michael taylor boas etc BAD GUY

[Dennis Hultman]

Michael, do you still have the email exchange and could you post it?

Thanks.

 

[John E Dove]

First I would like to thank you for coming in here and straightening this out Mr. Taylor.
Though I have not seen any TOS that you have it seems to me that after a month there is no way you could be blamed for a skin condition or dehydration much less "mouth rot" (caused by an incomplete shed?).

 

[The BoidSmith]

The dry hard skin under the lip has caused inflammation under the lip now. Well he's trying to blame BAD Husbandry on ME.

The fact that the anterior 1/3 was mostly retained and the animal was reluctant to eat in the first place leads me to believe that the mouth rot was there first. It probably hurt to rub the head and the jaw in order to shed the skin from the head and immediately thereafter so she tried not to do it. Again everything leads to believe the problem with shedding was not associated with the mouth rot but the other way around. The problem is under whose care was the mouth rot contracted...

 

[Suncoast Herpetological]

From the OP

Finally after 45 days or so he went into a shed cycle again and now started to
develope mouth rot

Since Mouthrot is usually a symptom from another type of trauma and not a spontaneous stand alone ailment, it seems a stretch to think that it did not become apparent for 45 plus days if the animal had it pre delivery.

 

[Boas Etc]

LET HIS EMAIL SPEAK FOR ITS SELF

I put the email so you can JUDGE for your self. There's no mention of any health problems when he recieved them. I thought this might help clear things up

Michael T
Boas Etc

 

[boamaster]

as a customer of mike t
who has spent a few thousand with him
my experience is ,i have always gotten good animals
and quality service and he is always willing to give good info and help.
i always keep my neonates in 12 qts for the first year
as to promote a higher humidity level
and i too do not push any temps above 88
just my experience. mark @ boamaster

 

[Mooing Tricycle]

im going to say from what i have read, that improper husbandry was the issue here.

 

[wetceal]

I have known Mike Taylor for a few years now. We have done business with him in the past and have been happy with our transactions. I know Mike to be a good guy and hope that this situation can be worked out between the two parties.

I just want to mention something about sheds. I find that after a stressful event such as shipping or even just moving a snake to a new environment (like when a local customer purchases an animal from us) can cause the animal to have a rough shed for its first shed after the change. This doesn't always happen but I have seen it happen numerous times to a large variety of different kinds of snakes - boas, ball pythons, corn snakes, etc.

I generally try to warn customers of this and tell them to keep a close eye on the animal. And if the shed does not completely come off, then they will need to soak and physically assist the animal with removing the remainder of the shed.

All this won't help Dan at this point as he is already past the fact. However, I just wanted to mention that rough/stuck sheds can be common in animals that are stressed out. Coupled with the snake being possibly somewhat dehydrated after shipping seems to have led up to the current condition of the animal. Hopefully, with the proper veterinary attention, the mouth rot can be treated. The remaining stuck shed really needs to be removed but if it remains stubborn and won't come off, you might just need to wait until the subsequent shed and make sure both layers come off.

I'm not sure where Dan lives but if he is near someone who has experience with extremely stubborn stuck sheds on snakes, maybe that person can help assist him with the shedding problem on the snake. Hopefully the Vet visit has been made and the mouth rot is being treated for by now.

As for the snake not looking as aberrant as Dan would have liked - IF accurate photos were sent of the EXACT animal before purchase and the customer agreed to buy the animal based on those photos and the EXACT animal in the photos was shipped to the customer, then the breeder/seller can't be at fault for this. Especially, if the issue with the snake has to do with the pattern of the animal. In my opinion, there really is no room for discrepancies between a photo of the animal and the actual animal when you are looking at pattern (as opposed to color).

I don't think Mike would knowingly sell anyone a sick snake and I don't think Dan purposely neglected the animal to cause this either. It sounds like the current situation may have resulted from a series of miscommunication between the seller and the buyer about the seriousness/condition of the problem and hopefully, in the end, everything can be remedied and the animal will be okay.

Thanks,
Celia

 

[The Mad Poet]

I do not, as the previous poster, have a long history with Mr. Taylor. Instead, like the OP, I'm a more recent customer. But I have had absolutely no problem with either him, his service, or the animal purchased from him. In fact, Mike has been quite a bit easier and more pleasant to buy from than many of the bigger breeders I have dealt with. He has been nothing but concientious from the very first contact I made about being certain that I felt I had enough and high enough quality pictures to accurately represent what I was buying (in fact, I think that she's quite a bit better looking in person than she was represented to me, but no complaints!). He has kept in good contact prior to and regarding the shipping, and continued to do so checking up on the animal's health and condition, as well as my satisfaction, afterwards. This is for a comparitively miniscule purchase, and so I find it a bit of a long stretch to believe that this is the same guy who would allegedly stiff someone out of the animal they paid for and then turn his back on complaints of poor health. If you have had the snake that long before trouble set in, I have to agree that the problem is on your end. This is not some kind of sickness or parasite with a long gestation we're talking about, after all.

I agree that the problem is likely to have originated with shipping stress, as I have purchased healthy animals from well-trusted individuals and ended up with still healthy, but similarly dehydrated snakes. The problem probably should have been addressed better on your end earlier on. Has a vet been seen yet? At this point everything else is just water over the bridge; I just hope this gets cleared up and the animal is all right.

Alicia LaBelle

 

[JCCS]

I have no real opinion one way or the other on the situation and it all looks like it has been aired out reasonably, but I do want to back up Mike on the claim that this Bennett guy emailed a lot of people on the Kingsnake classifieds. I received one of these emails and was pretty peeved to have my email used for his whining even if it was just.

