• Responding to email notices you receive.
    **************************************************
    In short, DON'T! Email notices are to ONLY alert you of a reply to your private message or your ad on this site. Replying to the email just wastes your time as it goes NOWHERE, and probably pisses off the person you thought you replied to when they think you just ignored them. So instead of complaining to me about your messages not being replied to from this site via email, please READ that email notice that plainly states what you need to do in order to reply to who you are trying to converse with.

  • IMPORTANT! PLEASE READ!! About the Google Adsense ads being displayed

    =====================
    Posted 08/15/2025
    =====================


    Yeah, I know. They are a pain in the butt. But they pay the bills to keep my server running. Just a fact of life, I am afraid.

    Want to get rid of them? Simple. Just become a Contributor level member or above and they will be gone. -> Please click HERE."

    Is that too much for me to ask of you to keep this site running? Well, sorry about that. I too wish I could get everything for free. But alas.....

    =====================
    Addendum: 01/10/2026
    =====================


    Google Adsense ad revenue for December, 2025 was just $30 over the cost of the lease for the server running this site. So, in effect, the money providing the incentive for me to continue running this site is coming SOLELY from the paid memberships and sponsorships here. Which honestly ain't much....

Question for other shippers about shipping Non-venomous snakes via Airborne Express

COBRAMAN

COBRAMAN

Doctor of Science
Joined
Aug 10, 2002
Messages
218
Reaction score
3
Points
0
Location
South Florida
I have a question for any of you that is in the biz about shipping harmless snakes via Airborne Express. I would appreciate any info or advice you have to offer about this situation.
I just shipped a 5 foot captive born male Taiwan Beauty snake to a customer in AL (we are located in FL). She asked us to send it overnight via Airborne Express and put it on her account. The terms and conditions of our shipping are listed at the bottom of most of our pages on our web site, stating that we ONLY guarantee live arrival on shipments that are airport to airport (NOT door to door such as Airborne Express). This appears to be the standard as well as I can tell from reading some of the web sites of most of you shippers as well. Obviously we can not be responsible for shipping errors by Airborne Express, as they will not honor a claim for a snake because they do not allow the shipping of ANY snakes through thier service. My customer called me this morning upset (rightfully so) that the snake arrived dead, and that we explained to her that the snakes death is undoubtably the fault of Airborne (probably left it out on some loading dock in the sun, or whatever). She also felt that the snake was shipped in a box too small, but I explained to her that the box is 1/3 larger than the hide box the snake STAYS in 24/7, and the box had more than enough air holes. The snake was bagged, than placed in a Airborne express box measuring 10" X 8" X 6"h, and had lots of extra room in the box. This snake was a 5 foot captive born animal from Cathy Love's collection, and was healthy, eating, and had very good body weight (the customer even commented on it's good body weight). Without going on and on, my question is to other shippers, how do you handle a situation like this? Do you refuse to ship snakes airborne express? Do you take the loss even when the death is no fault of yours? Do you make your customers sign a copy of the terms of shipping prior to shipping? Any advice or info you can provide will be greatly valued.
Thanking you all in advance,
Be Blessed all!
Ray Hunter
Exotic Reptiles Jungle
 
You didn't go into a lot of detail of your shipping methods.
The box should have been insulated and cold packs should have been used for shipping from FL.
The styrofoam insulation should have some small holes but the box itself shouldn't.
In addition to being bagged there should have been crumpled newspaper or some other kind of padding to protect the snake from rough handling.

If proper shipping methods weren't used then I would agree with your customer that you were at fault (even if your terms of service doesn't guarantee live arrival through Airborne Express).

I live in FL and have shipped with Airborne Express several times and never had a problem (knock on wood). I always pay a little extra for 10:30am delivery though.
 
By the way, the following paragraph is attached to EVERY Kingsnake dot com ad we post (which is where this customer found this snake she ordered). Please note the part about live arrivals, and the terms of shipping.

<a href="http://exoticsrus.com/ ">Lots of other animals available, click on this link to see! </a>

<I> <BIG> <B> <FONT COLOR="#FF0000"> Please CALL 772-215-7625 FOR INFO, ORDERING, and quantity prices. </FONT> </B> </BIG> Unless otherwise indicated, the above animals are wild caught imports, that have been de-wormed, and are feeding. They are in “apparent” good health. I strongly recommend that all animals (captive born and wild caught) be quarantined, checked by a vet, and treated accordingly. Venomous reptiles will not be knowingly sold or shipped where they are prohibited unless you fax us your permit. No sales to minors. Proof of age may be required. Orders containing venomous reptiles cannot be shipped door to door. Shipping of all venomous snakes (including rear-fanged snakes) is via Delta Dash ($75.00) or Delta Air Cargo (+/- $68.00 collect) only. There is a $20.00 minimum box charge for all orders containing venomous reptiles. Other animals can be shipped via Airborne Express for around $40.00 (packing charges may be applied). Conditional live arrival guarantee only. Please read my complete terms and information, which can be found on my web site. I will be happy to answer any additional questions you have BY PHONE. We take all major Credit cards, MO, Pay Pal etc. </I>
<B> Sorry, no trades...</B>

