Bad Guy Outbackreptiles.com

[Mike Schultz]

I was just curious as to what morphs were ordered.

Did Josh just so happen to accidently ship the correct morph and sex of leos out of the ones he wasn't suppose to sell?

Wholesale mixed lot.

 

[Tony C]

He was running an ad on kingsnake for lots of 10 mixed morph babies, so there weren't any specific morphs that were supposed to be shipped. I would post the ad but it seems to have been pulled in the last day or so...

 

[john_]

I don't care how busy someone is, there is no way you could pack these animals for shipping and not realize that something is very wrong with them. No matter how much is going on, a person still has to look at the gecko, catch it, put it in a cup, and pack the cup into a box, and the MBD is so obvious it could not be missed. Bottom line is they tried to dump some very sick geckos on someone, got called on it, and are now trying to sweep it under the rug and pretend like nothing ever happened.

I promised myself I wouldn't respond but whatever. I will say that I have no connection to Josh or Outback Reptiles other than my recent (and happy) transaction. That being said...I believe what you said there is an opinion, not a fact. I've done some pretty stupid stuff while distracted. Wouldn't pretending nothing happened mean denying the situation and any wrong doing? Correct me if I'm wrong but usually when people say "I made a mistake" they are acknowledging an error occurred. Either way it's sad that it happened and now he's trying to fix the situation. Again, I'm responding as a customer of Outback Reptiles and can tell you I'm satisfied. Either I'm the most lucky guy in the world to get his only healthy animal OR it's reasonable to say that this could have possibly been a mistake.

 

[john_]

I promised myself I wouldn't respond but whatever. I will say that I have no connection to Josh or Outback Reptiles other than my recent (and happy) transaction. That being said...I believe what you said there is an opinion, not a fact. I've done some pretty stupid stuff while distracted. Wouldn't pretending nothing happened mean denying the situation and any wrong doing? Correct me if I'm wrong but usually when people say "I made a mistake" they are acknowledging an error occurred. Either way it's sad that it happened and now he's trying to fix the situation. Again, I'm responding as a customer of Outback Reptiles and can tell you I'm satisfied. Either I'm the most lucky guy in the world to get his only healthy animal OR it's reasonable to say that this could have possibly been a mistake.

Since I couldn't edit the above post, per the BOI rules I wanted to add my full name.

John Graziani

 

[Tony C]

That being said...I believe what you said there is an opinion, not a fact. I've done some pretty stupid stuff while distracted.

It was stupid for them to send those geckos out, but no way it was a mistake. No reasonable person could look at them, pick them up, and pack them without realizing they were in terrible shape.

Wouldn't pretending nothing happened mean denying the situation and any wrong doing?

You mean like the way he keeps insisting that he never sold anything to the OP and she has absolutely no involvement in this? Yeah, I would say that qualifies as attempting to hide what he did.[/QUOTE]

Either I'm the most lucky guy in the world to get his only healthy animal OR it's reasonable to say that this could have possibly been a mistake.

So they flipped you some good snakes, and flipped her some bad geckos. I'll take my business to a real breeder where the quality of the animals being sold isn't a coin toss.

 

[john_]

It was stupid for them to send those geckos out, but no way it was a mistake. No reasonable person could look at them, pick them up, and pack them without realizing they were in terrible shape.

We could spin in circles all day. Again, not a fact.

You mean like the way he keeps insisting that he never sold anything to the OP and she has absolutely no involvement in this? Yeah, I would say that qualifies as attempting to hide what he did.

I could be mistaken (this is a big thread) but I was fairly certain the OP was a relative of who he sold to geckos to. Would he know that I gave the snake he sold me to someone else? Maybe, but most likely not.

So they flipped you some good snakes, and flipped her some bad geckos. I'll take my business to a real breeder where the quality of the animals being sold isn't a coin toss.

You're certainly entitled to do so. On the flip side I'd love to do business with him again.

 

[Geckomomma]

not trying to defend anybody here, and def. not saying it's right to let geckos get in that condition let alone sell them. but thought i would add that i've bought a few snakes from outback in person at shows and all were nice and fat and at a great price, not to mention thriving. but they def. didn't have anything looking like those geckos on the table. again not trying to defend anybody cause u must be in one hell of a hurry to not catch especialy the one looking so bad. :rolleyes but i wouldn't be so quick to say they don't care about there animals because out of the tons of stuff i've seen then have out at shows i've never seen any look close to that. maybe they did just get them in for free and were nursing them back to the living. still don't see how u can not notice when u put them in the box.

