Bad Guy Ron Billingsley- Backed out on a deal

[Nagini]

I will be posting e-mails, but what happened was I was browsing kingsnake, and came across an add that they were having a special on they're gravids. Since I started BPs I like to get one a year to see what babies it would throw, they are then quarentined for 6 months in a completely separate room ext. So he had them listed for $65 each which was a nice price. I contact them and they gave me an even better price, which I didnt ask for but I figured it was because shipping was so high and I was buying 3 from him. He quoted me 220 shipped (50 ea plus 70 delta dash). I agreed, sent him the money and we agreed on a shipping date. The day he was supposed to ship I asked him if he indeed shipped it and when I needed to go to the airport to get the snakes. He then told me that he made a mistake and needed me to send the rest of the money before he was willing to ship it. I told him that since it was his error and he had agreed to it, and I already paid him I wanted the price he himself quoted me. He refused so I got a refund instead.

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Those pictures are of just a couple gravids I have. There are over 100 of them.
Fed Ex shipping to your zip is $112 Fed Ex overnight or $70 Delta Cargo.
Ron

In a message dated 2/1/2009 8:21:12 P.M. Atlantic Standard Time, [email protected] writes:

Do you have any better pics and how much do they weigh? I cant quite make out the number. How much to ship to 95687?

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From: "*****
To: [email protected]
Sent: Sunday, February 1, 2009 6:01:41 PM
Subject: Re: Message about: 24 hour special 3 Gravid Females @ $65 each

Shipping has, and it's really making an impact on shipping animals. It is hurting a lot of different types of businesses.
They will range in size from 1300 g to 2000 grams.
I will try and pull some clear bellies for you.
Ron

In a message dated 2/1/2009 10:00:01 P.M. Atlantic Standard Time, [email protected] writes:

wow shipping really went up. is that price for all the gravids? if so what are your 3 largest for this price? Or do you have any with clear bellies?

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I have over 100 gravid ball pythons. I can not take pictures of every female. It's just not possible.
At $65, I'm making $5 a ball. Just moving what I have, after I picked out what I am keeping for myself.
All I can say, is I'll go thru and look for clear (white) bellied ones for you.
Ron

In a message dated 2/1/2009 10:04:27 P.M. Atlantic Standard Time, [email protected] writes:

Yeah its starting to hurt everyone >< is there any chance you could get some pics of the clear bellied ones? the nearest delta station is pretty far from me

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Tell you what, I'll go thru all of them, select three, weight them, take pics and send them to you for 3 @ $150.
Will shoot pics over as soon as I get it done....
Ron

In a message dated 2/1/2009 10:16:40 P.M. Atlantic Standard Time, [email protected] writes:

I ment getting pics of the ones you picked out, I'm sure they would look nice I just am a bit iffy on getting one without seeing it b/c or atleast a size on the ones pulled and a brief discription?

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Unless you want Fed Ex shipping.

In a message dated 2/1/2009 10:24:59 P.M. Atlantic Standard Time, [email protected] writes:

that would be great. If you find more then 3 please take pics of the 3 largest with clear bellies. So it would be $220 shipped delta?

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So, once we get the three you want selected, you want me to ship Thursday for Friday?

In a message dated 2/1/2009 10:31:14 P.M. Atlantic Standard Time, [email protected] writes:

I'd rather go through delta anway, less stress. I'll be up that way this friday anyway

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My reply:
if possible could you ship friday to arrive same day to Sacramento airport? I wouldnt be able to pick it up on thursday

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ah, I see lol well whatever would work best, what time do you think it would arrive?

