Bad Guy Off The Ark Exotics

[shedyourfears]

I recently purchased a female emerald tree boa from Off The Ark Exotics (Virginia).

I emailed back and forth with Vinny Ferraiolo about the snake for about a week and talked to him on the phone multiple times.

She is supposed to be CBB 06, but appears quite small considering my 06 male is about 3 times her size.

She was also supposed to be hand tame... she is not as aggressive as most emeralds, but she certainly isn't hand time either.

The most disturbing part is that she arrived at my door with some pretty nasty scale rot on her ventral scales, mites, and what appears to be a respiratory infection (mouth gaping).

Never once were any of these symptoms mentioned via email or phone conversation. Their website says they have a 100% health guarantee, but apparently, none of these things were covered.

They refused to do anything about the problems.

-Jessica McDuff

 

[Utta]

Post emails, pictures etc and make them aware of this thread.

 

[Cp3_Pythons]

Ive delt with Vinny on several occasions and the transactions always went smoothly Im actually shocked about this thread but Yes as Tyler stated post the emails and pics of the Emerald tree boa in question as well as letting Vinny know about this thread..

 

[vferra7777]

Male or Female

Hello Jessica. You also said your expert friend probed her to 5 scales and you were very upset because your expert friend told you 5 scales is a MALE. You called me very upset over me sending you a MALE instead of a female. IS THIS TRUE???? I asked you to recheck that because I figured your expert friend just made a mistake. If your expert friend got that wrong what other "expert" advice has he been giving you.

You told me the scale problem shed out and the mites were gone and she was eating fine on a two week cycle. This is the first time I have heard of the RI problem. How are you keeping her? What size tank, temps, water etc.

Please tell the entire story. What else has this expert friend of yours been telling you? Sounds like she's cool and dry to me. I would double check temps, give her a bedding that holds moisture and get those temps to where they should be based on a thermometer that is affixed to the area UNDER your heat source. Do not use white light as a heat source.

 

[shedyourfears]

I was surprised as well considering he was so friendly and helpful over the phone.

Here is the email correspondance after recieving the animal.

The animal is healthy. The only problems on her external area. Those are very easily treated. That spray makes life easier and the scale rot just sheds out next time. Keep her dry with a large water bowl. Spray the area - the animal and the water bowl. Wait 1/2 hour put both back in and the mite problem is stopped.

I sprayed today. I wish it was not so common but when dealing with hundreds of animals a week, it is bound tyo happen. We check and spray etc but it still happens.

The Ferraiolos
Off The Ark 804.717.2282
www.offthearkexoticpets.com





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From: Jessica McDuff <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Mon, July 5, 2010 8:54:43 PM
Subject: RE: ETB issue

I have tried to feed her, she refused.

I understand that these things happen in the trade, but when paying $400 for an animal, that animal should be healthy before it is shipped.



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Date: Mon, 5 Jul 2010 08:35:02 -0700
From: [email protected]
Subject: Re: ETB issue
To: [email protected]


I really am sorry, but this stuff does happen in the trade. We trade and buy all sorts of animals and treat everything but it still does happen. After next shed, she will be fine. Have you tried to feed her?


The Ferraiolos
Off The Ark 804.717.2282
www.offthearkexoticpets.com





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From: Jessica McDuff <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Mon, July 5, 2010 10:21:00 AM
Subject: RE: ETB issue

Despite quarantining her, I will still be treating all of my other animals.
But I will not be doing business with your company again.
And I will make sure that others know what kind of experience I have had.

-Jessica


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Date: Sun, 4 Jul 2010 19:41:41 -0700
From: [email protected]
Subject: Re: ETB issue
To: [email protected]


I am sorry. I did not know she had mites. It does happen in the business that is why quarantine is a must. Scale rot was from her cage under the chameleon tank. Her perch was wet. If you get some equate lice SPRAY and spray her cage - her and the water bowl the mnites will be gone.

I really am sorry and did not know about the mites. I have treated my animals in that location.

The Ferraiolos
Off The Ark 804.717.2282
www.offthearkexoticpets.com





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From: Jessica McDuff <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Sun, July 4, 2010 9:15:21 PM
Subject: ETB issue

I was observing the female ETB I just got from you...

I was slightly agitated by the fact that she has scale rot and I was not informed of this before purchasing her,
but now I am EXTREMELY unhappy to discover that she also has mites.

If I had known either of these facts, I would not have spent $400 on her.

I figured I should contact you right away.... I hope that you will try to rectify this situation in some way.

