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pic of high yellow belly ball....ready for you female pastels

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Steve, my point is that you want $400. The ones for $2000 were wild caught and they stated that clearly. So unproven wild caught "yellow bellies" are often 4+ times what you are asking. That is my point. I am off this now. I said what I wanted to say. Good luck on your sale.
 
The guy is honest!

I just want to let you know that I inquired about this animal and a female Steve had for sale. I asked him for more pics because the caution yellow was a little hard to beleive! Steve got back to me promptly and professed that the pic did not represent the true colors and he would send me new pics when he got them. It's not like he's asking 2K for the thing! JEEEES.... Look at some of the crap thats on that other big site with all the cockamamie (spelling???) names they come up with and want $500 plus shipping for them! Yellow belly or not, it is a nice looking animal and who knows. Maybe it will prove out to be something. Steve is not trying to pull a fast one here and I agree, just let the guy sell his snake! BLREPS
 
Bill...

Hey Bill, I think that is a tad late. These conversations were all done and over with, and you may have opened a can of worms.
Evan, I respect you, and your reputation as being a good guy and all, but, it's not that people dont have the balls to attack any big names, its that they are respected. Steve, frankly, doesnt hold a candle to any big names. Frankly, you wouldn't have even said that, unless you've tried to slay the giant reputations yourself. You are being very Hypocritical.
He doesnt even have any quality photos. I would greatly hesistate to buy from Steve for one reason. I was IM'ing and emailing him for awhile about the female. He supposedly sold it, and here it is, same thing, back up for sale again. I have seen this female, said to be sold multiple times. This shows the inexperiance and vulnerbility of a 15yr old. It is to easy to pigeon-hole his statements. I mean, all he has to do is get some quality pictures, and not state anything as sold, until the money is there. I'm not saying his age is the factor, but being in his point of view, younger people tend to go after the more "catchy" names. I bet he'd label anything with a name like "above average" to get a sale. I could be wrong. But, until I see some quality photo's, with no excuses, I will stand against buying from Steve, unless I see any of the animals in person first. I;ve seen this yellow belly on and off the market for awhile as well.
Steve, make up your mind, keep him or sell him, stop putting these snakes on and off the market, and falsely selling your animals.
Mike Fortier
Sand and Sun Reptilians.
 
STOP!

Caution has already been given by those who doubt Steve therefore it does not need to be beaten to death. As others have said...let him sell his snake.

Support for Steve has also been given. Steve may be young but he does know his herps from what I've gathered by simply Instant Messaging him. He is an honest guy and has always been easy to reach for simply talking herps. Although I've never met him in person, he goes to many of the same herp shows as me so I'm sure I'll chat with him in person him sooner or later.

Mike...I don't mean any disrespect but it is a little unfair to criticize Steve for "putting these snakes on and off the market". Maybe he is simply excited about the hobby and continually changing his goals for new projects to work with. Many people are always expanding their horizons with buying/selling new herps.

Also, I do not see any actual evidence in your claim that Steve is "falsely selling his animals". I am not convinved this is the case. The only thing I'll agree on is the poor quality of the webcam pics BUT I've seen other pics of Steve's animals and I'm sure this ball python is nice based on his attention to quality in obtaining other herps.

In fact, Steve had a pair of Hogs that he acquired in a trade that I considered buying from him. They were gorgeous. Steve, to ease worries... maybe you could provide references of people you have done business with in the past for any potential buyers on this deal. Just a suggestion. Either way, I'm sure someone will be happy with your ball python's quality.
 
I don't often get involved in these debates but I felt I had to. I may have replied late but if I see someone getting bashed that I have had good dealings/conversation with and feel they are honest, I will put my two cents worth in. If you get a reputation in this buisness you are all done! As far as the good pics, when I was 15 (way back then), would I have spent money on a good camera or a new animal??? HMMMMM... a new animal! Just trying to save face for the guy and I don't think he's scamming anyone.
 
The reason is mike..

Mike, the reason she went on and off is because I kept having buyers back out. We would then set up the hole thing, then they tell me they don't do money orders and back out. I am in the process of getting PayPal. This is not the same ball as the "bullseye", if that is what you think. As I sais before research goes into everything, you dont just go out and buy a $300 camera without putting any thought to it. I sold the bullseye to Mike Heinzer, we even delivered it in NJ for him. Email him at [email protected]. Other references are [email protected] which I sold a baby ball too, [email protected], which I traded my hoggs for some of his PeruvianXcolumbian crosses. Email any of those people and see what they have to say about me.

