• Responding to email notices you receive.
    **************************************************
    In short, DON'T! Email notices are to ONLY alert you of a reply to your private message or your ad on this site. Replying to the email just wastes your time as it goes NOWHERE, and probably pisses off the person you thought you replied to when they think you just ignored them. So instead of complaining to me about your messages not being replied to from this site via email, please READ that email notice that plainly states what you need to do in order to reply to who you are trying to converse with.

  • IMPORTANT! PLEASE READ!! About the Google Adsense ads being displayed

    =====================
    Posted 08/15/2025
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    Yeah, I know. They are a pain in the butt. But they pay the bills to keep my server running. Just a fact of life, I am afraid.

    Want to get rid of them? Simple. Just become a Contributor level member or above and they will be gone. -> Please click HERE."

    Is that too much for me to ask of you to keep this site running? Well, sorry about that. I too wish I could get everything for free. But alas.....

    =====================
    Addendum: 01/10/2026
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    Google Adsense ad revenue for December, 2025 was just $30 over the cost of the lease for the server running this site. So, in effect, the money providing the incentive for me to continue running this site is coming SOLELY from the paid memberships and sponsorships here. Which honestly ain't much....

RYAN OLMAK ([email protected]) FROM MICHIGAN

ok ... just to be clear, we are talking a DIFFERENCE of $200, i paid him more. i am willing to pay him what they are worth.

on panther chams ... is anyone able to guarantee a sexed pair at 2 weeks old ?

and i have no intentions of breeding this pair to each other, since they are related. i have others to breed with.

all i expected ryan to do is fair business practices. you can't tell me anyone out there would not expect to get what they paid for. and if you do not get what you paid for, you try to clear it with the seller, if you can not clear it with the seller than if available to you adn you have a strong case - go after him legally.

after talking to the state atty today. ryan proved my case already by sending me pics and they do not match what i received.

so again, be careful
 
Beth, we can all see the emails he has sent you, just post them in your thread. Cut and paste them and put them in a post here.

I can vouch for John now that I have met him in person! He is, just as he said, one ugly mutha! (Just kidding John. If they knew what I looked like they would really be disturbed. Nothing like a 6' tall 240 cro mag with a shaved head eh?).
Evan
 
for anyone else out there dealing with ryan he uses another email address, which may be his dad's "[email protected]"

these emails have some language that i do not believe can be posted on these boards ....

because he lives with his parents and we believe under 21 (ON HIS MSN PROFILE HE STATES HE IS 20), his parents would be partly liable for what he is doing.
 
If these guys are willing to help you out then let them. Nobody is suggesting that you don't deserve your money back.

It may be different in Michigan but in Tennessee his parents wouldn't be legally responsible in any way.
 
his parents would be partly liable for what he is doing.
Click to expand...
Im pretty sure that when he hit 19, his parents cannot be held accountable.

Good luck in getting your money back. Earlier this year I received a high dollar animal that was quite a bit smaller than stated and I was not very happy either.
 
SAD NEWS

JUST TO LET EVERYONE KNOW I FOUND 1 OF THE LITTLE ONES DEAD THIS MORNING.

the other i have taken to the vet and she does not think it will make it either.

due to their age and fragile state, the trauma and stress of being shipped has led to their death.

i can't believe this has happened, i get screwed with the transaction and we can't even save the 2 little ones involved.

i will keep you posted on the other little one.

beth
 
They may not be responsible for his actions because of their parentage, however, if he was practicing his "business tactics" in their home, with their consent, they may very well bear some liability as co-conspirators to defraud.

If he was growing pot in their house, you better believe they could be held accountable. This is no different, you would just have to prove that they knew he was defrauding people.

However, even if you couldn't PROVE their culpability, naming them in any lawsuits that may come about could still prove fruitful. It's amazing how motivated a 20 year old can get when his 45 year old dad has papers served to him at his office!

:D

Good luck!

P.S. Post the emails. You can just edit (****) out the bad words. No one will think you've done anything untoward in any way.
 
ok emails on the way.....

the other little baby died about an hour ago. this has me so furious, because it should have never happened. they should have never been shipped so tiny.

here's his latest email few emails .....

Date: 7/24/2003 4:50:27 PM Eastern Daylight Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
wow the FBi im scared know. look up fraud again dumb *itch


Date: 7/22/2003 11:56:22 PM Eastern Daylight Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
yes I can guarantee there sex you dumb *uck

Date: 7/22/2003 9:43:56 PM Eastern Daylight Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
you got $300 dollars worth of panther chameleons. I can sex them the females have pink lines and the males have whitl lines if you cant see this then your dumb. take what further

----- Original Message -----
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2003 1:07 PM
Subject: Fwd: Notification of a Completed Refund


RYAN,

WHAT I PAID IS $300 FOR A 3 MONTH OLD PAIR. I DID NOT RECEIVE THAT. WHAT PART OF THIS DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND. YOU SENT ME 2-3 WEEK OLD CHAMS. THERE IS NO WAY POSSIBLE YOU CAN SEX THEM AT THIS AGE. EVEN THE VET CONFIRMED THIS.

