New Leo, lots of questions

[Leighanne]

You guys are funny!! I see the guys point pinkies should of never been feed to Leos, but were and then proven ok even though they are INSECTivoires! Maybe not Goldfish, but maybe some kind of fish will be proven some day. Alex, if you do it with the other guys cool, but I wouldn't try it with a Leo. Feed them crickets. If you wanna feed weird stuff to something try a TARANTULA! Their SWEET!!! I'm Canada over here by the way, just sayin.

 

[A_Kendergirl]

If you can't even get HUMAN anatomy right...what makes you think you're even SLIGHTLY qualified to question the digestive properties of an insectivore? Listen (for once) to the people that DO know what they are talking about. If that's too much trouble for you, give those poor leos to someone who will actually care about giving them a correct diet.

 

[A_Kendergirl]

At least in the wild, leos have an opportunity to come upon a nest of small mammals. I have ZERO doubt that if a leo were to happen upon a nest of rodent babies, it would do it's best to clean it out. A leo would NEVER have an opportunity in the wild to eat fish, therefore it would not have evolved the ability to properly digest one.

 

[Xelas]

This was all said to me before, on the Dragon forum. They were wrong there. Yes, I risked my Dragons' health, and yes, that may have been unethical, but I WAS RIGHT. There have been times (very few, but still times) when I was too busy to go and get crickets/roaches/pinkies for my Dragons, and so I fed them goldfish. Granted, there were times (in the very beginning) when he had runny stools, but now its almost as if they've learned (or their bodies have adapted) to cope with it. I've put a water bowl in with fish and they've both gone after them! They only caught one once in the water (when I lowered the water level), but this still proves that I'm right. I came in here asking about it because I wanted someone to prove me wrong. I wanted someone to tell me "no, don't feed them fish, mine DIED after I fed it fish." All you guys are saying is you're too scared to try it. That may be harsh for me to say, and I do care about my pets, but why not try something new? I don't even know how many months its been since I posted that last thread, but my Dragons are still here.

I am hesitant to feed a leopard gecko a fish because its not the same as a Dragon, it doesnt look as tough or resistant. But nonetheless, I WILL feed it fish, I WILL risk its life, and wrong or right, I'll do it because no one else has ever done it before. And months from now, when my leo is still alive and eating fish (like my Dragons), I'll come on here and tell you all about it. I'll even write a book or an article or something about it and one day when you all read it, when I prove I'm right, when people everywhere feed their dragons and their leos fish without harm to their animals, I wonder if you all will grow some balls and take a "risk." Its not cutting corners. Its just something different.

 

[TripleMoonsExotic]

Good luck.

Seeing your lack of ethics & interest in the well being of your animals, you are definitely on my do not buy or sell to list. Have fun.

 

[BalloonzForU]

Good luck.

Seeing your lack of ethics & interest in the well being of your animals, you are definitely on my do not buy or sell to list. Have fun.

Well said, same goes for me.

 

[Cat_72]

This was all said to me before, on the Dragon forum. They were wrong there. Yes, I risked my Dragons' health, and yes, that may have been unethical, but I WAS RIGHT. There have been times (very few, but still times) when I was too busy to go and get crickets/roaches/pinkies for my Dragons, and so I fed them goldfish. Granted, there were times (in the very beginning) when he had runny stools, but now its almost as if they've learned (or their bodies have adapted) to cope with it. I've put a water bowl in with fish and they've both gone after them! They only caught one once in the water (when I lowered the water level), but this still proves that I'm right. I came in here asking about it because I wanted someone to prove me wrong. I wanted someone to tell me "no, don't feed them fish, mine DIED after I fed it fish." All you guys are saying is you're too scared to try it. That may be harsh for me to say, and I do care about my pets, but why not try something new? I don't even know how many months its been since I posted that last thread, but my Dragons are still here.

I am hesitant to feed a leopard gecko a fish because its not the same as a Dragon, it doesnt look as tough or resistant. But nonetheless, I WILL feed it fish, I WILL risk its life, and wrong or right, I'll do it because no one else has ever done it before. And months from now, when my leo is still alive and eating fish (like my Dragons), I'll come on here and tell you all about it. I'll even write a book or an article or something about it and one day when you all read it, when I prove I'm right, when people everywhere feed their dragons and their leos fish without harm to their animals, I wonder if you all will grow some balls and take a "risk." Its not cutting corners. Its just something different.

All you have proven is that your dragons haven't died YET, (that doesn't mean they are HEALTHY), that you don't give a about your animal's health or well being, and that you shouldn't be allowed to own an animal. If can actually be "too busy" too buy its food, then you shouldn't own one. Period. I work an average of 50 hours a week (nights), plus take care of my reptiles, horses, and other pets, as well as raise a family, driving my kids to school, football practice, cook their dinner, and wash their clothes. And I have NEVER been "too busy" to find time to get my animals the food they need. NEVER.