From: "****"
To: [email protected]
Sent: Sunday, February 1, 2009 6:40:28 PM
Subject: Re: Message about: 24 hour special 3 Gravid Females @ $65 each

To arrive on Friday, I would need to ship Thursday evening. From Indianapolis, it would have to go thru Atlanta, and they will require a few hours to switch planes. If I ship Friday for Friday, believe me, you won't get them friday. I've done this enough to know......
Ron

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k that will work

From: "****"
To: [email protected]
Sent: Sunday, February 1, 2009 6:47:16 PM
Subject: Re: Message about: 24 hour special 3 Gravid Females @ $65 each

I won't know that until I book the shipment. Once I do, I'll notify you of the flight times, tracking number and such.
Ron

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very nice ones! I'll send the money over tomorrow once I get it deposited. Where should I send it?

From: "***"
To: [email protected]
Sent: Sunday, February 1, 2009 7:57:28 PM
Subject: Re: Message about: 24 hour special 3 Gravid Females @ $65 each

Here are the best gravid balls I have that shows signs of clear bellies.
None are perfect, like pastels or mojaves, but show reduced or little pattern in their undersides.
Their weights are 1,820 grams, 1, 610 grams and 1, 330 grams.

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yeah paypal. I'll send it when I get home tomorrow

From: "***"
To: [email protected]
Sent: Sunday, February 1, 2009 8:12:06 PM
Subject: Gravid Balls

Pay Pal? Pay Pal would be *****

-

*payment sent 2/2/09*

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2/4/09 sent by me:
Hey, just wanted to check with you to make sure you got the money? Are we still planning on gettting it shipped tomorrow to reach the sacramento, ca airport on friday? Any idea on what time it will get in yet? My full name is Alisyn Hertrick if you need it for the package

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Thursday 2/5/09 sent by me still no reply:
I have to go to work, I close tonight. i hope everythings still going as planned since I havent heard differently. if you have any problems you can call me at ***-***-**** and leave me a voice mail then I can call you back as soon as I can get a break

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you quoted me a price that we agreed on and i paid to ship today and now you want to change the price after it was supposed to ship today? this was the price that you gave me, I'd like to keep it at that price since it wasnt my mistake, it was the price you quoted me

From: "******"
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thursday, February 5, 2009 5:28:50 PM
Subject: Re: Gravid Balls

I know it is my mistake, and I just caught it, but I can not sell gravid Female ball pythons for $50 each.
I paid much more then that myself. Even at $65 I'm selling them below cost.
Again, I sorry.
I can reverse your Pay Pal payment or you may add the difference.($45) And we can re-schedule for first of next week.
Ron

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Then I want my money back and I'll go to someone else

From: "*****"
To: Ally H <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, February 6, 2009 5:18:03 AM
Subject: Re: Gravid Balls

I'm sorry you feel taken, but I am not going to take that kind of loss. Again, I leave it to u on what you would like to do. Refund or difference paid. Ron

Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

-

its not about the money, its about customer service

From: "***"
To: Ally H <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, February 6, 2009 10:39:16 AM
Subject: Re: Gravid Balls

That's fine. I believe there are others selling gravids as well, just more $$

Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

 

[critical bill]

Yeah And?

 

[Herpterra]

I have dealt with Ron on several business dealings and have nothing but good things to say. Honestly he admittingly made a mistake, if you had caught something INTEGRITY would have led you to ask instead of get over (not saying that is what happened just my opinion)

"So he had them listed for $65 each which was a nice price. I contact them and they gave me an even better price, which I didnt ask for but I figured it was because shipping was so high and I was buying 3 from him" quoted from you

People are busy and not everyone is 100% on their game all of us go through it.

I really dont see this as a bad guy dealing, i see this as he did what you asked him to do and refunded your money. Case closed

 

[jayefbe]

The guy's selling gravid balls, he's already a scumbag.

 

[MikeCurtin]

So, he offered you a full refund(or you pay the original price) as soon as he noticed his error? Seems honest and professional to me....although perhaps unfortunate for you.

