RYAN OLMAK ([email protected]) FROM MICHIGAN

[Bobby Douglass]

What is your response to her pics?

 

[FLLDIVER]

here is a copy of all ads ryan posted.

ON CHAMRESEARCH.COM
1. Nose Be panther chameleons $125 07/06/03 05:57 No Detail
these guys are 2 months old they are growing like weeds they eat and drink constantly. I have many of them so you can buy in bulk if you want these are pure breed nose bes no ambanja or any other morph mixed in. email for pics.

ON AOL MSG BOARDS
Jul 06, 2003 15:00 Name: Ryan
Mail me at: [email protected]
Buying, Selling, or Wanted?: selling
nose be panther chameleons these guys are two months old and are growing like weeds they eat everything. $125 each I have a lot of them so if you want to buy in bulk let me know. email for pic.

ON HERPTRADER.COM
Subject: nose be blues ambanjas $160
Ryan67 Posts 2
Registered 28-6-2003
Member Is Offline

posted on 28-6-2003 at 05:01 PM

nose be blues ambanjas $160

I have some 3"-4" Nose Be Blues and Ambanjas for sale. there only $160 plus $25 shipping get them while there still here. two for $300 shipped 3 for $400 shipped. email for pics. Thanks Ryan

Subject: nosy be panthers $125
Ryan67 Posts 2
Registered 28-6-2003

posted on 6-7-2003 at 07:52 PM

nosy be panthers $125

these guys are very well started there ready to ship there two months old and are growing like weeds they eat and drink all the time. I have a bunch of them so if you want to buy in bulk I have them. email for pics
***************************************************
i responded to the ad on herptrader.com 6/28 - if on 6/28 they were 2-3 months old and 3-4" long, then when i recvd them on 7/17 - they should have been more like 3-4 months old and 4+" long. somehow they shrunk during shipping, maybe because of the heat. but they are no where near to 3" not alone 4" long.

flat out ryan you should have been up front if you sold out of the "older" chams you stated you had. you told me you sold all of the other 20 and when i recvd my chams and advised you of how unhappy i was this was your response:

Subj: Re: FEMALE AVAIL ?
Date: 7/17/2003 7:13:23 PM Eastern Daylight Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Sent from the Internet (Details)

HI Beth with there tails they are 3" I sold all of the larger ones that were two months old. they are worth every thing you paid for them they are from a great bloodline and when they mature you will not be disapointed. there are people on the internet that are charging $160 for one month old nose bes you got a great deal. Thanks Ryan.

Subj: Re: FEMALE AVAIL ?
Date: 7/17/2003 7:31:27 PM Eastern Daylight Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Sent from the Internet (Details)

you are the only one that was un happy I sold all 20 and not one customer was unsatisfied you must be a beginer and have no idea

Subj: Re: NEED YOUR RESPONSE
Date: 7/17/2003 9:46:21 PM Eastern Daylight Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Sent from the Internet (Details)

Hi beth 2 months or one month they are still worth the same price im not going to refund a penny it is not false advertising at all. especially since the pic I sent you is of one of the chameleons you received. I can't believe the nerve you have by saying all of this you should be extremely happy about your purchase.

**************************************************

i guess being the experienced breeder you are you will stand by the fact that what you sent me is not what i paid for.
***************************************************
ryan, you are completely not grasping that fact that what you did is WRONG ... i sent you $300 in good faith, expecting to receive what i paid for. you failed to live up to that agreement. the day i opened the box from fedex i should have recvd 3-4" panthers ... and the sexed pair you guaranteed me you could provide. after the fact you tell me i am the idiot for not knowing that females have a pink stripe and males have a white stripe. thats your guarantee on sexing them? when experienced breeders sometimes have to wait up to 5 months ... but hey if you can do that at 2 weeks old - maybe everyone out there has no idea what THEY are talking about and should take a lesson from you.

 

[E2MacPets]

I sold her 2 nose be panther chameleons 1 male and 1 female for $300 shipped thats a good deal if you see the classified and see how much everyone wants for them. Im not giving her $200 back according to her that is the only thing that will make her happy. C'mon is $50 for a 2 month old panther really what you guys want me to sell them to her for. she said there dead but weres the pics to prove it?

How good a deal your asking price was does not enter into this discussion Ryan. It doesn't matter how much of a favor you think you were doing. You have a dissatisfied customer who fully accepted your asking price. She paid for the animals. Yes. No one is arguing that she thought she was getting a good deal and you think you gave her a good deal. The fact is that somewhere in this transaction resulted in you not being able to provide a satisfactory animal based on what was clearly expected by your customer as she was led to believe by your own ads.

You have to make it right.