EVERYONE I SPOKE TO CANNOT BELIEVE YOU SHIPPED ME SOMETHING SO YOUNG.

AT THIS AGE, THEY ARE WORTH $50/EA.

YOU CANNOT CHARGE SOMEONE FOR SOMETHING YOU DO NOT HAVE. WHEN YOU SOLD OUT OF THE OLDER PANTHERS YOU ADVERTISED. YOU SHOULD HAVE EITHER HELD ONTO THESE UNTIL THEY WERE 3 MONTHS OLD OR STATED VERY PLAINLY YOU WERE SHIPPING NEWBORNS AT A LOWER PRICE.

BEFORE I TAKE THIS FURTHER, PLEASE REFUND $200 TO MY PAYPAL ACCOUNT.

BETH

Subj: Re: Notification of a Completed Refund
Date: 7/22/2003 3:44:36 PM Eastern Daylight Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

if you can find me someone selling them for under $120 I will give you a refund you are crazy
----- Original Message -----
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2003 9:42 AM

RYAN,

THIS $100 REFUND WAS FOR THE FEMALE YOU SOLD BUT COULD NOT SHIP ... THANKS.

HOWEVER, I AM ONCE AGAIN LETTING YOU KNOW THAT I AM NOT AT ALL HAPPY WITH THE FACT THAT I PAID YOU $300 FOR A SEXED PAIR OF 2-3 MONTH OLD NOSEY BE PANTHER CHAMELEONS.

WHAT YOU SHIPPED ME ARE 2 MAYBE 2-3 WEEKS OLD CHAMELEONS. I HAVE CONFIRMED THIS WITH A VET AND SEVERAL OTHER LOCAL BREEDERS/STORES. THE CHAMELEONS YOU SHIPPED ARE IMPOSSIBLE TO VERIFY SEX, SINCE THEY ARE SO YOUNG. YOU GUARANTEED ME THAT YOU SHIPPED ME 1M/1F .... THERE IS NO WAY THAT YOU CAN CONFIRM THIS.

BEFORE I GO ANY FURTHER WITH THIS, I WILL ASK YOU 1 MORE TIME TO REFUND ME $200 ON THIS TRANSACTION. PANTHER CHAMS THIS SMALL ARE ONLY WORTH $50/EA IN THE TRADE AND ANY EXPERIENCED BREEDER WOULD NEVER SHIP ANYTHING SO YOUNG.

YOU DID NOT SELL ME WHAT I PAID FOR AND YOU NEVER INFORMED ME THAT WHAT YOU WERE SHIPPING ME WERE NEW BORN CHAMELEONS.

MAYBE YOU DID HAVE AND SELL 2-3 MONTH OLDS FOR THE SAME PRICE. BUT ONCE YOU DO NOT HAVE THEM ANYMORE - YOU CANNOT CONTINUE TO SELLER MUCH YOUNGER CHAMELEONS FOR THE SAME PRICE.

SO AGAIN, PLEASE REFUND $200 ON THIS TRANSACTION, THROUGH PAYPAL.

THANKS
BETH
**************************************************
these are just a few of the emails sent .. there are many, many more. if anyone wants to help ... feel free to contact me.

thanks
beth
 
Date: 7/24/2003 6:55:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time
From: Flldiver
To: [email protected]
RYAN,

THE 2 BABIES HAVE DIED. 1 THIS MORNING AND THE OTHER ABOUT AN HOUR AGO. THE VET STATED WITH THEIR AGE AND BEING SO FRAGILE, THEY WERE COMPLETELY STRESSED FROM BEING SHIPPED. THEY SHOULD HAVE NEVER BEEN SHIPPED SO YOUNG.

PLEASE READ THE FOLLOWING:
http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=13

THE FBI INTERNET FRAUD CASE HAS BEEN FILED.
YOU CAN NO LONGER SHIP ON FEDEX, UNLESS PKGS ARE INSPECTED.
YOUR ACCOUNT WITH PAYPAL HAS BEEN DOCUMENTED WITH THIS PROBLEM.
CASE FILED WITH THE FL STATE ATTY.
WILL BE FILED WITH THE MICHIGAN STATE ATTY.
THE GOVERNING AGENT FOR REPTILES WILL BE CONTACTED IN MI FOR YOU.

THIS DID NOT HAVE TO HAPPEN. YOU ARE A YOUNG KID WHO THINKS HE CAN GET AWAY WITH SCREWING PEOPLE OVER.

GOOD LUCK IN LIFE ...
-----------------
Date: 7/24/2003 4:50:27 PM Eastern Daylight Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

wow the FBi im scared know. look up fraud again dumb Bitch
----- Original Message -----
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 7:14 PM

RYAN,

IT AUTOMATICALLY BECOMES A FELONY WHEN IT INVOLVES INTERNET FRAUD AND SELLING SOMETHING THAT IS MISREPRESENTED. INTERNET FRAUD IS FEDERAL JURISDICTION ...... THAT'S WHY IT WAS REPORTED TO THE FBI.

