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Question about Woma Ball Pythons - History & Etc?

I think you are confusing the woma with nerds hidden gene woma. a regular nerd line woma will only produce womas. to produce the pearl you need a hidden gene woma and this also mixed with hg lesser and another unamed morph will make the soul sucker. the normal womas i have not seen any problems with. only the hidden gene woma can have issues.
 
My woma is a normal woma...the lesser woma was a normal woma also...no hidden gene....still wobbles...no confusion here
 
gsrept said:
I think you are confusing the woma with nerds hidden gene woma. a regular nerd line woma will only produce womas. to produce the pearl you need a hidden gene woma and this also mixed with hg lesser and another unamed morph will make the soul sucker. the normal womas i have not seen any problems with. only the hidden gene woma can have issues.
Click to expand...



I think that's incorrect ..

My woma is VPI line and has issues.

Also in Kevin//NERDs book kevin talks about the regular woma and how the super form is the Pearl. When the book was written though he didn't have photos of it or even mention the special gene woma. Ill check the page number when I get home. :)
 
Going slightly off topic lol....as I don't think it matters if its hidden gene or normal woma...Wobbles have been expressed in both
 
It is a little off topic, but it's interesting to note..I wonder if when he wrote the book he didn't know he had two types of his line of womas? I thought I would scan this just for informational purposes to this thread. As you can see, the book also mentions nothing about wobbles or neurological problems.

womabook1001.jpg


womabook1002.jpg
 
Here also is the blurb about the woma ball python from VPI's book and it talks about creating the pearl from a "regular" woma as well. What a mystery! It also has no mention of any issues.

womabook1004.jpg
 
Willow said:
Going slightly off topic lol....as I don't think it matters if its hidden gene or normal woma...Wobbles have been expressed in both
Click to expand...
Willow said:
Going slightly off topic lol....as I don't think it matters if its hidden gene or normal woma...Wobbles have been expressed in both
Click to expand...
Just trying to clarify the difference, too much confusion doesn't help the topic at hand.
I wonder why most spiders have some amount of "the wobbles" yet most womas are completely normal?

Just thinking out loud... :)
 
well from what i have seen at nerd his normal womas have no noticable wobble never seen vpi so i can not say what i do know that alot of the snakes he calls dingdong snakes have the hidden gene woma in it. where it gets confusing is the whole hidden gene woma, or woma the hidden gene version should have maybe been called something else.
 
Like I said before...it was very hush hush when the spider wobble first started rearing its ugly head....I suspect atm its the same with womas....hence why there isnt much information out there about it from the big breeders
 
Willow said:
Like I said before...it was very hush hush when the spider wobble first started rearing its ugly head....I suspect atm its the same with womas....hence why there isnt much information out there about it from the big breeders
Click to expand...

:iagree:

I have both womas and spiders in my collection, and ALL of them, with the exception of a single male spider, exibits the"wobble", some more noticably than others, but its there.
 
i have a male woma with no wobble .... i know a few friends that own some & no wobble ... this is a 1st for me ! never heard of it in womas !
 
FelixatRI said:
this is a 1st for me ! never heard of it in womas !
Click to expand...


we have covered that...just like spiders when they first hit sales, not many people have heard of wobbling womas...gratz that yours doesn't hehe...some people claim their spiders don't wobble...but they can and will make babies that DO wobble.

give it another year...I'm sure it will become a more known trait for womas...due to personal experiences, I have already come to accept it
 
I guess it is common ... there goes my plan of why i got womas instead of spiders , i do hate any animals with neurological problems or defects , thats why i dont own a spider or caramel in my collection ... i will look closer at mines to see , but i have had it for a year & no problems as of yet ! maybe the wobbling is related to the gene in those patterns , since both there patterns are very similar ... anyways i am breeding him now & he has locked 3 females so i will definitely check out his offsprings !
 
if you look hard enough you will probably find most of the morphs out there have some type of problem. spiders wobble, womas wobble, champ. wobble, albino bad eyes, cinis duck bills, caramels kinking and supposedly females do not lay fertile clutches. the more genes we put into the mix the more issues that are going to pop up. If you are looking for a perfect snake get a normal that is the only way to steer clear of these problems. when you mess genetics your bound to get burned at some point.
 
http://newenglandreptile.com/nerd/index.php/Ball-Python-Base-Morphs/qwomaq.html

The "super" (homozygous) form of the Woma ball is a "Pearl" - a creamy off-white snake with dark navy blue eyes. For unknown reasons, the homozygous Pearl is a weak gene & these animals fail to thrive due to inhibited motor skills.
Click to expand...

On his website and in his book, Kevin does not distinguish between the "normal" tiger woma and the "woma hidden gene". He doesn't say the hidden gene woma specifically creates the Pearl, but I am happy to see on the website he talks about the motor issues.
 
gsrept said:
if you look hard enough you will probably find most of the morphs out there have some type of problem. spiders wobble, womas wobble, champ. wobble, albino bad eyes, cinis duck bills, caramels kinking and supposedly females do not lay fertile clutches. the more genes we put into the mix the more issues that are going to pop up. If you are looking for a perfect snake get a normal that is the only way to steer clear of these problems. when you mess genetics your bound to get burned at some point.
Click to expand...

Well, the more genes we put in, the more different issues we'll find, but putting additional genetic material into our collections will actually help reduce genetic abnormalities overall.

Also, normals are not immune to these problems. Outcrossed collections--yes, those will almost always produce offspring with fewer problems. However, inbreeding and the issues that come with it are not limited to morphs. (Consider dom and co-dom line breeding, for instance. Those are going to produce just as many inbred normals as morphs.)
 
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