Bad Guy Never do any transactions with Anthony Hosek

[laterob]

Especially with my plan to post some cool stuff on here.

Post this: How many snakes you got from Anthony, when you got them, when they died, etc. I'd like to see a timeline from your first contact to your text about making a BOI thread, as several other people have asked for. Any other information pertinent to your accusations would also be nice.

That would be some cool stuff.

 

[laterob]

I'm offended by the way your trying to accuse me of something.

I don't think he is buying them from registered breeders or from high known individuals; rather he is buying them from somewhere else (like craigslist or something similar) and re selling them on his behalf for more. For all I know, he could be doing that.

Hello, Pot! I'm kettle!

I've reread my posts a bunch of times, and I just can't find where I accused you of something. Several valid questions have been asked of you, though, and IMHO you haven't done a very good job of answering them (yet). As for offending you, I couldn't care less there, Scooby. You started this parade.

My GUESS is that, indeed, you bought some snakes that died and were replaced with hatchlings. Months later, more snakes (one?) died, at which point Anthony didn't feel obligated to compensate you again, so you told him you'd bring it here. For all I know, you could be doing that.

 

[juniorsSerpents]

I found the link for the snakes Anthony was selling as albino and normal motleys. That were in fact Creamcicles and rootbeers. just for a FYI.
http://www.cornsnakes.com/forums/showthread.php?t=102874

 

[Dennis Hultman]

I am assuming you didn't read the rules of the BOI. You cannot go posting a bad guy thread without solid evidence to back your claims.

That's not a rule. Never has been. Although we have always been about providing proof to strengthen cases. It has always been highly suggested.

So let me provide the only mention about proof in the rules.

Proof is optional, but recommended if you would like to remove any doubts about the truth of what you are posting. But this is purely up to you, just as the believability of what you post is purely up to the reader of your words.

The last year are so we have seemed to have moved to immediately beating the heck out of someone the minute they come on without email proof before anything is even disputed by the two parties. He states he doesn't have any.

Without any evidence the case is weaker and the readers can decide what weight to give it. The OP states he doesn't have email correspondence. Not all transactions have a paper trail. Not a good idea but it happens.

There is other lines of questioning that can be used to help establish the claims. I would also like to hear from the target of the thread.

Valid questions are there already such as asking why continue dealing with such a seller and the timeline.

Brian did you send him pictures of the deceased snakes? Did you send any of them for necropsy? Did you send pictures of the mis-sexed snake? Take a video? Or did he accept it on face value? If you did you could post those.

You stated he agreed to replace them so I will assume unless he disagrees that he accepted the fact they are dead. I think if I had them near 80+ other snakes the first thing would to find out is why they are dead. Particularly with multiple deaths. I would want to get some results back on the cause and protect my stock.

 

[Dennis Hultman]

Brian, if all you state is true, we still will not know the cause of death without a necropsy report. Were they all in the same rack?

On the mis-sexed snakes, unfortunately it happens. A good seller would try to make it right. At least I would. Although, I think it prudent to verify the sex when you receive them. What was the TOS on this point?


Also, I have noticed a discrepancy already in your first and third posts.


Your first post states

I've had four adult corns die on me within the last year that I got from him.

I also bought a pair of silver queens and one turned out being a female after I asked him directly before I purchased them and he swore up and down that it was a male and female.

You state clearly in your first post that you had four adult corns die. You then go on to say ALSO that the mis-sexed snake was the silver queens but in your last post you state the silver queen was the dead one. So is it one of the dead ones or mis-sexed ones?

After the Silverqueen died, I sent him a text message telling him that I was going to put up a thread on here (the boi) about him so that other people won't have the same encounter.

 

[Dennis Hultman]

I also bought a pair of silver queens and one turned out being a female after I asked him directly before I purchased them and he swore up and down that it was a male and female.

If I bought a pair I would hope one turned out to be a female.

 

[Dennis Hultman]

I sent Anthony a link to this thread. He hasn't logged in on the site since November. Here is his user profile here.

http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/forums/member.php?u=73336

 

[Revolution1221]

That's not a rule. Never has been. Although we have always been about providing proof to strengthen cases. It has always been highly suggested.

So let me provide the only mention about proof in the rules.