<a href="mailto:[email protected]">To E-Mail us your order, click here!</a>

<B> TO ORDER BY PHONE CALL: (772) 215-7625 </B>
<B> WAREHOUSE #: (772) 871-0242 (if busy use 772-215-7625) </B>
<B> TO FAX YOUR ORDER: (772) 871-5891 </B>

Thanks to all and God bless!
<I> Ricky D. & Ray Hunter </I> @ ERJ
 
Chris made excellent points. Furthermore it is very important to check temperatures on your area plus temperatures in the area where the snake is going to be delivered. Shipping can be postponed until temperatures are within "reasonable" limits. Again you should state if the cardboard box was styrofoam lined, if there were no more holes than necessary (which reduce the insulation effectiveness), and if you included a cold pack. Those are minimum conditions to ensure a safe arrival during warm weather.

Regards.
 
Chris, I would agree about the paper if there were enough room in the box for it to be jiggled around, but in this case there was not. I think cold packs would be more harmful than helpful. It was an overcast day in FL, and it was picked up about 4:30pm and delivered by 12:noon. Thank you for your reply.
 
I would agree about the paper if there were enough room in the box for it to be jiggled around, but in this case there was not. I think cold packs would be more harmful than helpful. It was an overcast day in FL, and it was picked up about 4:30pm and delivered by 12:noon.
Click to expand...

Ray,

From what you are saying then there was not enough room for the snake to move. It seems that is was thus in contact with the box walls. If there was not enough insulation that could have easily over heated her. In this case I don't think the heat packs would have been more harmful, as the snake actually died! Again, what were the temperatures in AL upon delivery. Was the package delivered at the first attempt?
 
I think the box was too small. The "dead" air space in a small box will change temp. faster than a large box. You should have used a box large enough to safely use cool paks, it would have cost more but the customer paid the shipping anyway. Shipping is always a risky deal and we need to do all we can to ensure the safety of the animal we ship.
 
Ray,

The others have addressed you shipping methods, and I would agree that some of what you have said you did is contrary to how I ship my animals. However, you are the only one that can determine whether your shipping methods were possibly constituent factors in the animal's death. If they could have been at all, I would err on the side of pleasing the customer and then change my practices to ensure no future culpability.

As to how I handle shipping door-to-door, I offer a live arrival guarantee. Quite frankly, if I cannot comfortably offer that, I am not going to ship the animal in the first place, regardless of the method of transportation. I just think that is good business. I have never taken such a guarantee into account as far as cost to me is concerned, because I have never lost an animal. I know it will happen sooner or later, but it hasn't so far.

However, IF I started to see that trend changing, I would probably just up the cost of all my animals by a few dollars to offset this definite cost of doing business. That is the only way I can see that is going to be acceptable in the long run. It would be sort of a self-contained insurance policy for myself. If things got so bad as to be costing me money even after that . . .well, I'd have to look seriously at whether I realy wanted to be shipping animals door-to-door ever, regardless of what the customer wanted.

just my $.02 --
 
Alvaro, yesterday it was 82 (at the hottest) in FL, and the internet reprted a high of 86 in AL. By the time it was picked up here, it was 4:30pm , raining, and cooler. It was delivered in AL by noon, so I doubt it was at it's hottest (86) by delivery time. I will take into consideration the cool packs. Thank you all for your very helpful advice.
Blessings
Ray
 
I can only speak from my own experience but I offer a live healthy arrival guaranty with every animal I sell. The only condition is that someone must be there to accept delivery. In 4 years I have had only one shipment not make it and that was due to Airborne losing the parcel for 4 days during January.

As a buyer i have never purchased an animal from a seller who would not guaranty live arrival. I consider it a standard of customer service. On the few occasions the seller was not willing to guaranty live arrival I have simply passed on the deal.

I have to agree with the others though. The animal most definitely does not sound like it was packed properly. I am in Florida. For the shipment you described, I would have used a 15" X 7" X 11" styro lined shipping box and one half pond cold pack. The animal should definitely have been cushioned with newspaper or peanuts as well.

This sounds like a situation that has only one good resolution. I would cheerfully refund. The bad press you could receive will definitely not be worth the profit made on this one animal.

Not trying to tell you how to ship, just my opinion.
 
I have just seen details and pictures from the buyer of this snake and in my opinion, you owe her all of her money back. To use nothing but a bag?? No insulation, no "filler" material around the bag? That's just not right.

Traci Engle
 
Ray,
After seeing pictures of the snake and box in question, I have to agree with Traci. The packing was definitely substandard, and (IMO) was a major factor in this snake's death. I'm fairly certain that this was just an honest mistake, and a one-time incident.