 

[Ron Billingsley]

It is amazing... over a year goes by, hundreds and hundreds of deals, and not one Good Guy/Bad Guy post on the BOI.
And, one person doesn't get her way, and it's boo hoo hoo to the BOI. I didn't allow her to "get" me and she feels taken?
I offered her a full refund or to pay the difference (we are talking $45 dollars here) and she starts to DEMAND I hold up my end of the deal.
That itself made me just refund her. From that point I knew no matter what I said or did, she was not going to be willing to work with me on the sisuation.
So, I'm a bad guy? So be it.
Josuha, since in your eyes I'm a scumbag, why do I sell out every year? Why is more and more people working with gravid balls? And.. gravid savanna monitors, gravid Sand Boas, Gravid Boa Constrictors, gravid Emerald Tree Boas, gravid, gravid, gravid.....
Thousands of animals are imported/sold each year that happens to be gravid.... get over it.
I'll answer any questions regarding this topic. Just email me. I've said my peace here and this is my final post on the subject. Good/Bad Ron

 

[Nagini]

to me if someone quotes you a price, you both agree on it (and I did re-state it to make sure that was the price) and you pay, then he desides to back on on the day he was supposed to ship it that is bad customer service. If I had been in his shoes, I'd take the loss to make my customer happy since it was my error, not they'res. If he had 100 of them like he said, a small loss on 3 shouldnt hurt that much to lose a customer over

 

[TylerStewart]

I don't know Ron, and I'm not a snake person, but I don't see how anyone can help but side with Ron on this... Yeah, he made a small mistake, probably doing some quick math in his head, but in the same situation, I probably would have done the exact same thing he did. You can't be that bad of a guy by immediately offering a full refund to the customer, no matter what the reason really.

Some of us have more than 1 sale going on at a time, and some of us have several customers requesting several things at once. Unfortunately, small mental mistakes happen (typos and math in your head goes wrong), particularly with higher volume companies like he seems to be.

You haven't lost a dime, and just buy from someone else if you feel so voilated. In my experience, it's easier to refund a sale to a difficult customer than having to deal with a difficult customer after they have the animals.

 

[jayefbe]

It is amazing... over a year goes by, hundreds and hundreds of deals, and not one Good Guy/Bad Guy post on the BOI.
And, one person doesn't get her way, and it's boo hoo hoo to the BOI. I didn't allow her to "get" me and she feels taken?
I offered her a full refund or to pay the difference (we are talking $45 dollars here) and she starts to DEMAND I hold up my end of the deal.
That itself made me just refund her. From that point I knew no matter what I said or did, she was not going to be willing to work with me on the sisuation.
So, I'm a bad guy? So be it.
Josuha, since in your eyes I'm a scumbag, why do I sell out every year? Why is more and more people working with gravid balls? And.. gravid savanna monitors, gravid Sand Boas, Gravid Boa Constrictors, gravid Emerald Tree Boas, gravid, gravid, gravid.....
Thousands of animals are imported/sold each year that happens to be gravid.... get over it.
I'll answer any questions regarding this topic. Just email me. I've said my peace here and this is my final post on the subject. Good/Bad Ron

No, I will not get over it. You and plenty of others participate in a despicable practice that I will never support.

 

[RyanT]

No, I will not get over it. You and plenty of others participate in a despicable practice that I will never support.

Local supermarket sold out of Kotex?...Come to the BOI. We got ya covered.

 

[Mooing Tricycle]

Ron. Exactly, its 45.00. If you quoted her for below your advertised price, and she agreed to pay it, and you accepted then started to arrange shipping,and only after then decided against it... well, certainly you are in the wrong.

 

[John E Dove]

I gotta go with Ms. Holmes on this one.
I was raised that if you are a man your word was your bond. There was no need of paperwork or signatures, if you made an agreement you stuck to it regardless.
Here the price was set, payment was made and only then was the price changed. That is just plain wrong. I can understand kicking yourself for messing up on the pricing but not backing out on the deal.

 

[KelliH]

Ron. Exactly, its 45.00. If you quoted her for below your advertised price, and she agreed to pay it, and you accepted then started to arrange shipping,and only after then decided against it... well, certainly you are in the wrong.

Agreed.

