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Repticon Shows

California passed a law a year or two (or more) ago that all vendors (pet shops, breeders, etc) selling animals are REQUIRED to provide a care sheet with certain basic items in it, and give one with each sale. I generally hate to see new laws passed, but I would not mind at all if each show promoter required care sheets with each purchase. It would not be a real hardship on anyone. If they couldn't write up their own, they could get them from a herp society or even find a breeder who might allow them to use theirs, or at least purchase them. It sure would be a benefit to the animals and to our hobby as a whole.
 
It shouldn't need to be a law. Vendors should want to provide care
sheets at least. for soe animals, a care sheet is fine. Care can be
simplified in such a way that a sheet is ok.

For specialized reptiles, like chameleons, care sheets are inadequate. A
set of facts, and "do's and don't's"is will not prevent people from
making a mistake. With delicate, or sensative animals, that's just not
enough.

That's why I don't give out a care sheet with my chameleons. I give
everyone a 20 page booklet that I wrote that is more comprehensive
than any book I've ever read on veileds.

For these animals, at least a list of resources shoudl be given. Online
forums, webpages and free care sheets can be great help to people.
Supplying links is far more feasible to vendors who sell large nmbers of
animals. .

Kathy, you've got the best idea: write a book on th etopic, so you can
offer it with every snake purchase!
 
... I give everyone a 20 page booklet that I wrote that is more comprehensive
than any book I've ever read on veileds...

That's great! Would you mind sending a sample for our herp society? Would you mind if we copied it (with credit to you) to give away (or maybe we could ask those who want one for a donation to cover the cost of the copying 20 pages) at the shows our group goes to? If you prefer, we could just display it at the show with info on getting it from you (although most people will not go to the trouble of doing that, unfortunately.)
 
Sure - I had it available on my website, for everyone, but I'm going to update it soon, with pics. Plus, I'm ging to convert it to a pdf. I want it distributed all over the place, for free - but I'll be dam**d if someone claims my work as theirs!

I'll email it to you when I'm done converting it. Doing it right now.
 
Eric, you need to get over yourself. You could never convince me that purposely stunting the chameleons growth is healthy for them. You had two month chameleons the same size as my one week chameleons for sale at the fall Raleigh show. You said you grow them slow to make them healthy. Underfeeding is never healthy. It is important not to overfeed them as sub-adults to prevent obesity. But for babies. you can't overfeed them.
 
I believe that too many vendors sell chameleons. For such specialized, delicate animals to be sold in such numbers, with such little information given to the buyers, is a travesty.

Kathy requested that I send her the care sheet, that I wrote. It is the result of 13 years of working with C. calyptratus. I offer this information for free, to anyone that wants it. I end up spending hours at the shows talking to people that buy from breeders that fail to give them any ifnormation, let alone a care sheet. I enjoy it. I took the time to write a long caresheet becaue it's something I enjoy as well.

Now, for the facts: My baby chameleons are not stunted. They are fed every day, once or twice. They grow steadily at first, and usually don't start their growth spurt until about 2 months of age. Even then, growth is slower than it is for Audry's chameleons, which I assume, are allowed to eat constantly. The animals I raise do not reach full adult size until 12 months or later. My big male is 17", and some of his babies are a little longer.
The females that you saw, that were "stunted", grew to be about 50% bigger than their mother, which I purchased from you the previous year.

Another fact: Never, in all my 13 years, even before zoomed bulbs were available, have I had any of my babies develop MBD. Only animals I have purchased from other breeders have developed it. In fact, all the females I have aquired from you have come down with MBD in some form or another - mostly soft casques, brittle ribs and bowed legs. It heals over when their growth slows down.

I have run into people that disagree with me. I have also run into people with the same experiences as me. You can disagree that ultra-fast growth is not BAD, you are entitled to your opinion. However, I will flat out tell you that you are wrong when it comes to my animals. Your animals are much more prone to MBD than mine are, plain and simple.

Despite all the information available, and all the online resources, and ALL the products for sale - so many of these animals come down with MBD. Ever wonder WHY?

Eric A
 
Audry, the topic was making proper care and husbandry availabe at shows. I make a concerted effort to do that - even when I'm not selling animals. Making sarcastic remarks about my expereience/husbandry is off topic.

I hope the new Repticon shows will make an effort to have their vendors provide extensive caresheets, so customers don't go home misinformed, or under informed.
 
I think the one thing that is failed to mention to new owners is the proper lighting & supplements. Many vendors tend to over-look those details when talking about the care of a new purchase. Too many are afraid they'll lose a sale if they mention the couple hundred additional dollars they'll have to spend to keep them healthy. Example: Let's say someone buys a $3 iguana. They'll have to spend around $200 just to keep it alive. Not a cheap pet.
 
You are correct. At all the shows I worked at, just about every single chameleon purchased is being brought out the door with nothing more than the deli cup it is contained it. Few are aware that they need screen cages, and few still understand the proper sized screen cages needed - again, a very expensive purchase. A huge problem, that I see, is vendors selling "cricket dust' and "UV lights" with their chameloens - "useless types of calcium powder with imporper balances of D3:A, and Phosphorous:Calcium. These are potentially WORSE than no supplements at all!

The UV bulbs are another area of misinformation: Only one or two brands are even effective at all - some less so than others. Too many vendors seel the UV basking bulbs to customers, who believe them to be for UVB&D3 synthesis, when in reality, they just output UVA.

The small cages you sell for your veileds are appropriate for babies - I have seen MANY times over - vendors selling 20" long melleri and pardalis WITH those cages!

Some vendors will go as far as selling calcium drps, to be mixed with their water (used in a bowl, I guess), in place of repcal or minerall.

They either don't know these products are seless, or don't care, as they are cheaper than the zoomed bulbs, repcal, herptivite and minerall, and therefore a higher profit item.

These poor people think they have it all right: UV bulb, cricket dusting powder, screen cage, etc. When their aimal becomes sick, they blame somthing else. Every day, I see it on the forums, or hear it from people who "had" a chameleon.

Misinformation is often worse than no information. People think they have A, B & C right, so they look for other causes. In reality, they've got A, B & C all bass-ackwards, and that's why poor Tito and LaToya are suffering from imbalances and injuries.
 
eric adrignola said:
The small cages you sell for your veileds are appropriate for babies - I have seen MANY times over - vendors selling 20" long melleri and pardalis WITH those cages!
Click to expand...

I don't sell cages. Someone else does that. And people are informed that they are just starter cages. Good for maybe a couple months, depending on what size animal they purchase. They are intended to allow people time to set up a large cage, and to keep from using glass aquariums.

Anyway, back to the Repticon deal: I think Billy Healy taking over will be a great thing. He's easy to deal with & very organized. This can only mean that good things are yet to come as far as reptile shows are concerned.
 
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