Of course the ones at the shows were "nice and fat"... no one would take an animal to a show that was in the condition these leos were in while they're trying to advertise. You take your REALLY nice animals to shows, and leave the ones you neglect at home.

I don't care if the niece wasn't the one who paid with the card. Those geckos took months to get to that point, and if someone is so blind that they "accidently" pack them... come ON. You have to pick them up, and when they have MBD that badly, if you're not being careful with them... wow. I'm just gonna stop there because there is so much wrong with saying it was an accident when you can clearly see they were sick.

Regardless... full refund and vet bills. And whoever you're buying wholesale geckos from, if they "felt bad" and didn't want to put them in the freezer bin... the fact is they HAVE a freezer bin. That whole defense is a load...

BTW... since you obviously need help with taking care of geckos.. even if they're were grabbed at random and packed, you're supposed to quarantine sick geckos from healthy ones. If you quarantined, there never would have been a "mistake". How do you explain that?????



Sarah Tomlin

 

[DAND]

Good God are some people so thick as to not see the obvious? The FACT is those animals were not only accepted (from a big breeder my ass), they were kept and shipped out, mistakenly or not it was done, period.

Again FACT, those animals were abused and neglected, no if's and's or but's. Doing business with someone who treats their animals in that way condones and supports such treatment. That is bad business any way you look at it. To continue to do business with Outback is also condoning and supporting this unacceptable treatment of animals as they obviously support and do business with those who treat their animals as the pictures have shown and as their 3 employees have admitted to.

 

[rjarosek]

Good God are some people so thick as to not see the obvious? The FACT is those animals were not only accepted (from a big breeder my ass), they were kept and shipped out, mistakenly or not it was done, period.

Again FACT, those animals were abused and neglected, no if's and's or but's. Doing business with someone who treats their animals in that way condones and supports such treatment. That is bad business any way you look at it. To continue to do business with Outback is also condoning and supporting this unacceptable treatment of animals as they obviously support and do business with those who treat their animals as the pictures have shown and as their 3 employees have admitted to.

 

[rjarosek]

Employee of the month Mike Schultz left me some carma and a message. Thought I woudl share

"12-02-2009 08:18 AM Mike Schultz Whats wrong with taking a skinny animal, fattening it up, and selling it? You'd rather see it tossed in a freezer? - Mike "

Looks like there entire operation doesn't get it. To take a sick animal and fatten it up to make a profit is wrong. I am sure you disclose that it was fattened up, right?

To condone the neglect and abuse of any animal by accepting them form this "so called large breeder" to make a profit because you (outback) , oh I mean the large breeder neglected the poor animal to the brink of death, did not quarantine it ,and "accidental send it out" (Yeah Right) .

Mike my point is , if you or the company you work for accepts these animals it encourages the behavior to continue. Now this "large breeder has an outlet for these abused animals. Providing this outlet for the breeder condones and encourages and makes you an accessory.

If you care for the animals as you claim to , you should see this clearly. Or is it "only a leopard gecko"

OF COURSE I WOULD NOT WANT TO SEE THEM IN A FREEZER

 

[john_]

Good God are some people so thick as to not see the obvious? The FACT is those animals were not only accepted (from a big breeder my ass), they were kept and shipped out, mistakenly or not it was done, period.

Again FACT, those animals were abused and neglected, no if's and's or but's. Doing business with someone who treats their animals in that way condones and supports such treatment. That is bad business any way you look at it. To continue to do business with Outback is also condoning and supporting this unacceptable treatment of animals as they obviously support and do business with those who treat their animals as the pictures have shown and as their 3 employees have admitted to.

Thick? Really, do we need to start throwing mud? I apologize if my opinion and experience as a satisfied customer of Outback Reptiles offends you but to say that I condone the bad treatment of animals is a stretch and silly at that.

Am I to think that because someone else had a bad experience that my opinion should be swayed based on theirs and not my own? I apologize for not being a sheep. My argument has never been “It’s ok to neglect and sell sick animals”, it’s simply been that I believe that people can make mistakes and that coincidentally I’ve also had a very pleasant transaction with Josh at Outback Reptiles.

For the record, you don't have to bold your words to make a point, as thick as you may think me to be I'm perfectly capable of reading and understanding text without the help of additional font attributes.

Carry on with the name calling, this isn't the first time in history a difference of opinion has caused such behavior.

 

[Kristi23]

Thick? Really, do we need to start throwing mud? I apologize if my opinion and experience as a satisfied customer of Outback Reptiles offends you but to say that I condone the bad treatment of animals is a stretch and silly at that.