Thank you,
Jessica

 

[shedyourfears]

I have her in a 2ft X 16" x 16" Vision cage with an undertank heater fixed to the bottom and one on the back of the enclosure. Her temperature is 84 degrees, with 2 fixed perches. one diagnal and one horizontal. I have a large water source, coco soft bedding and a small plant. I mist her 3 times per day. I use a plain white light during the day to simulate day & night cycles.

I double checked with an emerald breeder and she is a female, I apologize for that. I never said the man was an expert, I just said that I thought he would know, but he admitted that he was wrong.

I never said the scale rot problem had shed out. She has not shed since I got her. She has eaten twice and defecated.

I use a temp gun to check temps as well as a digital thermometer with a probe.

I've never asked husbandry advice from my "expert" friend, as I do my own research in that area.... I just don't feel comfortable probing animals yet, especially delicate arboreal species.

I have had my male ETB for 2 years and never had a problem. I keep him in a very similar set up, the only difference being that his Vision cage is larger because he is about 3 times her size.

 

[shedyourfears]

Here are some pics of her scale rot.

It's starting to look slightly better.... but it runs nearly the entire length of her body.

 

[shedyourfears]

Here are pictures of her "mouth gape."

She has not been making any noises or producing any discharge... just this behavior.

(She is in a bizarre position because I had to disturb her to take pictures of her scale rot)

 

[vferra7777]

Thanx for being honest

So many times people come here and tell just part of the story. That is why I HATE THIS SITE. A friend told me about your post.

This expert was supposed to be the owner or the manager of the pet store you work at?

i would not use white light as a heat source. I prefer to keep the heat source red or purple and use the ambient light in the room for the visible spectrum.

No discharge/noise etc?

That face looks a tooth maybe dislodged or damaged in some way or just a normal figuration she uses.

You said you use the white light during the day, what do you use at night to heat her?

Are the mites gone? Did you treat the animal and cage twice?

I see the pics, looks like a mild case that should shed out first shed. She hasn't shed for you yet?

Be patient. If she is eating and reasonable to handle you are ahead of the curve.

I would definitely get rid of the white light, find the proper wattage red or purple light and double check everything after that.

I DO NOT LIKE NOR RECOMMEND WHITE LIGHT AS A HEAT SOURCE FOR THESE ANIMALS.

 

[Lucille]

So many times people come here and tell just part of the story. That is why I HATE THIS SITE.

And you are here to complete your part of the story. More and more, those participating in a thread here are careful to ask if the 'bad guy' was notified of the complaint, are careful to ask for proof or emails, and if your read a lot of threads you will see that some complaints (I am not at all speaking of this one) are dismissed as retributive, charges by a bad buyer, ec.

The very nature of the BOI encourages a complete account from both sides.

The very nature of the BOI allows prospective purchasers to count up the good/bad threads posted about a particular vendor and make up their own minds.

 

[shedyourfears]

I do NOT use the white light for a heat source.

It is just a regular flourescent fixture that I bought at walmart. It puts off very little heat, perhaps a degree or two at most.

As I said in my post quite clearly, I use heat pads mounted on the bottom and back of the cage hooked up to a thermostat. The perch she sits on is at 84 degrees. The heat pads are on all the time, the light goes off at night. My snake room is very dark which is why I use the white light fixtures. THEY ARE NOT HEAT BULBS... just fixtures that are usually mounted on the underside of cabinets (often in kitchens).

I would have had no problem or reason to complain had you let me know about the scale rot or offered to rectify the situation in some way.

I never claimed that the man was an expert. He owns the pet store that I work at and has probed a lot of snakes. I don't think that it is worth focusing on that he mis-identified the snakes gender. For nearly all other snakes less than 4 scales is female, it was an honest mistake. I had to email a private breeder to learn that this is not the case with ETBs, as I could not find the scale depth online.

The only reason I called you upset was because I have had multiple problems with this snake so far and it would not have surprised me if her gender was incorrect.

I told you that I would let others know about the problems I have had. It's in the email post above.

The problem is not the "white heat light" because that is non-existent. Nor is it the gender of the snake. But you seem to be focusing on both of these, while completely ignoring the fact that you neglected to ever mention to me that the snake had scale rot before you shipped her to me, or that she had mites.

I have treated for mites twice and it seems that they have been erradicated, but this never should have been an issue in the first place.

Working at a pet store myself, I know for a fact that if one of our customers had any problems similar to these that we would work with them to fix the situation.