Oh crap my bad. Guess I need to freshen up on the rules myself lol. I guess it is more of an unwritten rule. I appologize for that statement.

 

[Revolution1221]

I guess it is just a good reminder to ALWAYS keep records until transactions are fully finished. It can be hard to keep records from that long ago but if you have multiple bad transactions and continue to buy from someone then it would be wise to keep records then.

 

[Wolfy-hound]

I've been trying to think of anything that could be caused by the seller that would cause a snake to die over 6 months later?

 

[Matt2979]

I've been trying to think of anything that could be caused by the seller that would cause a snake to die over 6 months later?

I was wondering this same thing. I only offer a 7-day health guarantee on any animal I sell, not because that's as long as I think it'll stay healthy, but because bad husbandry can cause problems (sickness, death) fairly quickly. How long do you think your seller should be responsible for any health problems that might arise? From your own statements, it sounds like you want a lifetime guarantee. Even with good husbandry, sometimes things just happen.

Were these animals quarantined? If not, Dennis hit the nail on the head when asking about a necropsy. The procedure is not cheap, but certainly not as expensive as losing your entire collection.

 

[tenchu]

I see that this buyer has never read a BOI thread before and still used it as a tool to target the seller for not meeting his "demands". If what the op is claiming to be true then shame on the seller. I can't pass a judgment unless Others not friends with the op chime in with their experiences, OR at least hear from the seller directly. I do wonder why the buyer would continue to do business with a person like that if there wasn't something good there to begin with. I have dealt with people for years some transactions went south but some went extremely well, sometimes when things went south the seller was able to compensate me for what was lost other times the herp was not replaceable, so I got a partial where the seller met me half way so I didn't feel the sting of the loss too much.

not trying to discredit the op just trying to hear both sides to this story.

 

[lauraleellbp]

I've been trying to think of anything that could be caused by the seller that would cause a snake to die over 6 months later?

Yeah if I were a seller I'd be pretty skeptical and wouldn't feel any responsibility at all after 6+ months without some sort of proof (most likely a professional necropsy) that there was something wrong with the animals while they were still in my care.

I'd definitely want more proof than has been offered here thus far.

 

[laterob]

I just contacted Anthony. He is aware of this thread and told me he will look at it tonight (after work).

 

[East_Coast]

To me this seems like a worthless "bad guy" thread to start.

Brian, a better way to spend your time instead of starting this would be to learn how to sex snakes.

I mean c'mon... you are a "snake breeder" right but you can't correctly sex an adult corn snake on sight? I am not jumping on you for the sake of it: it's just that your credibility is severely lacking from the start.

It's amazing how many "snake breeders" there are but I guess since a .com url costs about $9.99 a year everyone can be a "professional snake breeder".

Brian, close the computer and go handle your snakes. Learn how to tell if something is wrong by observing your snakes and learn how to sex your snakes on your own.

Stop blaming other people because you are a novice with more snakes than you can handle.

 

[Albinoscooby]

Alright I'll try to get all of these questions answered. Here is the time frame I had them for. My main point here didn't have anything to do with my husbandry not being up to bar. I have excellent husbandry skills. The only Adult snakes that have died on me have all been from him.

The reason I continued to do business with Anthony was because he offered me a good deal on some hatchlings last year. I've not had any problems with my hatchlings that I've gotten off him as I've said before. We've all made the mistake of mis sexing a snake. Even the best of us. I asked him twice face to face when I purchased the Silver Queens and he said that he guarantees its a male. When I found out it was a female, I decided I would just keep the two females instead. Anthony knows his morphs and corn snakes pretty well, but the main point again of this entire thread is that his ADULT corns have problems; not his hatchlings. Just like the moderator Dennis Holtman said "Beating the heck out of each other" As I said earlier, why can't we help each other out? You guys are turning my thread into a World War.

Is there really a need for all of the name calling around here? What does calling me a Novice Breeder have anything to do with my snakes I got off of him dying on me? Obviously I have a lot of other herps that haven't died and are all healthy. Yes I quarantined the snakes. Thirteen years of snake owning doesn't sound like a Novice to me. I'm new to breeding yes, but that doesn't mean I don't know what I'm dealing with and researched what I cross before I crossed them. I'm not just crossing whatever I have and hoping for the best here. I hatched out some Phantoms just last week, so I know what I'm doing to some point obviously. Again, I'm simply telling you guys my experience with him and suggesting you guys don't buy any ADULTS from him. Plain and simple. Everything always has to turn into a fight or an argument; like

All of his Adult snakes have been sketchy eaters off and on also. I've had other adults I've purchased that eat anything that I put in front of them and never refuse. His on the other hand, eat, then don't, then eat, then refuse, refuse, refuse, etc.