 

[TylerStewart]

Just curious, if the mistake had been a higher dollar amount, for example, he typed $100 when he meant $1,000, would it then be ok since it's no longer "just $45?"

 

[Mooing Tricycle]

Just curious, if the mistake had been a higher dollar amount, for example, he typed $100 when he meant $1,000, would it then be ok since it's no longer "just $45?"

Im pretty sure that when you get payment for 100.00 instead of 1000.00 youre absolutely bound to notice.

Its not even the same. Lets not talk about What ifs. and talk about what DID happen. He is in the wrong. he agreed to the price, and arranged shipping before THEN backing out.

 

[Nagini]

Also if that had been the case (100 instead of 1,000) when I restated the price to make sure it was correct, he should have caught it then.

 

[Herpterra]

OK so what is going on here? I mean how can a person be a BAD GUY for refunding the money? He was going to take a loss for those of you that are not large suppliers or pet store owners then you wouldnt understand how $45 dollars affects the grand scheme of things. Now me wow I have bitten the dust several times underestimating shipping costs to CA and taking the hit never asking for a penny more but I had the option to ask, that is me though and I am not hurting for anything as of late. However, some of these people have this money as a lifeblood secondary income for their breeding projects and $45 can seem like $4500. Dont get me wrong maybe he could have taken the hit but at them same time all of you need who find this practice objective never went out and bought a car.....those guys back outa deals consistantly and I never hear anyone putting them up to the BBB.

Fact is you got your money back you didnt LOSE anything.

Some people have Customer Service and a lowsy product, some people have great products and lowsy customer service, and some have both. Just read the PVC Cages BOI post for a better explaination of that comment

 

[callak]

I gotta go with Ms. Holmes on this one.
I was raised that if you are a man your word was your bond. There was no need of paperwork or signatures, if you made an agreement you stuck to it regardless.
Here the price was set, payment was made and only then was the price changed. That is just plain wrong. I can understand kicking yourself for messing up on the pricing but not backing out on the deal.

I'd have to agree with this. Once the price is set, agreed to, and paid for the deal is done. No backing out or renegotiating the price afterward a deal is a deal. I can see both sides of it and understand both. But in this instance the seller was clearly in the wrong for renegging on a already done deal. In this instance I dont think it makes him a Bad Guy, just a instance of bad customer service.

Bluebeast, it does not make it any more ok at all, however in my eyes, IMHO it makes it more understandable(not justifiable) when theres such a high dollar amount involved.

Herpterra, I can completely understand what your saying, I am one of those people that at times $45 is alot of money for me to lose. But bringing up car salesman is completely different. Once you sign the loan paperwork or give them the cash for it and drive off, the car dealer doesn't call you and ask for more money. Yes they will renegotiate a deal constantly and give you one price and come back with another, but it is done before the cash or loan documents are given/signed. I just gave a guy 3k for my wifes car with signed paperwork/reciept saying so, if he came back and said sorry I want more for it, I'd lmfao at him.

Just my opinion though others might not see it that way, but to each his own

 

[John E Dove]

Mr. Daniel
What makes him less than honorable is the fact he gave his word on a price, confirmed that price then tried to raise the price after getting the money in his hands.
If at any point prior to receiving the money he had changed his price there would be no issue but once he accepted the money he asked for he was bound to honor the deal IMO.
"Bad Guy"? Questionable.
Less than reputable? Yes!

 

[Nagini]

callak I do agree with you, if there was another negative post prefix besides bad guy I would have used it, but this thread didnt really fit under 'info'. He's not really a bad guy due to the fact that he did give me my money back, but he was in the wrong on what he did, to an extent I consider that a bad seller. Obviously not as serious as some of the scammers out there, but in my opinion bad customer service makes someone a bad seller.

I to am one of those people, just starting out in the hobby where $45 is a lot of money, My full time job doesnt pay me much, so I have to save for a while to get any snakes that I do get. But even so, if it is my error, it is my fault and I wouldnt back out on a deal if I was at fault