snakes except when a customer does something wrong. Well, he
is in a 32 qt tub by himself. The temps are kept at 80 in the front and 90 in
the back on paper towels for subtrate. The room is kept at 65 to 75% humidity
on its own. Also the snake was soaked 3 different times to help assist in
getting rid of the old shed. It still has not come off. I sent all the pics to
Michael and he also stated that the snake could have developed the mouth rot
from the old shed as well, take him to a vet. I also have 20 other snakes and
the female I got from him is in the tub above him and doing great. No other
snake I have has this problem. I spoke with several breeders including John
from Salmon Boa and all the people I spoke to said the same thing. He must
have been sent sick bc I didn't have enough time to affect him in any way.
When a snake doesn't eat for a month, something is wrong. According to
Michael that's what snakes do.

I have tried to continue to call him and he wil not answer his phone. He
claims that many top breeders call him to ask whether a snake is a jungle or
not. That was not the feedback I got from the people I spoke to. All I have
requested is to have him take the snake back and send me a healthy snake in
it's place. He said he sent all my emails to top breeders etc. He never makes
mention of the numerous phone calls and all we spoke about. Also he never sent
feed/shed/id cards like he said he would. I have no idea how old and when this
snake was born.

So in conclusion, remember sometimes, you never know who you are buying from
until you buy. Use my experience as a an indicator of what to expect. It's not
you won't get a healthy snake but if you get a sick one, this is how he will
handle it. When you spend any money, especially over 2k I feel you should get
great customer service as well. That doesn't exist here. Save your money and
buy from some proven breeders that have awesome customer service. I have
purchased from Burke Reptiles, SDI (Steve Ihrig), Susquehanna Ectotherms (Ted
Thompson), Herps Limited Inc (Tom Crutchfield), Boas By Bell (Mike Bell) etc.
I have purchased from several awesome breeders and have had nothing but
incredible customer service.
 
I suspect your problem is how you set the snake up. 80 degrees on one side, and 90 on the other? Thats too hot and not enough humidity. If your ambient room humidity is 65% to 75%, I can promise you your tub enclosure is much less, humidity wise.Ambient humidity and actual cage humidity are very different. Try using cypress mulch for your substrate and mist it to increase humidity inside the tub and lower the over all heat in the cage. I suspect you are drying the snake out with your hot temps.

Randal
 
input

I have spoken to several people about the temps and actually those temps are ideal. I have also about 25 boas all in same set up and situation and never ever had a problem and I have had boas for over 20 yrs. The paper towels as substrate works perfect bc I can mist the back side of the cage for added humidity without the snake getting red belly. I have all my snakes thriving with no issues and all eat perfect, shed perfect and are all doing as well as I would expect. Most of the people I know have their snakes with even much more extensive temps than that. Rich Ihle keeps his cages at 104 in the hottest spots (see the VPI boa video) Dave and Tracy Barkers video(www.VPI.com).
 
To clear things up for you....

Warning points have no reflection on a persons herp knowledge. I suspect Randal has forgotten more about boas than you have ever learned!
 
Not sure why warnings points dictate a members knowledge of reptile keeping but whatever floats your boat.

Has there been a vet visit yet? Not knocking the advice you have received but none of the names you listed are vets.
 
I don't mean it like that but to say they are too warm and dried out is not correct. I have purchased and mirrored and followed to the T the best of the best breeders and the snakes I have felt were the healthiest based on quality of skin weight length etc I have done exactly what they do. I have had nothing but great results with awesome healthy happy snakes. I know Jeff Ronne keeps his cooler than most. It depends on your outcome. If you want to keep your snakes small and feed them very small meals etc. Yes 90 is not needed. But in my experience over 20 yrs is if they do not have a hot spot to properly digest their meals they will regurge. Where boas come from 90 is not too hot. Even if they are captive bred, which all mine are, they still need heat. I have found that the best balance is 77 to 80 on the cool side unless breeding season cooling is going on if you follow that. My room naturally cycles itself without changing anything so I don't really cool.

The point you made about the actual humidity in the cage and the difference to inside is a great point. I mist 2 to 3 times a week in addition to my rooms humidity. Different climates also call for different things. New York to California is totally different climates. I just follow what my snakes seem to tell me. That's all I was trying to say.
 
While this care advise dispute is nice, I believe that it is getting off topic to a degree and better belongs on a Boa Forum.
I think the topic of this thread is whether or not Mr. Taylor deserves the Bad Guy charge made by Mr. Bennett.
I sure would like to hear Mr. Taylor's side of the story.
 