 

[Maldesto]

So you avoided the 06 question her 06 is 3 times the size of the one you shipped, are you sure its an 06 or does it being an 07 08 09 because its bound to happen eventually within online trading.

 

[Maldesto]

That face looks a tooth maybe dislodged or damaged in some way or just a normal figuration she uses. QUOTE]

You didn't happen to see this before you shipped her, usually people inspect their animals before shipping to see if they would be happy with the animal arriving at their door step and spending money on her. I wouldn't send out a sick animal or a "tooth dislodged or damaged" without getting it checked out first or even warning the buyer of it, but then again i guess some people are different.

 

[shedyourfears]

Honestly, I am not all that concerned with the size of her.

I was a little disappointed when I realized she was too small to breed, because that is the main reason I purchased her, but I was more concerned with her less than pleasing condition.

If this had been a less expensive transaction, I would not be as upset.

I paid $400 shipped for this little lady, and the snake I got was not, in my opinion worth even half that.

 

[vferra7777]

My Opinion

You are entitled to your beliefs and I to mine. Too many times I have seen the same people bashing those on here because of a simple lack of other more worthwhile things to do. Threads continuously veer off into other's personal business, shouting matches, testosterone filled rants. I miss the BOI as it was in the past.

Now Jessica, what would you have me do to rectify this situation to your liking?

 

[shedyourfears]

As I said, I don't think that anyone, including yourself would pay $400 for an animal if you knew that it had scale rot, mites, etc.

Despite the fact that the mites have been successfully treated and the scale rot will shed out in time, I should have been made aware of these issues before making any payments, and certainly before the animal was shipped.

I am not happy that I was forced to make negative public posts about your business, but I tried to deal with you privately to no avail.

I think at very least, some of my money should be refunded.

 

[ShadowAceD]

Mr. Ferraiolo,

I am a bit confused as to why you seem to think that scale rot on any calibur is okay because it will eventually shed out. I am also a bit confused as to why you are essentially shrugging to the animal having mites by stating that it happens in the trade. What I gather from the e-mails you sent her and the posts you have placed here on the BOI, it seems that you figure this to just be something that happens and it is no big deal.

Be that as it may, the buyer is the one stuck with the problems and the buyer is the one stuck with treating the problems.

To me it seems that you believe this to be an acceptable business practice when I, and I am sure many others, would seriously beg to differ. When you assure someone the health of an animal, these things would be under coverage for it. And since you readily admit the scale rot occurred due to something in your facility, I would think that means you are responsible for it.

Food for thought.

 

[Willow]

Vincent, I think one of my main concerns in this situation had I been the person to purchase from you is how your acting like the snake having scale rot is no big deal....now it may not be to you...but personally if I pay $400 for a snake and am not informed of the fact it has scale rot...I'd be pretty mortified when I got my hands on the snake myself. Mites as well...tho I know they happen, as I have received a snake with mites before...but was promptly offered the amount of money it would cost me to go out and buy a can of PAM to get rid of them.

I think had you made a real attempt to resolve this in the first place this may not have ended up on the BOI...I personally think the OP deserves to be reimbursed for having to treat the mites and the scale rot...you yourself informed the OP to go out and purchase things to treat these issues...but these are things that should have been your responsibility in the first place before shipping the snake out.

 

[vferra7777]

AHHHHH

It is the black mail route. No. If you do not want her, you must ship her back and I will refund your money minus shipping. That is the basic guarantee across the board. Send her to:

OFF THE ARK
11334 Ironbridge Road
Chester, Va 23831

I will not do this nickel and dime crap because someone is a little unhappy. It is either all or nothing your choice.

This is being read by those that will add their opinions and grievances and even testosterone but it is still your choice.

I do not pay back shipping on your part

Mites are gone, she is a SHE, she is eating with no regurge. She is a bit smaller than you'd like and has a gape that could have happened over the 6 weeks you have had her.

This is my offer. If you accept, call me to set it up, if you decline start bashing because I will not be adding to anything on here.

 

[ShadowAceD]

Good to see you are a stand up guy when it comes to being reasonable too.

In case anyone misses that, it's sarcasm.

No one is bashing you here, they are trying to figure out exactly what happened and determine their own stance on the situation. You, however, are making it rather easy.

Most people to have animals returned minus shipping, this is true, but when the animal left your facility damaged (as you stated) and when the animal carried mites (you admitted it was likely from your facility in more or less words as well), then you should refund everything. You won't, of course, but this is what you should do.

Good luck keeping your business in tact with your business ethics, or lack thereof.