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Bad Guy Sellers Beware Dick Goergen Alden NY

Rockabirdie

Rockabirdie

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Mr Goergen purchased some animals from me on 11/21/2015. I shipped on 11/24/2015. I received notification from paypal today of a chargeback. He is claiming He never purchased the items. He is known in the business, and they were sent to his home address.
 

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What did you ship him? Did Dick correspond with you at all before the paypal charge back? I am amazed that paypal can do a charge back at this late date. Dick has been in the reptile industry forever. I know from unwarranted and dishonest charge backs that paypal can be very difficult to deal with. Let us know what happens.
 
Have you notified Mr. Goergen of this thread? I'd like to see what his reason for the charge back is. Hopefully he comes here and paticipates.
 
This sort of stuff is becoming all to common simply because PayPal makes it too easy for people to "try it on"
Makes me wonder whether we should all go back to the good old days of sending money orders or bank checks etc
Sorry you got this Tommy, you a good guy who has a good rep and nobody needs this unwarranted aggro
How can he claim he never purchased them?
You state he said they arrived fine, nobody would say that if they had not purchased something??
Obviously he received them as evinced by both the telephone confirmation and Fedex tracking info.
What other email chain or communications do you have on this matter?
Anything you can bring here will help
 
Maybe I'm just getting way too dense in my old age, but this whole thing just doesn't make any sense to me.

First off, no one can just TAKE money out of someone else's PayPal account. The owner of the account has to explicitly initiate the transfer of funds.

Secondly, when a payment is made via PayPal both the payer and the payee get an email notice about it when that funds transfer takes place. That SHOULD have been before the package was shipped. If this was not expected, I would think the payer would raise a question about it right then and there.

Thirdly, if a person receives a package they were not expecting nor wanted, much less aware that they paid for it out of their PayPal account, especially a package quite likely marked as being a live animal shipment, the receiver could have just marked the box as "REFUSED" and had it returned to the sender at no cost to them.

Fourthly, going on two and a half months after the shipment was sent and received, NOW this issue gets raised with PayPal? What happened between the date of receipt and now that slowed down the thought processes of the recipient to take this long to come to the conclusion that they never ordered something that they received over two months ago? Or did they just FORGET that they actually received the package?

Like I said, this all just doesn't make any sense to me and there must be a whole lot more pieces missing to this puzzle than are being shown here.

About the only thing that would make sense to me, outside of outright fraud on the part of the purchaser, is if someone else in the household of the purchaser used that PayPal account unauthorized, received the package without letting anyone else being aware of it, and no one else in the household noticed some new animals in the household. But then there is the matter of the phone call acknowledgment of receipt.

Speaking of that phone call, is there hard copy record of that incoming phone number that can be matched with Dick Goergen? That, quite likely, is going to be the "smoking gun" here.
 
WebSlave said:
Maybe I'm just getting way too dense in my old age, but this whole thing just doesn't make any sense to me.

First off, no one can just TAKE money out of someone else's PayPal account. The owner of the account has to explicitly initiate the transfer of funds.

Secondly, when a payment is made via PayPal both the payer and the payee get an email notice about it when that funds transfer takes place. That SHOULD have been before the package was shipped. If this was not expected, I would think the payer would raise a question about it right then and there.

Thirdly, if a person receives a package they were not expecting nor wanted, much less aware that they paid for it out of their PayPal account, especially a package quite likely marked as being a live animal shipment, the receiver could have just marked the box as "REFUSED" and had it returned to the sender at no cost to them.

Fourthly, going on two and a half months after the shipment was sent and received, NOW this issue gets raised with PayPal? What happened between the date of receipt and now that slowed down the thought processes of the recipient to take this long to come to the conclusion that they never ordered something that they received over two months ago? Or did they just FORGET that they actually received the package?

Like I said, this all just doesn't make any sense to me and there must be a whole lot more pieces missing to this puzzle than are being shown here.

About the only thing that would make sense to me, outside of outright fraud on the part of the purchaser, is if someone else in the household of the purchaser used that PayPal account unauthorized, received the package without letting anyone else being aware of it, and no one else in the household noticed some new animals in the household. But then there is the matter of the phone call acknowledgment of receipt.

Speaking of that phone call, is there hard copy record of that incoming phone number that can be matched with Dick Goergen? That, quite likely, is going to be the "smoking gun" here.
Click to expand...

Well, senility doesn't seem to be setting in. ;)
Very well put.

....
 
Maybe they died? Now he's trying to recover his losses, knowing too much time has passed to work things out with the op. That's my guess atm.:eek:
 
Paypal should side with the OP, but that doesn't mean that the CC company will. This is ridiculous, considering that the OP says that Mr. Goergen called him the day he took possession of the animals from the shipping company. That, to me, says that Mr. Goergen is a thief. Especially since he has waited 70+ days to claim it wasn't him that purchased the animals... That makes me think he planned the whole thing.
 
JButera said:
Maybe they died? Now he's trying to recover his losses, knowing too much time has passed to work things out with the op. That's my guess atm.:eek:
Click to expand...

That thought crossed my mind as well.
Even if it comes about, that the critters passed away and is the reason for the charge back, my opinion would be that it makes the act no better than if it were a scammer doing so immediately after receiving animals.
That said ...
At this moment, all anyone can do is speculate. Something I, myself, would rather not do (except in my own head lol). Some facts, evidence, etc. is sorely needed.
Has anyone notified Mr. Goergen of this thread?
It would be very interesting to see what he has to say about why he initiated a charge back (with what appears to be a falsehood).

....
 
This type of behavior sounds like theft, or fraud. Does PayPal ban people? They seem to have some rules for sellers; are there repercussions for buyers who try to cheat the system like this?

I wish the seller good luck and I hope you don't lose the money.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Rockabirdie said:
I called Paypal this morning. I have seller protection. Since I sent proof that I sent the package and it was received, they gave me back the funds. They can deal with the credit card company.
Click to expand...

Good to know! Thank you for the update, I have been checking back to see if there was any news and I am sure others have as well! What an odd, disheartening situation to find oneself in! I am glad you are covered!
~Beau
 
Congratulations on getting your money back Thomas! It's great to see that the situation was resolved rather quickly in your favor. Still sucks you had to deal with this mess but I'm sure it couldn't have been much worse. Sometimes these situations can really get dragged out before reaching a resolution, wasting time, unnecessary stress, just a real PITA!!
 
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