We don't need to "grow some balls" (especially the women here), we simply believe in doing what is right for our animals. Perhaps when you're old enough for your balls to actually drop, you'll learn that, along with common sense and perhaps a shred of respect.

 

[SirKevin]

Firstly...you're a friggin idiot. I'd have no sympathy for you if you were flogged to death with some sort of metal bar. None. That is how I feel about people of your ilk.

Secondly, why did you even bother posting this under the auspisces of a question? It was obviously just a thinly-veiled attempt at creating a figurative forum for you to stroke your own ego and your creative 'genius.' Really, was there ever an actual question? There wasn't. You're not only retarded, but you're deceptive (and pretty mediocre being so, too) and arrogant.

 

[WebSlave]

I strongly suggest everyone to refrain from the derogatory name calling in the discussion forums. I grudgingly allow it in the BOI, but that is about it. You can argue and disagree, but if you can't do so without name calling and belittlement of another member, then I suggest you go elsewhere.

 

[Lucille]

it I WILL feed it fish, I WILL risk its life, .

I don't think that risking the life of the critters that depend on you for everything is a very logical approach to life. There are many things bad for your pets, and for you, for that matter. Do you eat goldfish?

I didn't think so.

 

[Xelas]

Well said, same goes for me.

Well Stef and Feli, it’s good to know that. If I ever get desperate enough to buy from either of you, I’ll make sure to use another name when I’m ordering, but don’t hold your breath on that one.

 

[Xelas]

All you have proven is that your dragons haven't died YET, (that doesn't mean they are HEALTHY), that you don't give a about your animal's health or well being, and that you shouldn't be allowed to own an animal. If can actually be "too busy" too buy its food, then you shouldn't own one. Period. I work an average of 50 hours a week (nights), plus take care of my reptiles, horses, and other pets, as well as raise a family, driving my kids to school, football practice, cook their dinner, and wash their clothes. And I have NEVER been "too busy" to find time to get my animals the food they need. NEVER.

We don't need to "grow some balls" (especially the women here), we simply believe in doing what is right for our animals. Perhaps when you're old enough for your balls to actually drop, you'll learn that, along with common sense and perhaps a shred of respect.

Ok Mrs. Middle-Aged-Superman...uh....Woman-thing-Housewife, I'll work on that "time" thing....and that other thing you were talking about, something about balls......dropping? Actually, on second thought I like mine right where they are: in-between my legs. Nothing in-between yours though, right, Mrs. Thing. But then again, you're not supposed to have them. Not even proverbial ones. Guess that's why you're scared. Its like Mobb Deep said about "Shook Ones." Go ask your kids, or google it, you might learn somethin.

 

[Xelas]

Firstly...you're a friggin idiot. I'd have no sympathy for you if you were flogged to death with some sort of metal bar. None. That is how I feel about people of your ilk.

Secondly, why did you even bother posting this under the auspisces of a question? It was obviously just a thinly-veiled attempt at creating a figurative forum for you to stroke your own ego and your creative 'genius.' Really, was there ever an actual question? There wasn't. You're not only retarded, but you're deceptive (and pretty mediocre being so, too) and arrogant.

If you read my 1st question when I first acquired my leo, I was asking general questions about leos and their care. Things I wanted to ask the “knowledgeable” people within this forum, but have yet to find complete answers (other than from Kenny, who was just about the only person who told me something I didn’t know. Thanks Kenny). So my general questions turned into this fish-battle where I am yet again bombarded with the naysayers and small-minded people who spend their idle time on this forum. There’s a whole wide world out there, go find yourselves some sort of life.

If I wanted to “stroke my own ego and my creative genius” I would sit in front of the mirror and stare at myself while I chattered and babbled until I ran out of things to talk about just to hear myself speak. I don’t do either of those things, I don’t come onto people’s topics without contributing something like some people do.

So did you have a response to any of my questions, or did you just wanna try out some new vocabulary you learned for a spelling bee in English class? I got something for you, here’s what you should do: go find yourself a big, nice mirror, sit down in a comfortable chair and start talking.

 

[Xelas]

I strongly suggest everyone to refrain from the derogatory name calling in the discussion forums. I grudgingly allow it in the BOI, but that is about it. You can argue and disagree, but if you can't do so without name calling and belittlement of another member, then I suggest you go elsewhere.

opps, sorry Mr. Website Owner-Guy Rich, Sir. I saw this post a little after I made my other comments, just going down the list, you know.