 

[kingmike]

?????

I just had a question, If I am reading it wrong than someone please correct me, On page 4 Ryan's first post he stated he sent her 3 inch long Cham's..........Then towards the bottom of page 4 he says that she didnt realize how small 8 week old Cham's were and thats why they were so small. If ( please notice the if in this statement ) I read that correctly than Ryan just backed himself up into a rather interesting predicament. If I misunderstood than my sincerest apologies. Thank you

 

[herpetological]

panther's

Plain and simply it comes down to the fact that the specimens advertised were sold out. No substitutions should be made without the customers agreement. Bloodlines considered or not. Bottom line......Ray Goushaw HBR

 

[evansnakes]

Ryan, I have had hundreds of baby panther chameleons over the past 15 years. You are wrong. They are all born very small. Around an inch or smaller. AND THEY ARE 100% NOT SEXABLE. The animals pictured by both of you look to me like they are maybe a week or two old. Maybe a little older if they were runts or if you incubated your eggs too hot and hatched them prematurely. Beth will send you the two lizards back, live, dead, whatever. You then need to refund her money. You falsly advertised your animals. Your emails to her... was it your customer first attitude to call her a bitch and a dumb f__k? What's up with that?

 

[John Apple]

Ryan
As I said before, I hatched out a LOT of chameleons....a lot
and when it comes to mind 6 different species [yup panthers too]
Gotta agree with Evan those are a week old if that. Greed got ya didn't it??

you are lying, its that simple.

Can't refund her money??? what did ya do ?? spend it??

bottom line here Ryan......you used the internet to misrepresent your chameleons, and sold what you DID NOT HAVE.

How old are you, and would the fine folks that you live with like to see a copy of this thread???

don't dawdle boy
make it right

 

[bpc]

Im replying because I don't want the reptile world to think im selling 2 week old panther chameleons and sending them through the mail they were 2 months old what all my adds read and 3" long too. Thanks R

Ryan, dude....., look at the pics man. Even WITH the tails those chams are not 3" long. And you know thats not how you measure chameleons man. Snout to vent is how it's done.
You need to reach an agreement here. This problem is compounded by the fact that the babies are now dead. But, your original problem is that you DID NOT send her what she paid for, which translated is legal jargon is fruad. I know you're young but you can get into big trouble for this man. She has the proof, and you've posted nothing to the contrary (emails, etc.)

If you don't have the cash, at least agree to send her some more chams WHEN they get big enough to be shipped.

 

[FLLDIVER]

Thanks for everyone's support.

Ryan is 20 years old and lives with his parents at home. I would really like to know if his parents knows what he is doing under their roof ..... hey, maybe they don't care, but i would hope they would be greatly concerned.

Ryan has backed himself into a corner and by his own picture has proven the age of what he sent me the pothos leaves are much larger than the little baby, even though the ruler pic proves it all.

I would hope Ryan would just refund my money - then at least he would partly redeem himself by showing good faith on a bad transaction. But, i hope that he NEVER pulls this on anyone again. Although if this post remains up as well as others i have posted - he won't have the chance to scam anyone again - because they will see him for what he is.

Thanks Again,
Beth

 

[Suncoast Herpetological]

Beth

Is it possible to post pics of the deceased animals?

 

[FLLDIVER]

i did take a pic of 2nd one that died, but i did not keep the body. the 1st one , i got rid of before i thought to keep it or take a pic. i was so ticked off at this whole situation, because this didn't have to happen. they were way too small to handle the stress of shipping.

i'm waiting for a new cord for my camera to hook it to the computer to transfer the pic. unfortunately kittens i am fostering thought it was fun to chew thru several of the cords .... i volunteer for a no-kill rescue organization here and kittens tend to always be around. cords can be replaced !! i ordered the cord this past tuesday, just waiting for it to get here.

so i will post the pic as soon as i can ... the other pics i had already transferred to my computer before the cord chewing.

please keep in mind this is not JUST over the chams not making it. that is a secondary incident ... this matter is over the fact that i paid him $300 for a sexed pair of 3 month old chams and received 2 - 2 week old babies, which according to ryan - he guaranteed me the sex because females have pink sides and males have white !! however, i have several pic of the babies the day i received them. i just should have taken pics of both after they died AND kept the bodies. i have the pic of the 1, will post as soon as i can.

beth

 

[spcfitch]

curious

How long did you have them before they died? Just curious.
Jake Fitch

 

[FLLDIVER]

i responded to his 1st ad on 6/28, paid for them on 7/3 he finally shipped them to me on 7/17, 1 was dead when i got up yesterday morning 7/24 and the other died late in the afternoon yesterday.