Chris Canada-Smith

 

[Serafim]

im going to say from what i have read, that improper husbandry was the issue here.

I agree... If shedding was an issue from the start why don't you mist more frequently. A little more humidity might have done the trick. And as for temps my snakes have been known to refuse feeding at higher temps. I don't see anything posted showing Michael Taylor as a bad guy....

 

[Jim O]

I don't see anything posted showing Michael Taylor as a bad guy....

I agree with that.

I also plan on pursing a Defamation of charactor lawsuit.

Don't even threaten to go down that slippery slope. It will only make things worse for you in the end. If this issue dies a slow death of its own you will be better served.

 

[rick c]

We have purchased from Michael Taylor @ Boas Etc and have never had a problem with him or any of his animals, I would also like to add, We were also recipients of Dans email bashing Michaels customer service and husbandry.

 

[oregonboas]

I have worked with Michael Taylor on several occasions, trades and purchases. His animals are ALWAYS in top condition. I have spoken with Michael for hours on the phone and can tell you that he is one of a few guys out there that I would buy from sight unseen. His emails, phone calls and shipments have all occurred when and how he said they would. He is a good guy... hands down.

Oh, Mr. Bennet,
I have a copy of "The Boa Constrictor Manual" that I would be happy to send to you. Just shoot me your address and it will be on the way... priority.

 

[Serafim]

Can anyone who has this email posted on K.S. post a copy... I would like to see what was said.. Or was it already posted and I missed it..

 

[Rainbowboaman]

I have dealt with Michael in the past with being both the buyer & seller & always had great transactions. In July 2007 I purchased 5 boas from a Jungle to Salmon breeding & all are doing great & growing like weeds. The only issue I have is I sold one a couple months later before seeing the intense reds come in on these. Im kicking myself in the @ss for selling that 1.

 

[rick c]

Here's ours!
This my experience with Mike Taylor of Boas Etc. I purchased 2 jungle boas,
one female hypo jungle and a male jungle normal. When both arrived I sent an
email that they both looked fine, but I was unhappy about the patterning of
the male. Within the next week or so, the male looked more and more dried out
and dehydrated. It took a month to get him to eat. I called Michael instead of
emailing and he told me keep him posted about his condition. Finally he ate
but was still very dry and skinny. He ate a second meal and went into a shed.
He had a very bad shed and shed in pieces and the top third of him did not
even shed at this point.

I called Michael, several times throughout and he kept putting me off etc.
Finally after 45 days or so he went into a shed cycle again and now started to
develope mouth rot due to not having the old shed gone yet. Michael told me he
stands behind his snakes except when a customer does something wrong. Well, he
is in a 32 qt tub by himself. The temps are kept at 80 in the front and 90 in
the back on paper towels for subtrate. The room is kept at 65 to 75% humidity
on its own. Also the snake was soaked 3 different times to help assist in
getting rid of the old shed. It still has not come off. I sent all the pics to
Michael and he also stated that the snake could have developed the mouth rot
from the old shed as well, take him to a vet. I also have 20 other snakes and
the female I got from him is in the tub above him and doing great. No other
snake I have has this problem. I spoke with several breeders including John
from Salmon Boa and all the people I spoke to said the same thing. He must
have been sent sick bc I didn't have enough time to affect him in any way.
When a snake doesn't eat for a month, something is wrong. According to
Michael that's what snakes do.

I have tried to continue to call him and he wil not answer his phone. He
claims that many top breeders call him to ask whether a snake is a jungle or
not. That was not the feedback I got from the people I spoke to. All I have
requested is to have him take the snake back and send me a healthy snake in
it's place. He said he sent all my emails to top breeders etc. He never makes
mention of the numerous phone calls and all we spoke about. Also he never sent
feed/shed/id cards like he said he would. I have no idea how old and when this
snake was born.

So in conclusion, remember sometimes, you never know who you are buying from
until you buy. Use my experience as a an indicator of what to expect. It's not
you won't get a healthy snake but if you get a sick one, this is how he will
handle it. When you spend any money, especially over 2k I feel you should get
great customer service as well. That doesn't exist here. Save your money and
buy from some proven breeders that have awesome customer service. I have
purchased from Burke Reptiles, SDI (Steve Ihrig), Susquehanna Ectotherms (Ted
Thompson), Herps Limited Inc (Tom Crutchfield), Boas By Bell (Mike Bell) etc.
I have purchased from several awesome breeders and have had nothing but
incredible customer service. If you'd like any recommendations please let me
know. Feel free to contact me for any other info. Dan



----------------------------------------------

 

[embuhaly]

I purchased a female salmon jungle from Michael. She is a gorgeous, healthy animal that has been absolutely problem free. I wouldn't think twice about purchasing another animal from him.

 

[Serafim]

Thanks Rick... Looks like the same thing he posted to begin this thread..

 

[jscrick]

Poor little boa's temp was too high and his humidity too dry. Nobody mentioned what % of the tub was at 90F and what % was 80F, did they? Could have been 90% floorspace @ 90deg.F for all we know. Which is too warm for baby boas. IMO males are less tolerant to heat than females. They like it a little cooler. They just don't seem as sturdy as females. Anyway, doesn't sound to me like paper towels would be anywhere near adequate to maintain the proper humidity with under belly heat (I'm assuming). What would help would be a fully contained hide box full of damp sphagnum and a hole drilled in it. Seclusion, humidity, contact security, and a sheding medium. How about that.
I got here by searching your name (Mike Taylor) after viewing your GTP's on KS.com's photo forum. Unfortunate you have to go through such unpleasantness, but I got all the referrals I need.
Can't wait to buy from you.
John Crickmer
Austin, TX