They told the Wrights brothers that if humans were meant to fly, we would have been born with wings. Yet now we have planes. Galileo, Picasso and Da Vinci were thought by some to be geniuses, and by others to be lunatics. Yet they all saw things that others could not see. For hundreds of years, breeders all across the world took a wild species, whatever that may be, domesticated them, and made varieties, colors, and morphs. These great thinkers thought outside of the box, they tried something different, something against their society's modern way of life and current views of how things "should be done." Thanks to them, their legacies have lived on into our world, and our time.

I dare not compare myself to these historical giants, but I can not help but wonder about doing something different. I never asked for any opinions, I asked for facts. Something I have not yet gotten, only speculation. Forgive me if I come across as bratty or as a know-it-all, I know that I don't know it all which is why I asked the questions I asked. But some people like to bicker, some like a good confrontation, some people like to fight. Well I say, bring it on because without facts, they've got nothing.

 

[Xelas]

I don't think that risking the life of the critters that depend on you for everything is a very logical approach to life. There are many things bad for your pets, and for you, for that matter. Do you eat goldfish?

I didn't think so.

Its not risking the life, its more like risking a stomach ache. Fish are not poisonous to lizards, they just aren't really eaten by many except monitors. And of course it's a logical approach to life. If I do what everyone else has done, it is fair to say that I would have pretty much the same results. I want to experiment, I want different results. I am prepared to receive bad results but I am not afraid of those bad results enough to sacrifice the good results. There are many things bad for our pets, but how can you say with a certainty that any one thing is bad without someone trying it?

And as a matter of fact, I do eat a kind of Goldfish. Its called "Carp."

 

[Leighanne]

So....have you tried it yet?

 

[Xelas]

So....have you tried it yet?

I'm guessing you mean tried feeding the leopard geckos goldfish? Yes, I have, but its been a bit inconclusive. Its taken a while for them to learn how to eat them, and what they were exactly. They won't eat them alone, so what I've been doing is pulling all but 2 or 3 of the legs off of crickets, dusting them with vitamin and calcium powder, then mixing them with dusted goldfish and putting them all in a bowl.

It has been inconclusive because of the number of crickets they eat in comparison to the goldfish which makes the results a bit biased. That is to say, that for every 1 goldfish I put in the bowl, I put 6 crickets in with it. Soon though, I plan to let them work up their hunger for 4 or 5 days, then feed them as many goldfish as they will eat for about a week and a half or so, then switch them back to crickets, roaches, worms, mealworms, and pinkies and feeding them goldfish every other feeding.

I was sucessful in feeding my Bearded Dragons goldfish though. My female never really took a liking to them but my male eats them like they are his favorite treat. I usually feed the goldfish bloodworms and brineshrimp (cuz it makes them go crazy), special flakes and granules for discus and cichlids (for growth and color), dog food (for fat), and cat food (for protein). The lizards can't pick them up straight from the bottom of their tank, so I have to hold them up to their eye-level or put them somewhere where their heads hang off so the lizards can grab them. Also, due to the protective slime fish have on their scales, it makes them very slippery and the Dragons can usually tear them up, but make a mess trying to eat them. So for this, I dust the goldfish for easy eatings. When I first started, they had runny stools and when I feed them too much, they get runny stools, but so do my dogs when I change their food from one brand to another. When I feed them less fish and more of something else, nothing really changes and they seem healthy. It also gives them some extra water/moisture that they can absorb through the fish. Its all very fun, and when it comes down to it, I can buy 5 large goldfish for the Dragons for $1, and 10 small goldfish for the Geckos for $1, which both usually last me about 2 weeks or so depending on how much I feed them; or $4 in crickets or $8.50 in pinkies/mice which last roughly the same amount of time.

For me, I dont plan on using goldfish to completely replace crickets, roaches, worms, mealworms, or mice, but only as a back-up food source in case I can't get to the store between my 2 jobs, 2 schools, parties, and sleeping/nap time. I don't like to think that my animals are hungry, and I know there are risks, but so far, all is well.

 

[Project Reef]

I'm a noobie to Leos. However, not to fish. Xelas do some research on frozen silversides if you are simply handfeeding. Thaw them out, they are almost boneless, and packed with protein. Digestion with these particular fish isn't a problem. Sprinkle them, then wiggle them in front of your BDs.

The biggest drawback to goldfish are they simply aren't nutritionally dense. Additionally, seeing a fish chomped up and have its guts splattered all over is kinda gross and messy. The last thing I'd want to do is create a mess inside of the reptiles habitat. Lemme know how it works out...

 

[Project Reef]

http://www.thatpetplace.com/FrozenF...ss/Silversides/T1/F29EX+0353+0036/Detail.aspx

 

[Project Reef]

As mentioned, parasites are another problem w/ goldfish. You may also consider breeding mollys.