I agree Mr. Dove, what on earth am I doing here commenting on the care of boa's when I'm up against James Ednie, boa expert? Sorry, let's get back on topic and hope Mr. Taylor responds!

Randal
 
lanceheads said:
I agree Mr. Dove, what on earth am I doing here commenting on the care of boa's when I'm up against James Ednie, boa expert? Sorry, let's get back on topic and hope Mr. Taylor responds!

Randal

Uh Oh. You might be heading toward more points. LOL. :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
 
Within the next week or so, the male looked more and more dried out
and dehydrated. It took a month to get him to eat. I called Michael instead of
emailing and he told me keep him posted about his condition. Finally he ate
but was still very dry and skinny. He ate a second meal and went into a shed.
He had a very bad shed and shed in pieces and the top third of him did not
even shed at this point.

I called Michael, several times throughout and he kept putting me off etc.
Finally after 45 days or so he went into a shed cycle again and now started to
develope mouth rot due to not having the old shed gone yet. Michael told me he
stands behind his snakes except when a customer does something wrong. Well, he
is in a 32 qt tub by himself. The temps are kept at 80 in the front and 90 in
the back on paper towels for subtrate. The room is kept at 65 to 75% humidity
on its own. Also the snake was soaked 3 different times to help assist in
getting rid of the old shed. It still has not come off. I sent all the pics to
Michael and he also stated that the snake could have developed the mouth rot
from the old shed as well, take him to a vet.

Did you take it to the vet? At this point all the " top breeders " saying this & that don't / won't help as much as a vet report from a reptile vet.

I'm not in any way defending the seller , don't even know who he is. Just curious if the animal has seen a vet and if not , why? . I would like to see the seller's side as well.
 
To the OP

So in all this time, you have still not taken this animal to the vet?

Not saying this is the answer but here is a likely scenario:

The animal did not appear dry or dehydrated on delivery because it was probably at the tail end of a shed cycle. Due to the stress of shipping and the inevitable difference in climate that occurs when an animal leaves one environment and enters another, the shed stuck. That was probably the reason it appeared to get drier and more dehydrated looking after a week or so. A boa with a full shed stuck on him might very well go off feed for a while. Is there any particular reason why you did not immediately soak and then assist the animal in shedding manually? I picked up a rescue boa several years ago that the owner said was sick and blind. After a three hour soak and an hour and a half of diligent work, two of us peeled at least three and possible as many as 5 sheds off the poor thing. It wasn't blind, it just had so many layers of unshed skin on it that it looked like cataracts. The Mouthrot was very likely caused by the long term stuck sheds. However, you have already stated that the animal looked fine on delivery so those must have happened in your care

Not saying that you did it intentionally but your problem very likely could have been fixed in the first week or so the same way I detailed above. Given the number of shed cycles coupled with the limited food the animal took in, I think the above scenario is pretty likely
 
I don't see how mouth rot can be related to an incomplete shed. They can be "associated" because of a defficiency in management conditions (e.g. improper temperatures) but "cause and effect"? I've never seen it (on the other hand one should never say never when dealing with biology :) ).

Regards.
 
I GUESS YOU GET ONE ROTTEN APPLE ONCE IN A WHILE

I sold a Dan Bennett a pair of Jungles for SMOKING DEAL. I sent 2 sets of pictures of the snakes. HE Said liked them and would sent a deposit. After he got them he said "I thought the male would be more Abberant"?? I said those are the EXACT same snakes in the ad and in the additional pictures. I thought Buyers Remorse. He called me 3 weeks later and said the same snake he didn't like was not eating. HE mentioned what can you do?? I thought OK Heres a set up to send the snake back. Then he called me and said he ate. I was happy. 40 Days later here he contacts me again and says that the snake is dehydrated. IN the same sentence he admits that the snake shed except for the top third of his body. UH I wonder why he looks that way. It doesn't take a Vet to figure that one out. The dry hard skin under the lip has caused inflammation under the lip now. Well he's trying to blame BAD Husbandry on ME. :NoNo: HE also sent a email to all the people on the classifieds on Kingsnake. I was bombarded with forwarded emails warning me of the NUT. I will not take a snake back when the person is to blame for the problem. This is my first and last bad thing you ever see on the BOI. I guess a little man has has to try to hurt me some how. I have been selling snakes for long time and have many happy customers out there. I also plan on pursing a Defamation of charactor lawsuit. ALL the People he emailed forwarded them to me. I will send the pics to all who want to see how bad he let the snake got and the emails when he Says he got the snakes and they where healthy . I enclosed pics to show how bad he let the skin get. I feel bad for the little fella.


I wanted to say thanks to all that looked out for me and warned me about this this GUY :thumbsup:
 

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