Steve Bates
 
Mike, I would love for you to explain what it is that you mean about me wanting to be a giant killer when I consider myself to be close friends with most of the top people in the ball python market and have know most of them well for much longer than you have likely even owned snakes.

I have known and liked Mark and Kim Bell since the late 1980's. Brian and Lori Barcyz I have known since 1991. Brian Sharp is a great guy that I have known well for quite some years. I do not know the Barkers well but my business partner has been close friends with Tracy for about 25 years now. Kevin and Bill at NERD are good guys I met over about a decade ago. I have only known Ralph Davis a couple years but I like that guy too. I think it is over a decade that I have known and liked Ian G. So what giant am I trying to kill? I made a statement of fact that and used Ben Siegal as an example because he was the most recent to do what you are commenting on. He posted wild caught adult, unproven animals as yellow bellies for $1500-2200 each. Simple. Statement of fact. You are the one who is attributing some vendeta to my words that I have not stated. I do not even know Ben Siegal. I have emailed back and forth with him on two or three occasions. I do not like or dislike him as I do not know enough to. I was simply stating a fact. Do not put words in my mouth and do attribute some attack on somebody to me. I will bring up names for what they have posted. You are the one here for implying things that do not exist.
 
Just on kingsnake now, CMG reptile, whoever that is, posts adult wild caught "axanthic" male ball and female "arctic" ball. What do you think the likelyhood of those animals proving to be genetic are and how much do you think they are worth? He does not say they may or may not be the morphs. He does not say they are what they are. He says they are "axanthic" and "arctic".
 
He is still available

Hey, he is still available. I need the money for some fishing odds and ends, and for other projects. First $400 gets him.
Steve Bates
 
Hi Evan, I inquired about the "Arctic" advertised looking to see what he wanted and he never e-mailed me back. It is an interesting looking snake but is an anproved WC. He probably wants more I I am willing to pay anyway. I'm always interested in aquiring "different" females.
 
Evan,

First off the Yellow Belly is not a new morph that just popped up last year. It was proven dominant almost 3 years ago, again last year and proven co-Dominant last year by a few people (and not just the sutherlands). I have seen many of the animals coming from Africa that are "True Yellow Bellies" and I have seen quite a few of the c.b.b. proven ones. I think I know a little more about it than most people. And yes some of the c.b.b. babies have been sold as well as many of the ones coming in from Africa. I sold a few last year and if I did not know what their potential was I would not have been able to sell them for the $10K price tag I got on them. I sold roughly 3 "true" Yellow Bellie" pairs last year at about the same price per pair. I also sold a few that had the same characteristics as the "True" animals but were just a little off so we could not say for sure they were the same thing. Of course those animals did not fetch as high a price as the real deal but they still had almost ALL of the characteristics that make up a "True Yellow Bellie" Now this animal this person has advertised while a nice looking animal DOES NOT have the characteristics of the "True Yellow Bellies".

Now as for when Ben advertised his animals that he thought might be Yellow Bellies I did the same thing. I told him those animals were not yellow bellies and did not have the characteristics of the "True Yellow Bellies" I saw those animals in person and they were not "True Yellow Bellies" While Ben thinks they might be who knows they might prove out to be a different type but they were not "True Yellow Bellies". So it is not just an unknown seller that I inform about the animals I also did it to Ben. Now will you believe what I am saying? More than likely not, but this year you (and alot of other people) will more than likely learn the truth about the Yellow Bellies as they will be made open to the public. There are not alot of people out there right now that know the truth about them and what they really look like. While there are alot of people that "think" they know, they actually have no clue.
 
Sooo

How exactly would you describe a "true yellow belly", considereing you are the "Expert" on these morphs. Funny thing I I have never heard of anyone selling a genetic yellow belly. I cant believe you sold a proven pair for around 10 grand, personally they arent a very cool morph and should not be sold at such a high price. I would say that a proven pair would be around 5 grand or less, I would rather get a few albinos with that 10 grand. The way I see it, why are people charging so much for things that arent nearly as cool as a peibald? A different female I am selling has a nice yellow belly, but it is nothing like this Yellow belly male I am selling.
I am not trying to make enemies, just trying to sell this snake. I had someone say that these things were worth thousands and said that they would be interested in buying it for cheap. So that is what I posted it as, cheap. And guess what, that person blocked their email for that thread, and I never heard from them again. Sound a little fishy to you?