There's no question in my mind that a full refund would be in order if it were me. I have no doubt that you'll do the right thing, as I've heard nothing but good about you.

screwed4.jpg

screwed5.jpg

screwed6.jpg
 
COBRAMAN said:
Chris, I would agree about the paper if there were enough room in the box for it to be jiggled around, but in this case there was not.


That's another thing I forgot to mention. That box was way too small! You are right there was no room for insulation/filler/cold pack which is why you should have used a bigger box!

I hope you will do the right thing and refund her money. I think it would be in the best interest for you and your business as well as the customer. I feel horrible that she had to receive the snake like that - but to be out the money too, well that just makes it so much worse. At least you have the opportunity to do the right thing and to learn from this so it never happens again.

Traci Engle
Click to expand...
 
Ray,

I went to your web page and read your terms for live arrival. You clearly state you are not reponsible for the carrier's mistakes when using door to door service. After seeing the pictures I am also of the opinion that in this instance it would be healthier for your business to return the money or replace the snake. I have received snakes via carriers (airborne and UPS) as well as airlines all seasons. I never had a DOA but snakes were always shipped to me in styrofoam insulated cardboard boxes, even those that came via Northwest Airlines. After reading the concepts in your page I'm reassured that you will do what you feel is right.

Regards.
 
Anyone I have ever bought from guarantees live arrival door to door when shipping. Although, I try my best to obtain new animals at shows, and there seems to be plenty of those these days. I thought a live arrival guarantee upon delivery was just standard-good business practice. Am I incorrect? Also, why ship via a career that does not allow the shipping of snakes? Are all carriers like that? Just curious. I saw the pictures and you should definitely REFUND YOUR CUSTOMER! You should take some responsibility for the animal’s death, after all, you chose this business…but the snake did not! Maybe in the future, email/fax a copy of your terms & conditions to your potential customer and have them fax it back signed prior to shipping.
-jason carl
 
For what it's worth, I spoke to Ray this evening, and he said he is willing to refund the customer's money. He also mentioned that this is the first time since he has been running Exotic Reptiles Jungle that this has happened. I myself have bought several animals from Ray, and have never had any problems. I personally see both sides of this issue, but Ray said he feels bad for the young lady (Ray says she is a student in college), and to him this was never about the money, he just wanted to know what others do about shipping. The unfortunate part of this (at least for me) is that it soulds like Ray will no longer ship snakes by overnight express. I never realized that this was a no no anyway. He said that none of the express services knowingly accept snakes. Ray and i bagged the mate to the snake that died, and packed it in the same size box that he shipped the male in, and the snake in the bag only filled 1/2 of the box. It is about a 5 foot snake, but had plenty of room and air in the box. I doubt that the box size was an issue (although it appears deceaving in the pics), perhaps the insulation may havemade the difference. He also showed me the airborne shipping bill, which he had marked "live reptile, keep at 75 degrees". I believe that if airborne express would have followed the written instructions on the label, the snake would have made it with no problem. Even in a bigger box, with insulation, a snake would die if it were left in extreem heat such as in the sun etc. But anyway it soulds like a good ending for everyone, and lessons learned.
just my 2 cents
Wayne Shaw
 
That snake should have been sent in a much larger box, with adequate padding. Without it, the snake would feel every bit of the impact of every movement. Packages go on conveyor belts, get tossed from person to person, and more...there must be something to take the impact instead of the snake's body.

In addition, without an air pocket inside the box and around the snake, the snake would feel every temperature shift immediately. If it was inside an air conditioned room and then sat out in the sun for 20 minutes in preparation to board an aircraft, just that 20 minutes in the sun would bake the poor thing...that uninsulated box was effectively an oven.

I think the right thing to do in this instance is to immediately and cheerfully refund everything paid, including the shipping fees, or replace the snake at no cost to her.
 
I received a snake the other day via a overnight carrier. The box had sat on the engine box of the truck for a couple of hours. The outside of the box was down right hot. When I opened the insulated box the inside temp was nice and cozy. That's why insulated boxes are a must when shipping reptiles. No matter who you ship with or what type of shipping you use. If you ship airport to airport and the snake sits on the tarmak for a couple of hours in a uninsulated box, there's a good chance it will be DOA. The right thing to do is refund the persons money or replace the snake. IMHO
 
shipping the rat snake

To cobraman,
You try to blame the death of the snake on Airborne but you said in a later post that the snake was shipped at 4:30 P.M. and arrived at 12:00. That means there were no delays and Airborne isn't at fault. If there were delays or other circumstances that could be attributed to Airborne you might have an argument but there doesn't seem to be.
That means packaging wasn't sufficient.
I just feel you should do the right thing and either send another snake or refund the money.
I hate to say it but you remind me of a used car salesman. "The car was sold "AS IS" so I don't care of the engine did fall out on the way home." There are right and wrong ways to handle certain situations. There should always be a "good faith" understanding with any transaction.
It would be very hard for the general public to trust you if you refuse to take responsibility.
 
Back
Top