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Pied or Ringer?

It's 11:07 and I just got off the phone with regal, I explained to them about it not being a pied, but an exceptional ringer, and that even a no white pied has high orange, aberrant pattern, and white belly. I told them there was a thread on k.s. and here, and that they are getting a really bad rep. by not correcting the add.
Also told them if they sell it it is false advertising, just wanted to let all the obvious out so if they do not remove the add, then they have no excuse but a scam.

We will have to wait and see.
 
Just to antagonize!

What is if that is a low white pied? You really don't know unless it is bread to a het pied or a female pied do you? I mean someone was saying something about the orange looked like it was there right next to white ring to me. I don't know the guys at reagl well. I bought a baby female woma aspidites Ramsayai (sp?) from them about 5 years ago now. And she has been great. I don't think they would knowingly scam anybody. Just wanted to raise a little stink. Later Mike
 
Scramblermike said:
What is if that is a low white pied? You really don't know unless it is bread to a het pied or a female pied do you? I mean someone was saying something about the orange looked like it was there right next to white ring to me.
Click to expand...

There's no what if to it Mike. It's completely obvious by merely looking at it that it is not a pied, no breeding has to be done.
The piebald trait is a color and pattern morph. It is not defined only by the presence of the white areas, but the normally colored areas are never normally patterned as they are in this snake. They most often form the well known double stripe pattern.
Ringers on the other hand have completely normal patterns on the non white portions of the body, just as the snake in the ad did. Ringers also usually have orange coloration around the white area, which should not be taken to suggest they are actually pied.

The most casual of image searches on google for pied balls will show you the obvious difference in the pattern of the non white areas as compared to a normally patterned snake.
 
Stupid Question?

I have seen in ads where people called the ringer trait a definite het albino. That it made it a visual het albino. What does everybody know/think about this? I have no idea what to think was just curious. Thanks Mike
 
I've never heard that, either. I have seen "reverse paradox albinos" that looked normal with a small patch of albino coloring...they looked sort of like a ringer except the "ring" was albino. I don't know anything about their genetics, though.
 
Scramblermike said:
I have seen in ads where people called the ringer trait a definite het albino. That it made it a visual het albino. What does everybody know/think about this? I have no idea what to think was just curious. Thanks Mike
Click to expand...

I've never heard such a thing.....and think it sounds fairly ridiculous.
 
Scramblermike said:
I have seen in ads where people called the ringer trait a definite het albino. That it made it a visual het albino. What does everybody know/think about this? I have no idea what to think was just curious. Thanks Mike
Click to expand...


I have seen ringers come from Cinny breeding. So I am not so sure about that one. Also I have seen ringers come out of Het Pied to Het pied.
 
As Most said the ad snake is NOT a pied!

Also there are many morphs that have produced ringers-
Here's a nice pic of my Pastel Ringer:
y1pbogPaFwncXYaNhRvuy2nwlFjX2K2_5pfErvVwGT8MOoO3UB16h7EX20ik6wMAk18gFIAdRgcB7s


Ringers turn up in many clutches Conner Davey (Davey Reptiles has/had a sweet Mojave Ringer), so far nobody has figured out the genetics... the likelyhood is that it's NOT a genetic trait. Note that the pattern is normal except for where the ring is?

Now look at my extreme low-white Pied:

y1pbogPaFwncXbWkDcxIwZFWVRvd4KQCN8ki6giNDbPFWtVHZvZ_2GDxpHXC_Bh-TOvrA3sCOMRJhY


Even though she has less white than my Ringer, it's obvious that she's a Pied due to the pattern. The pied gene really changes the entire pattern of the snake; it's not just about the splashes of white.

Hope this comparison helps. -Deb
 
In my opinion that's a ringer. Was there a malicious intent behind calling it a pied? He never said it was a genetic pied, and any pied animal by definition is:

adj.
Patchy in color; splotched or piebald.
Click to expand...

So yes, we all suspect he was trying to sell a ringer for a genetic piedball, genetically it will more than likely not prove out as a piedball ball python but by definition it shows a "pied" spot.

Have any of you seen those ads for reverse pieds, black pieds, etc? Are they genetically proven? No that I know of but nevertheless there they are. In this case I don'

Regards.
 
I would not be surprised to hear the, "I bought it as a Pied, so I am selling it as a Pied," excuse in a case like this.

Hopefully your emails and explainations get through to the seller. As already stated, it is the combination of the white and the funky pattern that make a Pied. White alone does not do the trick. This ringer has no funky pattern and color, only some white.

On a side note about the price, if it was a Het Pied ringer, might not be a bad deal, as a showpiece and a Het breeder. There was a real low white Pied for sale on Fauna for $1550 or something like that.
 
The BoidSmith said:
In my opinion that's a ringer. Was there a malicious intent behind calling it a pied? He never said it was a genetic pied, and any pied animal by definition is:



So yes, we all suspect he was trying to sell a ringer for a genetic piedball, genetically it will more than likely not prove out as a piedball ball python but by definition it shows a "pied" spot.

Have any of you seen those ads for reverse pieds, black pieds, etc? Are they genetically proven? No that I know of but nevertheless there they are. In this case I don'

Regards.
Click to expand...

I understand that, by definition, you are stating that the ad is correct semantically.

However in the trade, the Python Regius trade, we use trade-specific definitions of traits. In which case the correct term for the snake in the add is "Ringer". The word specifically not only describes the animals appearance but also it's genetics.
 
Deb,

We are in agreement, it should have been advertised as "unusually high white ringer" or even "the best ever" ;) . Regrettably it's not the first that I've seen ringers advertised as low-grade pieds in the past. How about the reverse pieds and the black pieds that we see pop-up every now and then? Has anyone proven those to be genetic?

Regards.
 
The BoidSmith said:
Deb,

We are in agreement, it should have been advertised as "unusually high white ringer" or even "the best ever" ;) . Regrettably it's not the first that I've seen ringers advertised as low-grade pieds in the past. How about the reverse pieds and the black pieds that we see pop-up every now and then? Has anyone proven those to be genetic?

Regards.
Click to expand...

That's a good question & I get your point... honestly there's much embellishment in some ads. Truthfully, I wouldn't be able to answer that question, but I fancy it to be quite a dinker project. If they put a whole "dinker" subsection in the Regius classifieds, I'd bet a good majority of ads would be listed there.
:yesnod:
 
Agreed again...

And it's not that I'm against that kind of labeling as it's merely describing what the animal looks like. The point that I'm making is precisely what you just stated, it's an unproven "dinking" project.

Regards.
 
I think if you call it a Pied, it is calling it a genetic animal. The ad should have read Pied looking Ringer, or Nicest ringer on the planet,,,etc.
 
IMO, if that animal were to be sold as a "pied", low white or otherwise, then that would constitute an act of fraud, pure and simple. I hate to put it in such stark terms, but there it is. The animal is in no way a piebald, in any form.
 
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