Am I to think that because someone else had a bad experience that my opinion should be swayed based on theirs and not my own? I apologize for not being a sheep. My argument has never been “It’s ok to neglect and sell sick animals”, it’s simply been that I believe that people can make mistakes and that coincidentally I’ve also had a very pleasant transaction with Josh at Outback Reptiles.

For the record, you don't have to bold your words to make a point, as thick as you may think me to be I'm perfectly capable of reading and understanding text without the help of additional font attributes.

Carry on with the name calling, this isn't the first time in history a difference of opinion has caused such behavior.

By giving them more sales, you are helping to support and keep them in business. It doesn't matter that they didn't breed these geckos. The fact is that they are buying from people who are. I would be really upset to find out that the animals I paid for were sick animals that they 'rehabbed'.

 

[robin d.]

is this the same outback reptiles? http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/forums/showthread.php?t=110584.

 

[Strike_Force_Reptiles]

yes it is the same Outback

 

[JG1153]

Thick? Really, do we need to start throwing mud? I apologize if my opinion and experience as a satisfied customer of Outback Reptiles offends you but to say that I condone the bad treatment of animals is a stretch and silly at that.

Am I to think that because someone else had a bad experience that my opinion should be swayed based on theirs and not my own? I apologize for not being a sheep. My argument has never been “It’s ok to neglect and sell sick animals”, it’s simply been that I believe that people can make mistakes and that coincidentally I’ve also had a very pleasant transaction with Josh at Outback Reptiles.

For the record, you don't have to bold your words to make a point, as thick as you may think me to be I'm perfectly capable of reading and understanding text without the help of additional font attributes.

Carry on with the name calling, this isn't the first time in history a difference of opinion has caused such behavior.

John, nobody is disputing the fact that you had a good transaction (good for you) but the fact is you are now aware of the fact that Outback is knowingly providing an avenue for neglected and abused animals to be sold. they are in effect profiting from animal abuse. They have confessed to this. Does it not bother you just a little bit that they are ok with doing business with people who obviously neglect and abuse these poor animals?

And by you or anyone else doing business with them it sends very clear financially profitable message that it's ok for people to abuse and neglect their animals just like Outback send that exact same message to their shady breeders when they do business with them. You as a customer have the power to stop this kind of behavior by refusing to do business with these types of merchants which will then force unscrupulous business to rethink their business strategies. You know these animals are being abused it's painfully obvious and you're not only turning a blind eye to the situation you're encouraging it by giving them your money. Sorry but as I said previously on this thread there is a much bigger issue at hand here then just a bad transaction (which yes to be fair was taken care of). I think this is why everyone is getting after you. Sorry not mudslinging or getting after you. just simply trying to explain.

 

[robin d.]

seems like they have left a bad taste in several peoples mouths huh?

 

[Riyo]

Jazmin, thank you for posting.

When I saw the post on GeckoForums.net I was utterly shocked. I could not believe that those animals had been sent out in that condition...and that a 15$ credit was the only restitution that had been offered.

Mistakes do happen, but I have to agree with everyone else here. How could you not see that there was something terribly wrong with those animals when they were being packed? The fact that Jazmin was not the one to pay for them (but she was the one they were purchased for) is a moot point.

I have considered purchasing from Outback Reptiles before but after seeing this and how it was handled is pretty disturbing. The animal flipping does not sit well with me at all.

Thank you again for posting, Jazmin, I wish you and your animals the best. I hope they recover well for you.

 

[Strike_Force_Reptiles]

yeah, seems like some people dont like whats going on with them much but as i said i have talked to Josh a few times and seems like a hell of a nice guy and always responded to my emails and my wifes phone calls very promptly but i have never done "business" with them, the whole part of were i couldnt tour their facilities once to check on how things were kept before i made a long term business commitment turned me off from them. my emails were never ignored but i might be one in a few that wasnt ignored and he even stated that he ignored Jasmines email so thats why i stated earlier NO EMAILS SHOULD BE IGNORED. but i say last time he seems to be a hell of a nice guy

 

[Strike_Force_Reptiles]

yeah, seems like some people dont like whats going on with them much

lol let me correct myself here " yeah, seems like most people dont like wants going on with them much including me as fars as the sick geckos and ignoring Jasmines email"

 

[MikeCurtin]

Never dealt with him, and as I said earlier, probably won't because of the animals' condition. This is one of the problems with buying from middlemen....especially sight unseen via the internet.