BUT YOU SEEM TO KNOW IT ALL ..... SO YOU SHOULD KNOW THIS.
 
Ryan Olmack my side

Hi everyone Im glad a potential customer let me know about this forum that was going on. Its great to tell one side of a story and never let the other person tell theres. she never even told me this was being said about me so what kind of a person is she, any way. they are two months old, they all hatch at different sizes as us breeders know, they were 3" long and thats what she got. I even sent her pics of the ones she was getting. they were perfectly healthy when I sold them to her I told her if she wasn't happy then she could of send them back minus shipping, she said "NO WAY, IM NOT SENDING THEM BACK". she has my number why didn't she ever call me? she wouldn't send me the bodys back or even a picture. Id understand this if she didn't have a camera but she sent me a pic of one of her males and said " I JUST TOOK THIS PIC OF MY NOSE BE MALE ISN'T HE BEAUTIFUL". So she does have a digital camera. so I beleive they arn't dead at all. She told me a few days ago before she ticked me off with all the harasement, her words " THEY ARE DOING GREAT EATING AND DRINKING ALL THE TIME". She is only saying there dead because I replyed to her nasty email accordingly. She got what she paid for and more, considering they come form a great bloodline and there older siblings were all blue no red not sky blur a dark awome looking blue that you only thought are in pictures. Im replying because I don't want the reptile world to think im selling 2 week old panther chameleons and sending them through the mail they were 2 months old what all my adds read and 3" long too. Thanks Ryan
 

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wow this is amazing ... a potential customer ? prove you are a liar right from teh beginning .... i am the one who told you to go to this site, proof is in the post above this one. i am one who sent you the link, since i thought you should know that everyone can see exactly the type of person you are.

i have pics of the little babies you sent, on a ruler. their bodies are barely 1". the pic you posted doesn't prove how big the chams you said were 3 months old. they are in no way what you stated in ads you were selling. i pd for these chams on 7/3 and recvd them on 7/17. what an amazing thing - that would put them at about the age the vet said they were 2-3 weeks old.
you shipped me hatchlings. either that or you starved them and they failed to grow.

you NEVER offered to take them back, you never offered a refund. i have copies of every email that was sent both ways
and not once did i state "NO WAY, IM NOT SENDING THEM BACK", or " THEY ARE DOING GREAT EATING AND DRINKING ALL THE TIME". i asked you numerous times to offer a refund - all i got in return was language that is stated in the above post. funny ... you made several phone calls to me and i made several to you... i have the phone records to prove that also, i tried calling to discuss this with you and spoke to your brother who informed me you or your parents were not home. i also have copies of every ad posted and it states on each post date that they were 2-3 months old at the time of placing the ad 3-4" long. with a post dates of 6/28-7/6 if they were 2-3 months old at the time, by the time i recvd them they should have been 3-4 months old.

you claim they are from "GREAT" bloodlines, but you could not produce 1 pic of the parents ... an experienced breeder would have taken pics, so if they sold the parents as you said you did, you would have proof of what they are. please ryan, prove to everyone that what i recvd below are nothing more than hatchlings ..... these pics were taken on 7/17, they day i recvd them.

this is what i recvd ......

index.pl

index.pl
 
Ok Ryan
Lessee here now.....
Looks like a pretty small chameleon to me, just judging by the general size of the pothos the lizard is setting on.
Got any e-mails to credit what you said to her??
You got a camera??? then why not take pics of the animals for sale walking on a ruler[ done this, hatched out many chameleon species]
The size thing kinda throws me off a bit
you say' they all hatch at different sizes as us breeders know,'

I never really noticed any variation on hatchling sizes within clutches or different clutches of the same species
what am I saying here???
cmon ...think
 
Beth, I'm sure you're persuing a full refund includind shipping now right? If you haven't done so yet make sure you get some pics of the dead chams and don't throw them out.
 
I sold her 2 nose be panther chameleons 1 male and 1 female for $300 shipped thats a good deal if you see the classified and see how much everyone wants for them. Im not giving her $200 back according to her that is the only thing that will make her happy. C'mon is $50 for a 2 month old panther really what you guys want me to sell them to her for. she said there dead but weres the pics to prove it? get on here case she the liar not me. Your right John Apple they are around the same size when they hatch but within a week there are small ones and big ones I sent her two month old chameleons im not saying they were 3 month olds. and I never did as she states above. I think she has never received or bought chameleons that were 2 months old and doesn"t realize how fast they get big, and how small they are at 8 weeks old. She never informed me about writing all this bull about me, somone else told me, that saw my ad at chameleon research group classifieds. Ryan
 

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i just have to say thanks to ryan for proving everything i had stated right from the beginning. ryan olmack - i am demanding a full refund of $300. you have my paypal account to refund the money in full.

please state to everyone here if you have any sense of what is right and wrong - what your intentions are in order to make this right.

beth

ritchie luna ... thanks, it does make it much easier. i think the pics speak for themselves.
 
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