When I asked for a refund, he refused but offered a replacement snake. I told him I don't want any adult snakes anymore from him, and that I would rather have hatchlings due to my situation of living right now. I may not be able to keep all my snakes here where I'm living now, so its kind of up in the air at the moment.

Candy Cane - bought last summer, lived for 4 months roughly
Creamsicle Motley - bought last summer - died 2 months ago
Blizzard (sold as a male) - bought in autumn, died earlier this year.
Silver Queens - Both bought no more than 4 months ago, one died recently and the other is a skeptical eater.
The link below shows that he was selling it as an Amel Motley, and NOT a Creamsicle Motley. I didn't find that thread when I purchased her. I was talking VIA text message.
http://www.cornsnakes.com/forums/showthread.php?t=96033

here are a few pictures....
1. Silverqueen that died this weekend
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/192/deadsq.jpg/

2. these are a few pictures from Anthony. Male and Female clearly co habbed in the same small cage with one another. This is an example of bad husbandry. when I saw these picutres, I even told him in response to separate the male from female asap that its always a bad idea to co hab. If one doesn't have enough room for their own cage, you shouldn't get them. Period.
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/194/anthoycohab1.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/232/anthonycohab2.jpg/

for now, I'll put this up. I will try to retrieve the messages off of my phone but you know how smart phones work. Sometimes its more hassel

 

[Wolfy-hound]

So the snakes all lived at least 4 months before dying? What exactly do you think caused them to die? How could something happening over 4 months earlier suddenly cause the animal to die?

 

[Mango]

So lemme get this straight. You bought snakes from a guy who you think takes poor care of them, you had them for a month or so, and they died? Wow...

 

[~Just Curious~]

I do agree that it does sound like something's wrong with the animals he sends you

His snakes always go from feeding, to not feeding, then they start to loose weight, then regurging, passing their food unhealthily, etc., then they die off.

but I'm wondering what it actually is. Have you taken any to a vet yet?
After seeing it end badly so many times

"His snakes always" ... "die off."

I'd think you'd want to take the others showing problems in for testing so that you might figure it out and work on fixing it before they end up like the others.

You said one silverqueen just died this weekend. I'm not entirely sure what the timeframe is, but is it too late for a necropsy?
It sounds like the other silverqueen is still alive, but you say that it's not doing well either. Given the pattern, I think you should take it in before it goes downhill like the other.
It's pretty important that you figure out exactly what this is. It'll clear a lot of things up and hopefully prevent the same thing from happening to the remaining ones.

Some people could word it a bit nicer, but the reason they're questioning your husbandry is because the animals were in your care for so long. In that amount of time, even a healthy animal could get sick from improper care. It doesn't mean that has to be what caused it at all, but the creamsicle motley lived with you just short of a year, that probably would have passed most quarantine periods so this is pretty worrying...

Also, and I'm honestly not trying to "bash" you, but it just seems to me that your stance on him flips back and forth a lot.
You've said he's the worst breeder you've ever met, that he breaks the first rule of what not to do, clearly has bad husbandry, and to avoid him at all costs - but you also say that you continue to do business with him because he gives you such good deals on hatchlings and you've only had trouble with the adults from him. You also stated that you're up in the air about accepting more snakes from him as a replacement, not because of his husbandry, but because your living arrangements aren't ideal at the moment.
I just think that if he's as bad as you claim and houses them in ways you don't agree with, that you shouldn't want any more animals from him period. No exceptions, no matter how good of a deal. Especially since you believe he has some bug in his collection. You stated in your first post that you knew several other breeders and never had any trouble with them. I would have stuck with them right away instead of returning back to this guy after the first problem or two.

Just my two cents~
I really hope the remaining animals pull though. Please do all you can for them!

 

[anthony hosek]

well I think most of you have taken care of my thoughts on this situation. please let me know if you have any specific questions.Thanks Anthony Hosek