Steve
 
Steve,

I did not say I sold a proven pair for 10K I sold a pair of True Yellow Babies. The animals I sold were babies. As for your thoughts that a pair should not be worth but $5K that is fine but in a matter of a couple of months the genetic Yellow Bellies will be up for sale and the prices on them will be ALOT higher than $10K ea. As for them looking like nothing, that is what people said about the Pastels when they first were proven genetic, now they are one of the most desired morphs. Another is the Cinnamon, everyone said they were nothing but a normal and no one wanted them and was willing to pay the $10kea for them until the pewter was produced, then everyone that had them sold out pretty quickly. As for what the True Yellow bellies look like, well I will tell you this, they resemble a pastel in many aspects once you have seen one you know what they look like. Now will I post pictures on here of them? Nope. Have I posted pictures of them on other sites in the past? Yep. I am sure I am not the first person to have told you that animal is not a real Yellow Belly. In case you don't know, the Yellow Bellies super form is an all white animal. Also just because you have never heard of anyone selling a Genetic Yellow Belly or any other morph that does not mean is has not happened. There are a number of morphs that are out there right now that very few people know about. Now this year and next there should be quite a few new morphs on the market as they are all being proven right now.
 
Re: The guy is honest!

BLREPS said:
It's not like he's asking 2K for the thing! JEEEES.... Look at some of the crap thats on that other big site with all the cockamamie (spelling???) names they come up with .........Steve is not trying to pull a fast one here and I agree, just let the guy sell his snake! BLREPS
Click to expand...


Yup......Nowadays people can sell normals for say.....$250 by calling it "Bright Orange"....or "Mohave-ish"....at the same time they will chastise others for selling a snake with "Bright Yellow Belly" for a similar price....LOL....

Are you trying to monopolize the "Wannabe" morph market??
 
I guess these guys are getting the money for them! As long as the customers are happy and feel their animals are "special", thats whats important. Your really better off buying a lot of 20 at that price and picking out the mohaveish, orange, yellow, faded, blushing, reduced, hypo yellow bellied clear shedding ones and selling the rest! Did I forget any????LOL
 
Yeah....I just thought it was really funny who was trying to make a case against this guy, while they have ads elsewhere for normal snakes but calling them "Bright Orange", "Wierd Coloration" etc, etc....

I don't really care.......but I think this guy's "yellow belly" is more likely to be a genetic trait than Rob@RK's "morph wannabe's"
 
Here are some pics of him in shed

Here are some pics of him In shed, I will get get some others when he gets out. The yellow on him is a little pale because of his shed, but you can still make it out.
Steve
 
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Hey Steve,
Looks like you're getting some good pictures now. Post again after he sheds and maybe he'll strike somebody's fancy. I've spent extra $ for interesting looking females for my project. You've got to have breeders, so why not buy ones that appeal to you. Most of those other ads mentioned just make me laugh, though. I have to open up the pictures just to see if I can even spot what hint of a color or pattern anomaly is being touted, especially hatchlings that typically go through pretty dramatic color changes as they mature. Don't let him get to you. Just post a good picture after he sheds and see where it goes from there. If the price is a bit high, maybe you'll still get a reasonable offer. Best of luck.
Paul
 
Rob, I know what you mean and what you are referring to but you really should not say that the super form of a yellow belly is an all white snake as it is not. The "ivory" is not leucistic. It is a different color and has a dorsal stripe and other faded markings of a different coloration. I know several people that are working on the project. You understood my point though. When people are selling unproven wildcaughts for thousands the level of criticism being sent this guys way over $400 is unwarranted. That is still my only point. Thanks for the info on Ben though I as felt his post was very clearly intended to state that they were genetic strain animals and I think that is wrong when you can not honestly say that they are.
 
I still have him

Hey, He is still available! I will get some new pictures of him soon. I am saving up to get some parts for my dirtbike, so I need the money. Let me know if you are interested in him and we can set up a time for you to come take a look at him.

Steve
 
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