 

[Ryan67stang]

she got two month old chameleons I told her she can send them back for a full refund minuse shipping what else do you want from me. if you beleive all the excuses she is making for not posting the dead pics then good for you no judge would . sorry to be rude, but she is being rude making all of these false claims. I hope she takes me to court so jude jusy can laugh in her face. here is a pic of the one I posted yesterday on my hand. they are all of three inches. I sell almost all of my chamelons locally and I dont have to make any of you happy. if you don't like what you hear or see dont buy anything from me I'de rather you didn't anyway.

 

[jenn_jeffery]

Well, I can guarentee that from your attitude, you've lost a lot of 'potential' customers.

As for the size of the chameleon in the previous post, you need to buy a ruler before stating the size of them. Holding a ruler up to the screen, yeah, that cham is 3 inches, stv. BUT as anyone can see, the picture isn't 'real life' sized. Well, I suppose it could be if you're a giant and have huge hands....

The cham you're holding in that pic has no business being shipped as small as it is, and if you shipped the ones to Beth that small, shame on you! You as a breeder should know better, and want better for your animals!

 

[FLLDIVER]

RYAN, YOU STILL DO NOT GET IT. the pics of what i received is not what i paid you for. the fact that they died just adds insult to injury.

and you never offered them to be refunded ... i have already previously posted your insulting remarks above this post. they are your emails sent to me ... not one offered any type of compensation in any way.

i will post the pic i have as soon as i get the cord for the camera.

however, the pic i already had are posted for everyone to see. on a ruler, none the less to show their actual size.

i will do what ever i can trust me ryan to prevent or hinder you from selling locally also.

i hope no one sells ryan anything either, it may come back to haunt you in the future.

you have shown your true colors ryan ... i know of at least 1 person who emailed me and he was supposed to buy from you and thanked me for posting this, because he will no longer buy from you.

 

[Casey Hulse]

I sell almost all of my chamelons locally and I dont have to make any of you happy. if you don't like what you hear or see dont buy anything from me I'de rather you didn't anyway.

You may be interested to note that a lot of "local" people are probably reading this. Casey, from MICHIGAN.

 

[FLLDIVER]

In a message dated 7/25/2003 4:35:23 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [email protected] writes:

i am glad i looked at these ads,
last night i got a money order to buy a nosy be panther from ryan olmack,
i was on my way to the post office to ship it , untill i saw this ad.
your a life saver , thank you for the info!!

(sorry about your situation)

BRET IS LOOKING FOR A REPUTABLE BREEDER ... since his purchase with ryan is now not going through ...
***********************************************
i'm sure bret would appreciate anyone that an assist him in his search.
************************************************
Subj: Re: <no subject>
Date: 7/25/2003 5:29:55 PM Eastern Daylight Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Sent from the Internet (Details)

I am looking for a juvenile male nosy be blue, i am ready to buy one today.
Do you know any reputable breeders??

bret

 

[John Apple]

Yup a lot of us 'locals' are reading this
Hey Ryan....guess what?....
cmon you chameleon breeder you.....
go on guess.....
give up???
well here goes.
I got your name and I got a big freakin mouth, hell man go ask Robert Carr.
What you did was wrong
Beth's words
i responded to his 1st ad on 6/28, paid for them on 7/3 he finally shipped them to me on 7/17, 1 was dead when i got up yesterday morning 7/24 and the other died late in the afternoon yesterday.
I am guessing here, most likely right , us' breeders' know this right Ryan???
They started hatching on the28 to the 3rd
Ya got your money on the 3rd [this is after you said these hatchlings were 2-3 months old]
the babies had to grow a couple of weeks so you could 'move' them, mind you now Beth allready paid for 2-3 month old panthers.Still with me here Ryan??
So now you have had her money for 2 weeks and you ship her 2 week old chameleons, does that about sound right Ryan??
Thought so, I am sure the role played out above is very close to the actual happening
There are a lot of fellow loudmouths in Michigan much like my self[probably not as mean or ugly as me] so Bryan are ya gonna fix this???
word to the wise [ well to you anyhow Bryan]
make this right

 

[Ryan67stang]

I didn't ship them out untill 7/16 because she was waiting to see if she wanted to buy another female from my freind here in michigan that was from another bloodline. she did but he had run out here is her email:

----- Original Message -----
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Sent: Monday, July 14 , 2003 8:08 PM
Subject: Fwd: nosey be


RYAN,

SORRY I HAVEN'T BEEN BACK TO YOU I HAVE BEEN REALLY SICK.
WHAT IS THE STATUS OF OBTAINING TEH OTHER FEMALE

THANKS
BETH

then I told her he sold them ans I shiped her 2 month old chameleons july 16